Happy and Glorious.

[Astrodragon]

Originally Posted by El Pip

I am half tempted to a satirical timeline in which the newly commissioned Iowa crosses the Pacific, single handedly sinks both the Musashi and Yamato and then sails into Tokyo Bay to shell the Japanese into an early surrender. All the while shrugging off hits from hundreds of bombs, shells and torpedoes naturally.

My only worry is that some people might take it seriously....

Is that the one where MacArthur leaps off the ship, fights his way singlehanded through to the Imperial Palace and forces the Emperor to surrender??

[Sam R.]

Originally Posted by Astrodragon

Is that the one where MacArthur leaps off the ship, fights his way singlehanded through to the Imperial Palace and forces the Emperor to surrender??

Forces the Emperor to _surrender_? Obviously I've been reading different reactionary manga to you…

http://www.maniform.com/comics/pjap1.htm

Planet of the Jap is of course an art house satire.

yours,
Sam R.

[WSoxfan]

First, I'm a USN and a battleship fanboy. I just read through the battle sequence and the South Dakota sinking was completely realistic. Five torpedos is a death knell to any ship of this era(excluding the Yamato and Musashi) and if the South Dakota could even make 2 knots after that I'd buy the ship designers enough beers to last them a lifetime.

[Devolved]

Originally Posted by CiH

You forgot the soft rock ballad soundtrack, filtered through a beer commercial, being pumped out constantly from the ship's loudspeakers!

I've just caught up with this awesome timeline in a massive binge-read! Thanks for all the undoubted hard work, Devolved.

Thank you. I wouldn't call it hard work. You get paid for that!

[Devolved]

Happy and Glorious

continued

Italy

May 19th 1943

On the northern tip of Sicily artillery opened fire on Reggio across the Straits of Messina. Waiting to cross was the 1st Canadian division plus a Royal Marine and 2 tank battalions. Their purpose was simply to draw Axis attention away from the other landings scheduled for the next day. The bombardement hit nothing but policeman and civilians. During the hours before dawn troops climbed into DUKWs and landing craft as well as barges and then crossed into Europe. A unit of the Royal Marines were the first troops to make a permament landing in Europe.

Rome

Badoglio sat in front of a large microphone and broadcast the armistice 30 minutes after the first marines landed at Reggio. He ordered all military operations against the Allies to cease at 11am. After that time they were to offer their full co operation to the Allies. In the broadcast he said that his country had stood side by side with Germany until it was no longer in the best interests of the nation to do so. He advised the Germans that they too should seek to end the war before war comes to their homeland. Finally he warned Germany not to interfere in the internal affairs of Italy.

Kesselring had already anticipated something like this although the announcement still stunned him. He immediately ordered his troops to secure the airfields and arms depots as well as the government ministries in Rome.

Overhead the citizens of Rome heard the roar of aircraft engines.


TBC

[Devolved]

Happy and Glorious

continued


Italy

May 20th 1943

Paratroopers of the US 82nd Airborne were dropped on two Italian airfields northwest of Rome with another regiment dropping close to bridges over the Volturno river. The aim of the paratroopers was to bolster Italian resistance in Rome and draw German forces away from opposing the landings at Salerno.

Meanwhile as the airborne were jumping from their planes the 1st and 3rd battalion US Rangers plus 41st Royal Marine Commando landed on three seperate beaches at Salerno. The troops found the beaches empty apart from one Italian artillery unit that either didn't know or didn't care about the Armistice. The unit was quickly overcome with 7 Italians being killed before the rest surrendered. Two hours later the US 1st infantry division came ashore.

To the east the British were landing at Taranto. Here they encountered no resistance at all with the Italian battleship Andrea Doria, a cruiser and 4 destroyers sailing from Taranto and meeting the invasion force but instead of firing had hoisted their flags in salute and proceeded as arranged to Malta. Troops from the 56th Infantry division began disembarking in the port. Overhead two battalions of 1st Airborne landed north of Taranto to block any Germans coming from the north but no Germans came.

Rome

German troops moved quickly to occupy as many Italian government buildings as possible. All but one was taken without resistance. Meanwhile at the Stazione di Furbara and Cerveteri airfields the US paratroopers took control with minimal resistance from Italian guards who again either didn't know or didn't care about the Armistice. The fighting was over in thirty minutes with 4 US troops killed. With the airfields taken the USSAF flew supply missions with field guns and mortars to the 82nd Airborne before the Germans arrived in force. The news that there were Americans north of Rome inspired Italian garrison troops to resist the Germans as they tried to take the barracks.

Taranto

The entire city of Taranto was secured by the evening of May 20th with scout forces already heading for Bari and Foggia.


