For The Sons of Carthage! (A TL)

[CandyDragon]

For The Sons of Carthage: A Victorious Carthage TL


A/N: The first time I tried this, it went largely unnoticed, because I had made it neither pretty nor interesting. So here is my second try.

PoD: Carthaginian forces are not ambushed by Timoleon of Corinth, and instead, successfully defeat Syracusan forces, leading to an end to the Second Sicilian War that was more favorable to Carthage, and more Carthaginian reliance on Punic, rather than mercenary troops.

Note: For no reason other than the obvious, years will be reckoned in standard AD/BC terms, and names of geographic places, as well as people, will be referred to by the most common Anglicization.
Note: For this TL, unlike my other one, and the previous incarnation of this, I will use a mix of “historical texts” and narrative, so to make it slightly more interesting.

“Do we have any information on what’s across that river?” Hasdrubal asked Salicar, the commander of his cavalry. Knowledge of what would be across that river would be of the most vital importance for the Carthaginians, it seemed Hasdrubal had realized. A fortunate thing too- Salicar didn’t know how much longer he could let them blunder around in Sicily, but he also didn’t want to displease his powerful commander. “Do we?” Hasdrubal repeated, shocking Salicar out of his daze.

[Later Marble Bust of Hasdrubal]

“No, sire,” Salicar said, nodding his head deeply as Hasdrubal spoke.

“Then I want you to take the cavalry across the river, see what you can see, and harass the enemy if you see any. Carthage will be made mighty, and Carthaginian traders shall roam throughout all the lands. Syracuse must be destroyed!” Hasdrubal ranted. He really did think himself charismatic, and perhaps he was. But he was not a great tactician, and Salicar didn’t want to get killed. With luck, should any trouble arise, the Carthaginians would hold. The Sacred Band was there- there would be no need to fear. And Salicar knew he would do his damndest to save the army. To save himself.

Marshalling his cavalry, Salicar cried out, “Across the river! With me, Numidians, with me, chariots! For Carthage!” The cavalry poured across the river, and scouts separated. Only minutes after the last scout left, some returned, bearing news of a large cavalry force attacking.

“Baal protect us all,” Salicar muttered, and sent news back to Hasdrubal of the oncoming cavalry force, and hoped that the infantry would return to the other side of the river. “Attack!” he cried out, as the Numidians began hurling their javelins at the lightly armored Greek cavalry. The chariots, with Salicar, quickly began to flank, in order to split the Greeks in two between charging towards the Numidians, and charging towards the chariots.

Salicar snuck a glance backwards as the driver of his chariot forced the horses to swerve. The infantry was returning to the opposite bank, and he could see the Greek infantry marching forwards. He would just have to delay a few seconds more-

A missed Numidian javelin caught him in the hip. “Cross the river, damnit!” he cried out in pain, as the jolts from the chariot drove the javelin in deeper. “Cross the bloody river!” Turning, the chariots, followed by the Numidians, fled across the river, outpacing the Greeks, and retreated- but not across the river. The cavalry moved away from the banks of the river- of course! Through the haze of pain, Salicar grinned. “Keep distracting their cavalry! Feign retreat!” he roared, and for once, the chariots heard him. “Be prepared to charge into the infantry” he groaned, and sank into unconsciousness.
…
[Sacred Band Soldier, later idealized image]

Gisgo held his spear resolutely at his side as the Greeks marched into the river. If he looked hard enough, he could see Timoleon, he was sure, just across the river, looking cursed bothered. He nearly laughed, but maintained his composure. The Sacred Band had to set an example for the rest of the army, and by the gods he would. He heard Hasdrubal’s orders to advance down the bank to meet the Greeks as they attempted to climb out of the river, and calmly advanced, lowering his spear. From his position at the far right of the line, he could see most of the battle that was about to happen.

A cold chill ran through his body, as the Greeks began to charge forward, in an attempt to break Carthaginian will preemptively. The two shield walls collided, the Greek phalanx outnumbered slightly by the Carthaginians. As his spear screeched through a Greek’s armor, and into his gut, Gisgo felt the hot fury of battle strike him, but he kept his discipline. Across the line, he saw the less well trained troops losing theirs, and wildly hack at the dismayed Greeks. The line was holding- the line was holding, and rain began to pour down. The Greeks holding their position against the cavalry at the far end of the river looked confused, as if they couldn’t see.

