Europe Post 1918

[abc123]

Originally Posted by chris N

There was felt that 2 capital ships would be more than enough and that the real needs would be for some cruisers and destroyers plus some patrol boats.

Currently talks in Washington were attempting to abolish submarines.

Cruisers, destroyers, torpedo boats and submarines. that's what is necessary for small navy like A-C-C Navy, not capital ships.

[chris N]

It is currently the Navy chief opinion that the ACC Union needs at least two Capital ships in order to insure that the Italians are respectful of the rights of the nation with regard to shippinf and transit rights up the Adriatic.
Originally they wanted 4 capital Ships put the Imperial Chancellor rejected that demand as the Nation lacked the finances and the Manpower to maintain a modern army and a Imperial Navy of that size.
Currently the Viribus Untis had undergone a modernization and the Tesetthoff has had any damaged repaired from the War but has yet to receive authorization for a modernization. The Navy was hoping for 2 5 Year naval construction programs which would by 1936 see 2 Large cruisers, 2 Light cruisers , 8 destroyers, 8 submarines and 24 Motor Torpedoe boats.
If the Navy were to receive authorization for a new Capital ship there would likely only bee one. The alterative would be to modernize one of the current battleships and scrap the other. Retaining machinery as replacement for worn out parts in the two Modernized ships.
Should the Naval Conference outlaw Submarines that would result in Changes.
The Soviet Union is currently working on two submarines and said that it would not be bound by any conference that it is not a party to.

[abc123]

Originally Posted by chris N

It is currently the Navy chief opinion that the ACC Union needs at least two Capital ships in order to insure that the Italians are respectful of the rights of the nation with regard to shippinf and transit rights up the Adriatic.

And how exactly do they think to do that with 2 BB against 8 Italian BBs?

[Deckhand]

Ally with the French to keep the Italians in line.

[chris N]

It needs to be recalled that in this world as in OTL the French and the Italians did not exactly get along. France sees Italy as a possible threat to it. After all there are only two colonial powers withing range of Italy and one is Great Britain and the other is France. Mussolini has eyes on Serbian territory and France is a protector of Serbia. At the same time any move against the Austro-Czech-Croatian Union would probably be fatal to Italy.
The Kaiser is no fan of the Italian Leader.
Mussolini on the other hand does have some admirers in the Polish-Lithunanian Union and the Ukraine due to his strong anti- soviet stance. One person in The Polish-Lithunanian Union that is not a fan is the monarch and His eldest son the Crown Prince is another.

[abc123]

Originally Posted by chris N

It needs to be recalled that in this world as in OTL the French and the Italians did not exactly get along. France sees Italy as a possible threat to it. After all there are only two colonial powers withing range of Italy and one is Great Britain and the other is France. Mussolini has eyes on Serbian territory and France is a protector of Serbia. At the same time any move against the Austro-Czech-Croatian Union would probably be fatal to Italy.
The Kaiser is no fan of the Italian Leader.
Mussolini on the other hand does have some admirers in the Polish-Lithunanian Union and the Ukraine due to his strong anti- soviet stance. One person in The Polish-Lithunanian Union that is not a fan is the monarch and His eldest son the Crown Prince is another.

IMO Germany should ITTL be the champion of anti-communism because that is essential for their influence in Eastern Europe, a region of strategic importance for them. Maybe some sort of defansive alliance with Eastern European counties.

[chris N]

Germany's Kaiser is no friend of the Soviet Union but he is not all that anxious to involve Germany in another major war to the East without the Support of other governments. There were forces in Finland during the St Petersburg crisis but the Swedish government would not support action , the Finnish government felt it was not prepared for a full scale war and Estonia and Latvia were scared. Only the Polish-Lithuanian Union was willing to join in a war. The British also were not willing to do anything and France had a leftist government.
So into this vacuum has come Mussolini.

Still the Kaiser has been trying to build support for a strong sense of taking action against the Soviet Union, should it go too far.

[chris N]

As naval disarmament talks proceeded in Washington Germany looked at a Naval Construction program that would begin in1926 and last for the next 10 years. The idea was that by the end of that period the Imperial German Navy would consist of 10 Battleships (4 modernized Baden type) 2 Bismarck class, 2 Improved 15 inch gun battleships and 2 H class with 16 inch guns.The battlecruiser force would also undergo a change and the Navy would have 2-3 super heavy cruisers armed with 11 inch guns and 5 Heavy cruisers armed with 8 inch guns. There would be new light cruisers and destroyers. The Imperial Navy would also have 3 Fleet carriers.
Germany would like German Southwest Africa back as it had a German Population.

[chris N]

It appeared that after 4 months of talks a Naval arms agreement was on the verge of being reached. The tentative agreement caused a lot of head shaking gave the US and Great Britain each some 1 Million tons, Japan and Germany 395,000 tons, France 300,000 tons, Italy, 295,000 Austria-Czech-Croatian Union-195,000. Some of the experts expected the treaty to be rejected by most of the members.

[chris N]

It appeared that the Japanese Military refused to accept the treaty and had the government notify Washington that there would have to be changes.
Britain, Germany, the US France and the ACC Union all came to an agreement that would prevent a naval arms race starting up in Europe. Italy was thought to lack the resources to build capital ships beyond a certain point. Pressure was to be applied to Japan to get it to realize that there were need for limits.
Work was to begin on the design of the new French Battle cruiser with actual construction to start in 1927.It would like as below.