Salerno

The US 1st infantry and US 45th division were ashore with scout forces pushing north and east. Salerno fell without a shot being fired and it was only when they reached Montecorvino Airport that they met some Germans. After a brief fire fight in which 2 Americans and 2 Germans were killed the airport was taken.

TBC

[Shaby]

Nice. So new line in Italy is probably north from Rome. Possibly a division or two of German army is in the bag too. Perhaps even the dreaded Hermann Goering Division?

[Devolved]

Originally Posted by Shaby

Nice. So new line in Italy is probably north from Rome. Possibly a division or two of German army is in the bag too. Perhaps even the dreaded Hermann Goering Division?

If the Allies haven't gone a "city too far".

[Shaby]

Well, yeah there is that.

[NORGCO]

Originally Posted by Devolved

If the Allies haven't gone a "city too far".

I see where the possiblity of it all going horribly wrong comes in, or at least if I am reading the maps right.

Rome is over 200km from Salerno, so I assume the plan either does not allow for meaningful resistance to stop the relief force driving to relive the airborne force OR the plan is to quickly move up all the support and supply forces to Salerno and then launch another amphibious invasion at Fiumicino which is only a few km from Rome and has good road connections (or at least it does now, bless you Google Maps).

So the whole plan seems to assume everything will go ok, no determined German forces south of Rome holding up the advance while the while the forces further north grind the 82nd into chutney for example.

All I can say is good luck with that guys because Rome is starting to sound like Arnhem. Certainly the potential is there.

[perfectgeneral]

Originally Posted by Sior

Some on this site (you know who you are) who only countenance US supremacy will argue only a direct hit by an A bomb will do it!

Respect the atomic bomb proof Centurion tank.

http://www.raeme.info/ops.php?op=armd&item=3

Although other tanks have been exposed to atomic testing, amongst them a couple of British Centurion tanks deployed within the Maralinga, South Australia target area during the Buffalo series of atomic tests in the latter half of the 1950s, 169041 is the only tank known to have withstood atomic tests and subsequently gone on for another 23 years of service, including 15 months on operational deployment in a war zone.

[Devolved]

Happy and Glorious

continued

Rastenburg

May 20th - May 21st 1943

Hitler had returned from another trip to the Eastern Front where he discussed plans for a summer offensive with Von Manstein and Model. The omens were not good he was told. After looking at lots of maps and staying up late every night discussing tanks, infantry replacements and the situation in the Mediterranean, it seemed that the logical thing to do was to go onto the defensive until the new weapons currently being developed were ready in 1944. Hitler accepted this but believed that a limited offensive was necessary to blunt Soviet offensive power and give Germany a victory to cancel out the defeats at Stalingrad, North Africa and Sicily.

The news of the Allied landings in Italy and the capitulation of his main Ally was just another blow to add to the list. Hitler immediately ordered 2 infantry and yet another Panzer division to be withdrawn from the Russian front plus another division from France to be sent to the Mediterranean with 2 divisions going to Italy and 1 to Greece. He also dispatched numerous smaller regiments and battalions from Germany to move into Yugoslavia and Northern Italy. Kesselring was ordered to fight for every centimetre of Italian soil until enough units could be sent to form a new line north of Rome.

Rome

May 21st 1.38 am

As Marshall Badoglio and his small motorcade fled from the sporadic fighting in Rome it was ambushed by 16 men from Otto Skorzeny's unit. Badoglio, two generals and their few police escorts (so as not to attract attention) were wiped out. A photo was taken of the dead Badoglio as a gift for the Fuhrer.

US 82nd Airborne 25 miles north west of Rome

Small groups of US troops had been dropped far from the airfields and these were the first to run into the newly formed Luftwaffe controlled Herman Goring Division. In a succession of small confused actions the Americans prevented them from reaching the main airborne force at the airfields until mid afternoon on May 21st.

Daylight on May 21st brought the two airfields held by the 82nd Airborne under heavy air attack by the Luftwaffe. The Americans lacked fighter cover at this stage and lost 2 C47's plus 9 Italian planes destroyed on the ground plus 2 more C47's shot down. By late afternoon Seafires from HMS Victorious and Furious were launched to try and give some cover to the Americans and these succeeded in shooting down 2 Stukas a Do 217 and a Me 109 for the loss of 2 Seafires.

Salerno

The Americans took Battipaglia and moved inland along the road to Oliveto Citra. Before reaching the small town they were ambushed by a German battalion and were forced to wait for reinforcements. The Americans lost 22 men killed in return for killing 3 Germans. Meanwhile the two Allied beaches had linked up and Mark Clark came ashore to establish a HQ.