Then he heard the Numidian cavalry returning. They must have taken advantage of the rain, and subsequent lack of visibility to destroy the Greek reserves, and now were returning. Gisgo roared with delight as the Numidians crashed into the rear of the Greek line, shattering it. He saw Timoleon fall before one of his shield brothers, and he let himself slip into a battle rage, and countless Greeks fell before his sword, his spear long since broken, and his back unbowed. Carthage was victorious!


Battle of the Crimissus

[A later engraving of the battle]

In the year 341 BC, Carthaginian forces once again invaded the lands of the other predominant power on the island of Sicily, Syracuse. Having unsuccessfully prosecuted a similar conflict twenty-two years earlier, Carthage by this point urged to revenge herself against the Greeks.

At the battle of the Crimissus, Carthaginian forces clashed decisively against the forces of Syracuse, commanded by the Corinthian Timoleon. According to most of the old accounts, Timoleon attempted to draw the Carthaginian forces into an ambush while they were crossing the river, but that plan was thrown awry when Carthaginian chariots, as well as light, javelin-armed Numidian auxiliaries skirmished with the cavalry, crossing the river to join battle more effectively.

[Numidians]

By the time the Greek infantry had arrived, the Carthaginian infantry was secure on the opposite bank of the river, having abandoned the crossing. According to sources of the time, the Carthaginians had thirty thousand men arrayed against twenty thousand of Syracuse. Taking a risk, Timoleon split his forces, sending the bulk of his army to cross the river, assuming that his steadfast Greek troops would carve their way through the Carthaginian line, while leaving a portion behind to guard against attacks by the looming Carthaginian cavalry, who had driven off the Syracusan cavalry forces, and now lurked around his flanks.

Reportedly, rain began to fall at this time, obscuring both of the armies’ views equally as the Greeks ran onto Carthaginian spears. Most crucially, the troops guarding Timoleon’s crossing were blinded by the falling rain, which left them unprepared for a sudden charge by Carthaginian cavalry.

Shattered, they began to flee, as the Carthaginian cavalry dashed across the river, where they met with the remainders of the main body of Greek troops. Surrounded, and increasingly weary, Greek troops fought, reportedly, and to their credit, to the last man. The Sacred Band, the elite heavy infantry of Carthage, were said to have distinguished themselves greatly, and were awarded with a monument upon the spot where Timoleon fell.


Hasdrubal, who commanded these forces, sent the finest of the Greek armor back to Carthage, to show to the Council of Elders, and continued to march, besieging Syracuse herself within the week’s end.
Unable to request any further aid from Corinth, and unwilling to sue for peace, Syracuse held out for almost two months.
…

Gisgo growled quietly, as quietly as he could, as yet another of the Syracusan fell before him. They had been pouring out of the walls, from what he could see, nearly five thousand of them, arraying in the proper lines of battle, and he was prepared to fight. The Carthaginians drew up their lines in response, and oh, the poetry of the moment, as the two hosts silently watched each other from across the relatively thin strip of land, and Gisgo, once more, felt that calm before a storm.

Then the Greeks had advanced, pressing forward until the two lines collided, shield grinding and grating against shield, many spears broken in the initial push, the crush of men dying everywhere. In the center, Gisgo could see that the battle did not go so well- the weaker auxiliaries were there, and the thin array of the Greek line proved more than enough to drive them nearly over the edge. Gisgo realized, with shock, that per usual, the day rested on the Sacred Band. It was their duty, he realized, to cut through the foe, and be the anchor upon which the battle lines rested.

More Greeks than Carthaginians fell in the ensuing moments, as Gisgo cut down a Greek, as the left side of the Greek line, and the right side of the Carthaginian line shifted, the Greeks falling back, and the Carthaginians advancing. Gisgo, in these moments, called for, if memory served him well, an attack, to save the battle in the center, and wrap around the flank of the Greek center, since their left had crumbled.

The Sacred Band came roaring and hooting to the aid of the middle of the line, shattering the Greeks, as, in the distance, the Numidians were cutting down many of the fleeing foes, their short swords proving more than effective enough to kill a routing enemy. It was, Gisgo decided, a sweet and seemly thing to die for one’s country, as these Greeks were doing. Not that it was graceful, but it was seemly. It was right that they should die to defend their homes- they were honorable foes. Not that it would help them any.

