What if Paneuropean Union have been formed

[Berus]

How would modern Europe look today ? Would there be better relationship with the moslimic countries ? Would Europe be more religious ?

[Meerkat92]

Originally Posted by Berus

How would modern Europe look today ? Would there be better relationship with the moslimic countries ? Would Europe be more religious ?

Not really sure what you mean. Irreligion tends to increase as the standard of living in an area does. If you have a steady food supply, a roof over your head, a good-paying job, and a fair amount of leisure time, you tend to stop wishing for life to end so you can play in the sky forever with God.

[Goldwater64]

Originally Posted by Berus

How would modern Europe look today ? Would there be better relationship with the moslimic countries ? Would Europe be more religious ?

Are you referring to a specific "Paneuropean Union" that never came to pass, or just the concept in general? A big part of it is when/why/how it comes to be.

I doubt it'd be any more religious. And if the "Fallout" games are anything to go by, such a union will invade the middle-east in 2052 to secure a steady flow of oil

[Berus]

Well the concept of Paneuropa. Also Wouldnt they try to outlaw Atheism ?

[Meerkat92]

Originally Posted by Berus

Well the concept of Paneuropa. Also Wouldnt they try to outlaw Atheism ?

Why? What kind of government is this "Paneuropa"?

[Polish Eagle]

Originally Posted by Berus

Well the concept of Paneuropa. Also Wouldnt they try to outlaw Atheism ?

Why? Most governments in Europe are openly secular and even to a degree hostile to religious authorities. Poland is the only exception to this rule that comes to mind. So unless Poland goes bat-shit crazy, embarks on a vast armaments program, and conquers Europe, it's far more likely that religious extremism would be outlawed.

Also, what's Paneuropa? The European Union doesn't fit the bill of what you're describing. Can you provide a link to a Wikipedia page on Paneuropa or something?

[LordKalvan]

The only kind of "Pan-Europa" which might have formed in the past (and not easily at that) would be limited to the original 6 countries of the Common Market. The problem is "when" it might have coalesced in a coherent political entity: the best time probably was in the late 50s-early 60s. Maybe a possible POD is France avoiding the Algerian mess, and so avoiding De Gaulle and a presidential republic.

At any time it is formed - and by whichever countries - there is no way a united Europe gets to pass laws banning atheism. Why should they? It would be the most stupid and a-historical idea which anyone might possibly promote in Europe.

[Color-Copycat]

Originally Posted by Berus

Also Wouldnt they try to outlaw Atheism ?

No. I don't see Western democracies denying freedom to practice/not practice religion to their citizens. Not by this stage of the 20th century.

[ctesiphon]

I think he means this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paneuropean_Union

The stated goal of the organisation is the unity of a Christian Europe, free of "nihilism, atheism and immoral consumerism".

[Xgentis]

Originally Posted by ctesiphon

I think he means this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paneuropean_Union

Glad it was never popullar. Seems not democratic at all.

[The Ubbergeek]

I see a mod coming soon then?

[ctesiphon]

Originally Posted by Xgentis

Glad it was never popullar. Seems not democratic at all.

And very boring. Nihilism is a value worth fighting for.

[freivolk]

Originally Posted by Xgentis

Glad it was never popullar. Seems not democratic at all.

Actually it was very popular after WWII. Most Christian-democratic partys in Western Europe were influenced by it. Naturally it was very unpopular with Nazis and Communists. Especially Hitler hated the movement.

[miguelrj]

Originally Posted by Polish Eagle

Why? Most governments in Europe are openly secular and even to a degree hostile to religious authorities. Poland is the only exception to this rule that comes to mind.

You're obviously forgetting a certain 0.44 km2 absolute sacerdotal-monarchical theocracy.

[Berus]

I though that it could maybe led to a "Religion dominated Europe", where the church etc. is over everything. However they say that they want a democratic europe and better relationships with other religions like Islam.


However would this Union be possible in timeline in which Austria-Hungary survived and reformed with necessary PODs.
The founder of the Paneuropean Union was Richard Nikolaus von Coudenhove-Kalergi, who was Austrian. Otto Habsburg also supported Paneuropa, so when his Father Karl dies and Otto becames the Emperor of Austria-Hungary, would it be possible to found the Paneuropean Union ?
Ór would atleast Austria-Hungary became a rather theocratic Monarchy ?

Which however wouldnt be good.

[sirharryflashman]

i do not think there is much chance of any long lasting unification of europe in to single state.the cultural diferences between nations are simply way to big.
if anything one has to look at more and more separatist in many european countries. scots basques north italians flemish etc...if anything one can expect new countries coming in to being .
as to the austria hungary ...there was no way austria hungary could survive the presure was way too big
the slavic minorities wanted at very least reform while germans oposed it.
any unification headed or supported by habsburks was a no no in eastern europe.
as to the union if it did happend that it would have to be strongly christian because it was the only thing the nations shared
it would then depend on the kind of christianity as to the relations to islam
if the christianity was like today i do not think there would be much diference but if the church was more hardline then the relations would be much diferent especially in the with the ongoing persecution of christians in uslim countries.

[The Ubbergeek]

Originally Posted by sirharryflashman

i do not think there is much chance of any long lasting unification of europe in to single state.the cultural diferences between nations are simply way to big.
if anything one has to look at more and more separatist in many european countries. scots basques north italians flemish etc...if anything one can expect new countries coming in to being .
as to the austria hungary ...there was no way austria hungary could survive the presure was way too big
the slavic minorities wanted at very least reform while germans oposed it.
any unification headed or supported by habsburks was a no no in eastern europe.
as to the union if it did happend that it would have to be strongly christian because it was the only thing the nations shared
it would then depend on the kind of christianity as to the relations to islam
if the christianity was like today i do not think there would be much diference but if the church was more hardline then the relations would be much diferent especially in the with the ongoing persecution of christians in uslim countries.

It may be dystopîc. A Franco-like rightwing theo-dictature, harsh on jews, muslims, atheists, commies, etc...

[Meerkat92]

Originally Posted by The Ubbergeek

It may be dystopîc. A Franco-like rightwing theo-dictature, harsh on jews, muslims, atheists, commies, etc...

Actually, the wiki says that it the movement welcomes Jews and Muslims, saying that they share heritage. It's really only atheists that they dislike. And capitalists, judging by their mention of "immoral consumerism".

[The Ubbergeek]

Originally Posted by Meerkat92

Actually, the wiki says that it the movement welcomes Jews and Muslims, saying that they share heritage. It's really only atheists that they dislike. And capitalists, judging by their mention of "immoral consumerism".

Still have the making of a rightwing theodictature or autocracy.

[MerryPrankster]

Originally Posted by The Ubbergeek

Still have the making of a rightwing theodictature or autocracy.

It could easily be a left-wing theocracy, given the complaints about consumerism.

(Yes, fascism is anti-capitalist too, but post-WWII, most anti-captalists were left-wing.)

There's also the "social responsibility" part too.