Volturno Bridges

The American airborne troops at the Volturno Bridges were joined by 2 Italian infantry battalions and together they blocked a German supply convoy from moving south. In the process they killed 11 Germans destroyed 7 trucks and took 23 prisoners.

Taranto

The 56th and 44th infantry divisions were almost totally off loaded by the end of May 21st with elements of the 1st Airborne driving into Brindisi and accepting the surrender of 9,000 Italian troops who remained confused about whether to fight, surrender or join. The Italian forces in the area were actually much larger but desertions were now widespread throughout the country. On their journey the airborne troops had liberated their first 80 Allied prisoners of war.

TBC

[Astrodragon]

Originally Posted by Devolved

Rome

May 21st 1.38 am

As Marshall Badoglio and his small motorcade fled from the sporadic fighting in Rome it was ambushed by 16 men from Otto Skorzeny's unit. Badoglio, two generals and his small escort (so as not to attract attention) were wiped out.

I suppose jokes about dwarf bodyguards are in bad taste?

[HMS Warspite]

Originally Posted by PMN1

Maybe we need some ground rules as to when a modern US battleship can get sunk?

Theoretically a single airborne torpedo, which normally is significantly smaller than a ship launched one, or another type of device, can also be enough, if hitting the target in the right spot. This can be either:

Sinking:
1. A direct hit near a main magazine, causing a secondary explosion of the ordonance inside this magazine.

2. A direct hit on, or near a driving shaft, causing it to buckle and destroy internal watertight integrity over a long part of the hull. HMS Prince of Wales was lost mainly due to such a hit. The other four hits were only speeding up her sinking basically.

3. An indirect, or direct hit under the hull, causing uncontrollable flooding, due to laws of physics, forcing all energy of the detonnation inside the hull, rather than deflecting much of the energy into a watercollum. Such a hit will cause significant shockdamage and may, or may not cause a total loss of power, due to destruction of the boilers and machinery. Most likley the hull main longitudal grid will snap and cause the hull to loose its stifness, besides possible secondary and tertiary damage. Both a magnetic detonation under the hull by a torpedo, mine or whatever device, or limpet mines, or a large charge, or a direct hit undder the hull as in USS Houston in 1944, will do the job quite well.

4. Secondary damage, due to uncontrollable flooding, after a direct hit, basically as result of self inflicted causes. After a direct torpedohit, speed must normally be adjusted, in order to prevent internal bulkheads to collapse under the presure of the flooded compartments. If speed is too hight, bulkheads may collapse, causing even more flooding, dooming the ship. HRIJS Kongo was lost in this way. USS North Carolina was saved by her captain's order to slow down speed.

Constructive Total Loss or, incapacitated:
1. A direct torpedohit on the main steering, or propulsion part of the vessel. Bismarck was a clear example of such a hit.

2. A direct, or indirect torpedohit, or by whatever other device, taking out the main (and sometimes secondary and other) weapons, propulsion, steering, or a combination of all, due to concussion damage. Tirpitz was a clear example of such an attack by the X-6 and X-7. HMS Ramilies at Madagascar was another example, as were HMS Queen Elizabeth and HMS Valiant at Alexandria.

[The Oncoming Storm]

Is it just me or is Hitler taking a big risk by diverting forces from the Eastern Front to Italy given that the Soviets are in a better position than OTL as they won Kharkov 3?

[Devolved]

Originally Posted by Astrodragon

I suppose jokes about dwarf bodyguards are in bad taste?

They are supposed to be more inconspicuous and harder to hit.

Yes I will alter the sentence.

[Devolved]

Originally Posted by HMS Warspite

Theoretically a single airborne torpedo, which normally is significantly smaller than a ship launched one, or another type of device, can also be enough, if hitting the target in the right spot. This can be either:

Sinking:
1. A direct hit near a main magazine, causing a secondary explosion of the ordonance inside this magazine.

2. A direct hit on, or near a driving shaft, causing it to buckle and destroy internal watertight integrity over a long part of the hull. HMS Prince of Wales was lost mainly due to such a hit. The other four hits were only speeding up her sinking basically.

3. An indirect, or direct hit under the hull, causing uncontrollable flooding, due to laws of physics, forcing all energy of the detonnation inside the hull, rather than deflecting much of the energy into a watercollum. Such a hit will cause significant shockdamage and may, or may not cause a total loss of power, due to destruction of the boilers and machinery. Most likley the hull main longitudal grid will snap and cause the hull to loose its stifness, besides possible secondary and tertiary damage. Both a magnetic detonation under the hull by a torpedo, mine or whatever device, or limpet mines, or a large charge, or a direct hit undder the hull as in USS Houston in 1944, will do the job quite well.