Soon, his unit was given the orders by Hasdrubal to draw up the ladders, that an assault might be made. Pleased to hear that the Sacred Band would be first to ascend them, and first to cut a swathe through the foes, Gisgo beat his sword against his shield, then shouldering his spear, as he prepared to ascend the walls. Few Greeks must be left within those walls, he realized. Nearly five thousand had been captured or killed, and battle would be quick.

The ladders were carried slowly to the walls, largely uncontested due to a Greek lack of missile troops, while citizens and troops from below threw stones. Many of these were not effective against his armor, but Gisgo received a deep graze along his back from one stone, and he saw three or four of the Sacred Band fall of the ladders, knocking several others to their death too. He recognized some of those men- one was his cousin. He sighed- how disgraceful that a stone should kill him.

He was fifth up to the walls, as his shield brothers had cut a way through to ascend before, and the citizens, reduced to mob tactics, and the few remaining Greek troops were slowly being pushed out, some falling off the walls, some falling to the sword. Soon more troops arrived for the Carthaginians, largely well-armed Libyans, who whooped and hollered their battle joy, cutting down even more Greeks. The gates were opened, and all of the army but the cavalry passed in, massing just in front of the gates.

Then, more Syracusan hoplites showed up, blockading the alleys that were the Carthaginians’ path towards the citadel. Gisgo realized, with a sinking heart, that battle would be long and bloody, but soon roused himself once more into battle’s frenzy. Breaking the will of the hoplites, he soon learned, would be a long a bloody process.

Worse for wear, several hours later, Gisgo stumbled through the streets, the populace hiding in their houses, afraid to even throw window tiles in terror of the imposing Sacred Band, and the savage looking Libyans. Night had gathered Syracuse in its shadows by the time that Hasdrubal gave the orders to stop the painful march. Gisgo groaned as he settled into his pallet, his battered and bloody body aided none by the roughness of his fine bedding.


Third Siege of Syracuse:

Syracuse was an extremely fortified city for those times, well prepared by Dionysius the Elder in the years before. However, with the invading army, Carthage had made allowance for major sieges, and quickly readied siege engines once the walls of Syracuse were reached.

Soon one major sortie by Syracusan forces was repelled, with heavy casualties to both sides, ladders, the simplest of siege equipment were brought to the walls. To carve a path up to the wall, Hasdrubal sent all three thousand Sacred Band onto the walls first, followed by the heaviest of the Libyan infantry.

These forces successfully opened the walls to further Carthaginian encroachment, and after several hours of brutal fighting, Syracusan forces were forced back into the city. Hasdrubal’s troops, by this point exhausted, made a final effort to reach the citadel, but halted before night fell.

Carthaginian forces, over the next week, further prepared for a siege, occupying the city, and ransacking farms in the nearby countryside. However, such preparation was not needed, as after a further day, a traitor was convinced to open the gates of the citadel.
In the middle of the night, Carthaginian troops poured through the gate, and overwhelmed Syracusan resistance, putting Syracuse to the swords, and adding it to the empire of Carthage.

And so the Greco-Punic wars came to an end, an overwhelming Carthaginian victory over their greatest foe so far. The territory of Syracuse was soon amalgamated into the Carthaginian Empire, and all its manifold treasures buried away within the city itself, whilst Hasdrubal returned to Carthage, greeted with highest accolades and honors available.
[Captured Greek Armor]

Interwar Period:

During this time, in 337 BC, Carthage sent envoys to the other major Western Mediterranean states, including the Greek colony of Massilia, and to the Roman Republic, who had defeated their central Italian rivals, the Samnites, in the same year that Carthage defeated Syracuse.

[Scene from a recreation of a Roman vase depicting the Samnite Wars]

However, the Romans had not as decisively defeated the Samnites, and the Romans, in return for Carthaginian aid in flushing out the remaining hill people, promised a pact of alliance, an addition to their previous treaty of 348 BC, which guaranteed sovereign rights to Carthage and Rome in matters of the other’s territory.

This pact of alliance promised troops to the other ally if they should fall under attack, and promised aid in prosecuting wars that were not against each other’s interests.
This treaty is considered to be the event that most saved Rome from defeat and led it to unimaginable glory under Carthaginian dominance.

Massilia also joined this alliance later in the same year, serving as a less powerful, though still potent, addition to the western Mediterranean coalition. It is not known to what extent Massiliotes disapproved of the conquering of a city of their fellow Greeks, though they seemingly joined the alliance willingly.