[chris N]

The Italian had already been working on the first of three new capital ships.
There had been plans to build four but there was no way that Italy could afford to build that number of ships. Even 3 was questionable. Mussolini however, wanted Italy to be considered a major power and a strong Army and Navy was the key to that.
The Italians were pressing the British to sell them British Somaliland as they would strengthen their hold on East Africa.

[chris N]

The collapse of the Washington Treaty talks now left the diplomats scrambling in an attempt to reach some understanding that would prevent another massive naval arms race. Germany and Great Britain reached an understanding that would allow the German High Sees Fleet to build new ships without starting another naval arms race. German's plans were to sell off or scrap all of its older 12 inch gun battleships and replace them with the newer 15 or 16 inch gun ships. Germany intended to retain at least one of its older Battle cruisers and overhaul it. The ship would then be used in overseas operations.
Italy suffered a terrible loss when one of its older capital ships exploded and sunk. The Italian Navy was investigating . Suspicion included faulty repair war to sabotage. The Austro=Czech-Croatian Union knew that it had nothing to do with the Explosion. It was carrying out some intelligence work on the subject with the Germans and the British. Most believed that it was faulty work but there was a tiny thread that pointed to the possibility of Serbian agents possibily being involved.

[chris N]

The Leonardo had been damaged in 1916 by sabotage but the Italian government had allowed the ship to be restarted in 1919 and it was completed. It Had visited Serbian territory before returning home to the naval base in the south were it was to under go repairs. The explosion that rocked the ship sent the vessel to the bottom of the harbor.
There were several addition explosions before everything was stopped. Reports indicated the death of 90 Italian sailors and the injury of at least another 200. While there was a report that stated that the ship could be salvaged and raised the Italian Admiralty recommended that it be scrapped .
It was felt that to restore it for a second time would be pushing things too far.

[abc123]

Originally Posted by chris N

It appeared that after 4 months of talks a Naval arms agreement was on the verge of being reached. The tentative agreement caused a lot of head shaking gave the US and Great Britain each some 1 Million tons, Japan and Germany 395,000 tons, France 300,000 tons, Italy, 295,000 Austria-Czech-Croatian Union-195,000. Some of the experts expected the treaty to be rejected by most of the members.

Way too small displacement for Japan. OTL they had 60% of UK or USA. Japanese are probably totally pis*** ITTL.

[chris N]

Its why I had the Naval arms limitation talks collapse. The Admirals of the Imperial Japanese navy knew that even if they were given 395,000 tons of Capital ships it would not be enough let alone for the entire navy.
Still there is to be one more effort at a treaty as a battleship building race would be too costly according to more of the experts.

Meanwhile the Italians have discovered some evidence that hints that their might have been Serb involvement in the destruction of their battleship. Yet the evedince is not clear enough to allow Italy a free hand at dealing with the Serbs. Mussolini has order efforts to secure proof redoubled and has ordered plans to be updated for an invasion of Montenegro .

[chris N]

The Soviet Union used the rest of 1925 to increase their industrial output and to also continue to increase the size of the Red Navy. It was the goal of Stalin to have a Soviet Naval Prescience in all of the waters bordering the Soviet Union. The Soviet Warship designers were now working on designs for heavier warships.

[chris N]

Great Britain also was looking at the modernization of its fleet especial since it now had an indication that Japan had been building a lot more tonnage than had been allowed under the prior agreement. The new Invincible class would be a powerful addition to the Fleet.

[chris N]

Italy: There were cracks beginning to form within the Fascist Party's domination of Italy under Mussolini. The Italian military seemed to be offering an alternative with Marshal Balbo. The Italian Military leader was beginning to realize that if changes were not made Italy would lag behind other nations. Thus he began to gather supporter with an idea toward ousting Italy's strongman and putting the country on a new path.
Already it was clear that Italy and Ethiopia were on a path that might lead to a conflict.
Great Britain agreed to sell Italian Somaililand as it could use the money to pay for military modernization. Balbo question the wisdon of using Italy scare foreign reserves to buy desert land.

[sirharryflashman]

Originally Posted by chris N

The Croatians decided that it made more sense to Join with the Austrian--Czech- Slovenian Union. The New Entity officially renamed the Austro-Czech-Croatia Union.
As for Germany by the fall of 1919 it had stabilized and conditions were improving. The economy was picking up and unemployment was down. The Peace treaty that had been signed in 1918 had been negoiated by all of the parties. Italy had been left out as it had sued for peace in 1917 and thus was out of the war. Still there was a feeling in Italy by some that they had been stabbed in the back by their allies. Forget the fact that the Italian Army's attempt to break the Austro-Hungaian Empire had been a disaster. And all of the aid that Britain and Frnace had given the Italians. Italy was angry with the Serbs. Serbia had taken a good chunk of Bosnia and Montenegreo . It was the grabbing of the latter part that had cause a lot of resentment as the late Monarch of Montenegreo had been related to the Italian Monarch. Thus Italy had a claim.
The Peace treaty did not lay the blame for the war on any nation. Germany was required to pay a small amount of repairations to repair damage but nowhere near the amount in OTL.
The Regency Council in Germany was still trying to decide whether to allow a referendum on a Hollenzollern Restoration or to ask its head to assume the post after a vote by the people.

not sure about the posibility of austria czech slovenia union
in reality it was the czechs who broked up austria because without them austria could not function. hungary was reasonably happy in the AH once they got the dual monarchy set up...czechs and slovenes got nothing. once ww1 started the AH was a dying animal as all the national tensions surfaced
more realistic could be czechs hungarians slovenes and poles
in some kind of confederacy

[abc123]

Originally Posted by sirharryflashman

in reality it was the czechs who broked up austria