The Macedonian Empire

In 336, king Philip II was nearly slain by the captain of his guards, who was captured, and interrogated, revealing Philip's own son, "Alexandros," and his fourth wife, Olympias. The three were killed for their perfidy, as Philip, enraged at the actions of his own, began to consider greater and further reaching conquests...

[CandyDragon]

:shrug: Bump...

[AlexG]

megusta.

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by AlexG

megusta.

Thank you kindly.

[flo]

Very nice! Subscribed...

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by flo

Very nice! Subscribed...

Thank you! There will probably be a new update by I'd say Sunday at the very latest.

[Monopolist]

Excellent. Despite my never making one, it's great to see pre-Punic Wars Carthage TLs - an underrated field if there is one. Good luck.

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by Monopolist

Excellent. Despite my never making one, it's great to see pre-Punic Wars Carthage TLs - an underrated field if there is one. Good luck.

Thank you! I will do my best to make this one worthy of being one of the few in its field.

[Muwatalli']

Good and promising timeline. Subscribed.

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by Muwatalli'

Good and promising timeline. Subscribed.

Thank you, I will attempt to make it live up to expectations.

[CandyDragon]

A/N: Wow, I had a lot of free time today, so I have a quick update.


Here we go, taking a little more of a Macedonian view for a bit. This TL will not just deal with Carthage, and in fact, I’m thinking of ways to make things fall apart for about every important civilization . But first, the Later Conquests of King Philip II of Macedon. Gisgo won’t appear in this update, but he still is going to be important. If you want ballpark ages for the characters, Gisgo is about 16 at the Battle of the Crimissus, and Salicar is about 24.


Philip II of Macedon:
By 336, and the year of the attempted assassination, Macedon controlled most of mainland Greece, as well as having one of the most effective armies in the world. At that time, Philip II, rather than attack the stagnating Persian state, decided to test his arms against barbarians on his northern border, and marching with a host of 40,000 men, advanced to the River Danube, known to Philip as the Okeanos, where he set camp.

[Philip’s Empire at the time of the assassination attempt]

“For nearly a year, Philip remained in Thrace, and in this time, defeated many foes, whereupon he returned to Macedon, where Alexander of Epirus occupied as regent the held lands of Macedon, and Philip with great warmth greeted his comrade and son in law, and bade him sit, that Philip might tell him of his plans,”
-Timaios of Tauromenion
[Timaios was a Greek historian, born in Sicily in roughly 345 BC, who fled the Carthaginian conquest of Syracuse, coming to Epirus after his education in Corinth, where Alexander of Epirus greeted him with favor. He was known for his pro-Greek stance, and his strong opposition towards friendship with the Carthaginians.]

After Philip consulted with Alexander, it was decided that Alexander would lead a campaign in Italy, in order to save the Greeks there, which had called for Macedonian aid due to greater incursions by the Lucani. At this time also, Philip called forth his “Ionian Expedition,” a force of only about fifteen thousand men who Philip lead in a brief tour of conquest in the Ionian islands, that he might “Save them from the depredations of the Mede,” (Timaios)

Alexander, upon arriving in Italy, took his army, and immediately defeated a moderately large Lucani attack, after which he was greeted with great acclaim by the inhabitants of Tarentum, which the Lucani attack was aimed at. After this, Alexander proceeded to “entreat the Greeks to join him” (Timaios) which was likely actually a process of conquest. After about 333 BC, there is little mention of unrest in the Megale Hellas portions of Southern Italy, as it seemed by then the Greeks there were content with being under the security of the Macedonians, due to the threat of the rising “Western Mediterranean Coalition” as it is often referred to nowadays, of Carthage, Rome, and the lesser partner, the Greek colony of Massilia.

However, after quickly subjugating the Italian Greeks, Alexander once more marched upon the Lucani. At the Battle of Paestum (a prominent Lucanian city) Alexander lead nearly thirty thousand Macedonian and Epirote troops in an attempt to dominate the Lucani forever.

Alexander provided a dominant role in the battle, with his “Companions” a particular type of shock cavalry bodyguard adopted from Macedon. The initial approach for the Macedonians was from the south, while the Lucani were already prepared for battle at the edge of a long hill.

Refusing to attack their superior position, even with his sarissa-armed phalanxes, Alexander lost the initiative. After several hours of waiting, a group of Lucani reinforcements had silently arrived, and waited for the main body of troops to distract Alexander to make their move. Slowly, the Lucani on the hill marched down, and Alexander commanded his pikes to attack, when he realized, too late, that the Lucani were ready to outflank him. Summoning his bodyguard, he charged into the mass of outflanking troops, buying time for his men to defeat the main Lucani body.
“In a most heroic fashion, the great Alexander- few worthy of his name, if any, for such a man so gifted in prowess at arms, held off the barbarian attack, that his troops could defeat the barbarians more excellently. His spear was like the lance of Achilles, his helm glowed like the sun. He was struck thrice by the Lucani in the entire time he fought, yet killed, it is said, half the army. In the time that his troops arrived, fearing that their beloved leader be lost, the enemy was cut down, and all the great phalanxes of the Macedonians had to do was cut down the rest of the barbarians,” (Timaios)
Even ignoring the obvious attempt by Timaios to ingratiate himself with his patron, it his apparent that the only action which saved that battle was Alexander’s quick thinking. And that battle proved enough for the war, as soon afterwards, the Lucani came to an agreement with Alexander, and became an Epirote client state- in all but name, the client state of a Macedonian client state, even though both Macedonians and Epirotes would fight that designation vociferously.

By 330, Macedon was stronger than she ever had been. She had the greatest King the world had ever seen, at least in Macedonian eyes. It was at that time, with Macedonian influence in Thrace and Italy on the rise, that Philip decided, at the age of 52, to return to his plans to invade Persia, but on a more limited scale, designed to strengthen Macedonian strength in Ionia without sending Macedonian troops into foreign lands.

[Idealized statue of Philip]

In 329, Philip led an army of fifty seven thousand, including forty thousand Epirotes and Macedonians, with numerous Greek auxiliaries, over the Hellespont, in a scene in many ways reminiscent of Xerxes reverse crossing. The great army crossing a mighty pontoon bridge, made of a great fleet. However, the fleet left the strait shortly afterwards, and defeated the Persian fleet, which was already in shambles, shortly afterwards.

Philip proceeded to “liberate” the Ionian cities, giving them Macedonian governors, and explaining to them that they were a part of the Corinthian League, and thusly under the control of Philip, to be dealt with at his leisure. Philip had barely rested a week in Ionia, however, before he began remarshalling his forces, leaving a garrison of altogether about three thousand men for Ionia, and telling his fleet to begin ferrying over reinforcements to garrison Ionia.
Darius, the fifty-one year old king of Persia, soon approached the Macedonian army with a great host, estimated at one hundred thousand men. Darius had spent much of his reign attempting to curb the power of the satraps, largely for naught, as decentralization seemed to be an eternal bane of the Persians. He simply did not have the personal charisma, or the experience, to govern such an unwieldy, massive empire as that of the Persians. And so, at that time, battle was joined. Being outnumbered nearly two to one, Philip had few qualms about engaging the Persian army at night.

Relatively close to the city of Ikonion, the two forces engaged, Philip having long since left Ionia, and marched into Lydia and Phrygia. At night, Macedonian forces awoke quietly, and began to roar battle cries, as Darius’ men slept. As they were awoken, the Macedonian cavalry, though quantitatively inferior to the Persian cavalry, began to harass the marshalling soldiers. After being driven off by the Persian cavalry and chariots, the cavalry sped into the distance, hovering around the flanks of the Persian army, leading Darius, a barely competent commander, no option but to deploy his own cavalry to counter them, while his infantry advanced unsupported. This would seem like an advantage for the Persians, as their infantry was more numerous, but cavalry was the Persian army’s strength- by negating it, Philip had played towards his own strengths, forcing the ill armored and armed Persian levies to confront the great pikes of his own soldiers.

The Persians were massacred, as nearly forty thousand of their infantry was said to die in the ensuing chaos, as Philip himself, with the cavalry, began to harass the fleeing Persian cavalry, while the light, sword-armed troops of the Macedonians- roughly two thousand Thracians- hunted down the fleeing Persians, killing massive quantities of them. It is said the Philip himself hunted down Darius, killing him with his own spear, and taking his chariot as proof, but this is disputed.

The casualties of the battle were considerable for the Persians, but the Macedonians also lost a powerful ally- Alexander of Epirus, Philip’s son-in-law, was killed. However, never one to avoid a good thing disguised as a bad, Philip raised his nine-year old son and heir, Karanos, to the position of King of Epirus. It is said that the young Karanos was present at the battle, and even rode with Philip’s cavalry to kill the fleeing Persians, but this is unlikely. Afterwards, Philip returned west, to consolidate Macedonian power in western Anatolia, where he remained for nearly a year.

Egypt Reborn:
Shortly after Philip defeated Darius, there was civil war within Persia, during which time, the self proclaimed pharaoh, Khababash, swiftly destroyed Persian armies within the province. Though not a talented commander, per se, Khababash benefited from the weak morale of Persians stationed within the province, and the will of the Egyptian aristocrats to be freed.

[Khababash]

Soon, Egypt ranged from Phoenicia, where the Carthaginians had originated, all the way to the Greek city of Cyrene, which was conquered in 328, after a 5-month siege. Though the Greeks objected strenuously to this, Philip of Macedon did not especially care, given that his pan-Hellenic wishes had already been fulfilled, he felt no need acknowledge the Greeks under Carthaginian control, nor Egyptian, nor even the colony of Massilia.

Pharaoh Khababash embarked on a large scale project of consolidation then, somewhat abandoning the Pharaonic sepats or nomes in favor of a new system, which divided each sepat (there were forty-two) into two, leading to a total of 84 districts, which were clumped into the two administrative divisions of Upper and Lower Egypt. Each ges-sepat, as they tended to be called, (half sepat)

This, while increasing inefficiency when raising large numbers of levies, led to an increase in the efficiency of taxation, as the Pharaoh could personally oversee the two governors of Lower and Upper Egypt, who each oversaw the lesser governors. The whole system was controlled with the death penalty- officials who stole from the government, and were even reasonably suspected of it by the Pharaoh, could be executed. While not a particularly fair system, it did help Egypt, as Egypt began to raise funds to pay for a professional army.

The later Egyptian army was in the Macedonian style, using sarissas, and having soldiers available year round. While a considerable burden to the state, and not nearly as effective as real Macedonians, they proved a lethal fighting force, and established Egyptian military supremacy against any of the factions vying for the position of King of Persia.

For the first time since Cambyses II, Egypt was powerful and free, and ready to expand her influence across the Mediterranean…

Carthaginian Consolidation:
…
“I come before you,” Hasdrubal said to the Council of Elders. “Seeking the position of suffet, that I might serve the nation as I have so far.” From the shadows, Salicar watched his commander stride before the elders manfully. He was a war hero, and Salicar, for some reason, had not been credit. Had he not lead the cavalry, and ordered the fateful charge? Salicar wasn’t a bitter man, but some things could drive him over the edge. A lack of respect, for one. He had limped ever since that bloody Numidian javelin hit him, and it was a miracle that he could still walk at all. But of course, it wasn’t Hasdrubal’s fault precisely. It was just so hard to figure out who was at fault for the whole Sicilian thing.

Salicar shook himself, and returned to what Hasdrubal was saying. “I am the most capable man for the job- I killed the Greeks, I drove away the Spaniards- You know that! Were it not for my capable leadership, than the entire army in Sicily might be lost,” Were it not for my decision making, then the entire army in Sicily might be lost, grumbled Salicar in his mind. It wasn’t that Hasdrubal was a bad person, it was just that he was so assured of his own greatness, some of it deserved, that he couldn’t face the idea that the glories that had come to him had come to him from Salicar. He couldn’t take it anymore!

Salicar limped out of the building angrily, his hip twinging in protest. He could still ride a horse or a chariot as well as any man, but the wound somehow made walking all that harder. Grumbling, Salicar strode down the streets, purchasing a meat pastry from a corner shop. An innovation from Rome, that was. What was it that they called them in Rome; “tabernae?” Whatever they were, they were a good idea. This alliance that Himilcar, one of the last pair of suffets, had come up with was a good idea. Good for trade, and trade was dear to Salicar’s heart. His father had made his fortune trading, and still hoped Salicar would do the same. But the life of a trader wasn’t for Salicar. It was the thrill of battle, not sale, that had entranced Salicar from the very beginning. In fact, he had pushed, with the aid of his father’s allies in the 104, war in Sicily. Not that it was his fault- it was going to happen anyway, but being the son of a rich man did have its many benefits.

But Salicar was going to have to find another war if he were to advance his military career enough to challenge Hasdrubal Mḣannat-Ab himself, the man acclaimed for his “innovative tactics” (Salicar’s ideas to begin with) personal charisma, and bravery. (Salicar was the one who took a bloody javelin to the hip. As far as he’d seen, Hasdrubal was busy looking pretty and important while all the real fighting happened.) Scowling further, Salicar stalked down the avenue, trying to figure out a way…
…

Carthaginian influence, with the aid of gold from the sack of Syracuse, soon found itself being enforced in Spain, as the Carthaginian presence grew ever stronger. After a brief battle with several native tribes, Hasdrubal Mḣannat-Ab (Hasdrubal, “Army Father”) the conqueror of Syracuse, set down several colonies, before returning to Carthage, where he was installed as suffet, “judge” or king, similar to the contemporary Roman consul.

His powers were limited due to the Constitution, but for a period of a year, the suffet had power over all but the military. If the two suffets agreed with the Council of Elders, then their power was almost limitless. A war hero, such as Hasdrubal Mḣannat-Ab, could bend the elders to his will, and then nothing could stop him save the Hundred and Four, the council responsible for generals and the military.

Under Hasdrubal Mḣannat-Ab, many policies were implemented, sending Carthaginian citizens across the empire, to consolidate Carthaginian lands. Due to Carthage’s high population, and great wealth, many Carthaginians could be sent in the colonies, leading to a strong, permanent Carthaginian presence in Spain. Meanwhile, with Carthaginian troops, Rome was subjugating many of the tribes adjacent to Roman territory on the eastern side of the Italian peninsula.

[Roman method of warfare]

Many of the uncontrolled Umbrians and Venetians were subjugated by Rome, becoming Socii, or allies. They, compelled by Roman and Carthaginian force of arms, sent troops, tribute, and tithes to Rome, which rapidly was becoming a power in the Peninsula, though the Etruscans and the Megale Hellenes under Philip II were easily capable of counteracting this power.

Throughout the Mediterranean world, powers were growing stronger and stronger…

[Map, as of 320 BC]

North of Massilia are the Arverni, and green is obviously the Etruscans. Everything else is self explanatory. Lighter colors means a client state, or a number of client states within a region.

[NikoZnate]

I'm enjoying it so far! Keep it up!

Edit: Is Khababash still going to come into conflict with king Nastasen and his Kushite kingdom in TTL?

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by NikoZnate

I'm enjoying it so far! Keep it up!

Edit: Is Khababash still going to come into conflict with king Nastasen and his Kushite kingdom in TTL?

Well, this is, I believe, after he went and tried to bother the Kushites, so, despite their not being on the map (because I'm good with maps ) the Kushites aren't especially fond of these new Egyptians, especially given that there was little danger to them from their under the weak Persians, but with a powerful ruler who has proven himself to be anti-Kush, they are going to be quite leery...

[CandyDragon]

Also, I got the nickname for Hasdrubal out of an online punic dictionary, so the two words are likely to be put together incorrectly. I'm going to be giving all the Carthaginian generals and statesmen nicknames, because there were a crap ton of Hamilcars, Himilcars, Magos, Gisgos, Hannibals, and Hannos, so each one will get their own special name.

[CandyDragon]

Three posts in a row from me on this thread... I don't know if that's frowned upon. This is just an update, and I'll post some content too. Does anybody, by the way, know of a place where I can find plausible names for pharaohs of the newly restored Egypt? For Khababash' son I was thinking Nectanebo III, but there's only so many Nectanebo's one can take.

Here's a rough draft/preview of a bit of the next part, centering upon the emergence of a strong Keltic state north of Massilia:

...

Eodhaigh the Great

In 330, Eodhaigh the Great (Edekos Magnas in the chronicles of the time) came to the throne. Educated by Greek tutors, who had initially fled the fall of Syracuse, and then Massilia’s “Medizing” (Alliance with Carthage) he was well aware of the history of the Greeks, and their views of his people as “barbarians.”

The Averni were the most powerful tribe in Gaul before his father, Bituitus, but that meant little. Tribal hegemonies, at the time, were short-lived, and rarely survived the death of the founding king. However, when Edekos came to the throne, he embarked upon a process of consolidation and conquest that would last the entirety of his reign...

...

Considerably more follows that, but I decided to cut it off early, rather than give away much of the next update. I hope y'all enjoy, and feel free to tell me if I'm screwing anything up disgustingly.

[Monopolist]

Akh, I missed your last update! A belated congrats to you on a good post.

Originally Posted by CandyDragon

Eodhaigh the Great

In 330, Eodhaigh the Great (Edekos Magnas in the chronicles of the time) came to the throne. Educated by Greek tutors, who had initially fled the fall of Syracuse, and then Massilia’s “Medizing” (Alliance with Carthage) he was well aware of the history of the Greeks, and their views of his people as “barbarians.”

The Averni were the most powerful tribe in Gaul before his father, Bituitus, but that meant little. Tribal hegemonies, at the time, were short-lived, and rarely survived the death of the founding king. However, when Edekos came to the throne, he embarked upon a process of consolidation and conquest that would last the entirety of his reign...

I am a little concerned that you're making the Arverni rise a bit quickly. IOTL, the Arverni didn't really start taking off until the late third and early-mid second centuries under Luernios and Bituitus, and I'm not quite sure if Gaul was ready for total Hegemony during such an early period. It's not ridiculous or out of question that they could do so, provided the right leaders and circumstances appear (as it appears will happen ITTL), but it still seems a tad premature.

My $.02.

Three posts in a row from me on this thread... I don't know if that's frowned upon. This is just an update, and I'll post some content too. Does anybody, by the way, know of a place where I can find plausible names for pharaohs of the newly restored Egypt? For Khababash' son I was thinking Nectanebo III, but there's only so many Nectanebo's one can take.

I'd say just look around on Wikipedia, and take old Pharaoh names. If you don't want to do that, you could just look through a list of Ancient Egyptian names, like the following link: http://babynamesworld.parentsconnect...ian-names.html

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by Monopolist

Akh, I missed your last update! A belated congrats to you on a good post.

I am a little concerned that you're making the Arverni rise a bit quickly. IOTL, the Arverni didn't really start taking off until the late third and early-mid second centuries under Luernios and Bituitus, and I'm not quite sure if Gaul was ready for total Hegemony during such an early period. It's not ridiculous or out of question that they could do so, provided the right leaders and circumstances appear (as it appears will happen ITTL), but it still seems a tad premature.
...
I'd say just look around on Wikipedia, and take old Pharaoh names. If you don't want to do that, you could just look through a list of Ancient Egyptian names, like the following link: http://babynamesworld.parentsconnect...ian-names.html

Thank you very much for the compliment.

I wasn't thinking of unifying Gaul with the Arverni, merely providing the basis for later Gallic nations, but I do agree, upon further reflection. I will definitely tone down the Arverni before I post the full update, not that I was consciously intending to wank them. I was thinking more of providing a counterbalance to Massilia, just to keep Carthage and her allies in check (and indeed, I'm going to, on second thought, take a good hard look at Carthaginian expansionism in Spain in the next update.)

And I was wondering with my query on sources for Egyptian names largely due to worrying about changes made to pharaonic names over the course of Egyptian history. Of course, I could have an archaizing period or something, but I didn't want to cheat. (No offense fans of archaizing periods)

[Monopolist]

Originally Posted by CandyDragon

Thank you very much for the compliment. I wasn't thinking of unifying Gaul with the Arverni, merely providing the basis for later Gallic nations, but I do agree, upon further reflection. I will definitely tone down the Arverni before I post the full update, not that I was intending to wank them. I was thinking more of providing a counterbalance to Massilia, just to keep Carthage and her allies in check (and indeed, I'm going to, on second thought, take a good hard look at Carthaginian expansionism in Spain in the next update.)

Akh, I misunderstood you a bit. Hate it when that happens.

Anyways, I like your new plan better - it seems more realistic to be a bit cautious with that sort of thing.

And I was wondering with my query on sources for Egyptian names largely due to worrying about changes made to pharaonic names over the course of Egyptian history. Of course, I could have an archaizing period or something, but I don't want to cheat.

But cheating's so much easier!

I don't know enough about Ancient Egypt to help you out with more original names then... maybe ask around in NPC or something and see if someone has any ideas?

[MerryPrankster]

I like this scenario. Keep up the good work!

[CandyDragon]

Originally Posted by MerryPrankster

I like this scenario. Keep up the good work!

Thank you very much, I will do my best!