4. Secondary damage, due to uncontrollable flooding, after a direct hit, basically as result of self inflicted causes. After a direct torpedohit, speed must normally be adjusted, in order to prevent internal bulkheads to collapse under the presure of the flooded compartments. If speed is too hight, bulkheads may collapse, causing even more flooding, dooming the ship. HRIJS Kongo was lost in this way. USS North Carolina was saved by her captain's order to slow down speed.

Constructive Total Loss or, incapacitated:
1. A direct torpedohit on the main steering, or propulsion part of the vessel. Bismarck was a clear example of such a hit.

2. A direct, or indirect torpedohit, or by whatever other device, taking out the main (and sometimes secondary and other) weapons, propulsion, steering, or a combination of all, due to concussion damage. Tirpitz was a clear example of such an attack by the X-6 and X-7. HMS Ramilies at Madagascar was another example, as were HMS Queen Elizabeth and HMS Valiant at Alexandria.

Where were you when I was being crucified for sinking South Dakota?

[Devolved]

Originally Posted by The Oncoming Storm

Is it just me or is Hitler taking a big risk by diverting forces from the Eastern Front to Italy given that the Soviets are in a better position than OTL as they won Kharkov 3?

I think he's hoping (not unreasonably) that the Russians are exhausted.

[Devolved]

Happy and Glorious

continued

Rome

May 21st - May 23rd

Rome

By late evening of the 21st of May 85% of the capital was in German hands but there were still pockets of stiff resistance. News of Badoglio's death now started to spread throughout the city with the reaction of the people evenly divided between anger, celebration and indifference. Maxwell Taylor the second in command of the 82nd Airborne was now in Rome and with the death of Badoglio and two senior generals the Italian resistance in Rome began to defer to him.

Kesselring was in a frantic mood as reports of Allied seaborne and airborne landings seemed to be coming in from everywhere. There were also a lot of confusion regarding the Italians and what to do. Some Italians were fighting the Germans while others were shooting at the Allies but most were doing nothing with crowds of deserters causing disorder in many towns and villages. The good news was that all the Alpine passes were safely in German hands and the Italian airforce with the exception of a dozen squadrons was grounded or destroyed by the Luftwaffe. By late evening on May 21st 4 Italian divisions had been disarmed along with 100,000 men of all ranks detained.

In Ostia an attempt by the Germans to take over the port had been repulsed by strong Italian resistance. The fighting was also heavy along the road from Rome to the American 82nd Airborne. Here an attempt by the Germans to block the highway was thwarted by Italian troops supported by tanks. The fighting resulted in 131 Italian and 35 German troops being killed but the road remained open and the US airborne were joined by 3 Italian infantry and 1 tank battalion thereby adding an extra 1,400 troops and 16 tanks to the Americans.

The Herman Goring Division had been arrving unit by unit and had taken heavy losses at the hands of the American paratroopers. An attack in the early evening was thrown back with 54 Germans killed and 182 wounded. That night C47's flew in to land more supplies and 75mm guns and flew out the wounded. Also that night 8 P40 fighters were flown in as the damage to the airfields were repaired by the Italian base personnel.

On May 22nd the Luftwaffe returned in force. They were met by 7 of the P40's that were able to shoot down 4 German planes for the loss of one. However when they landed to refuel they were hit again with 4 P40's destroyed on the ground. The Americans were then subject to heavy air attack for most of the day while the occasional Royal Navy Seafire appeared to give protection.

Another attack by the Herman Goring was repulsed but American losses had mounted and by late evening Matthew Ridgway the US commander had estimated that a third of his men were now casualties. By nightfall they had been joined by another 1,500 Italian troops from Rome and these helped him to remain optimistic about the eventual outcome.

At Ostia a Royal Navy destroyer and a corvette arrived with two more ships bringing 4th US Ranger Battalion to bolster the Italian resistance.


Salerno

May 21st - May 23rd

The British 5th Division minus a brigade were now landed as were two battalions of 2nd Armored. The US forces pushed the Germans out of Oliveto Citra after a heavy bombardment by artillery and air attacks from Sicily softened them up. The Americans then turned north towards Naples facing lighter resistance than first feared. At Sorrento they were joined by an Italian battalion that helped them to clear out a German controlled artillery position in which they took 15 German prisoners.

The only problem the Allies faced at Salerno came from two German battalions established in the hills overlooking Paestum. They were able to pour mortar fire onto the the Allied trucks destroying 5 and killing 12 Americans. An attempt to dislodge them on May 22nd failed and so guns from the USS Maryland and HMS Revenge shelled the hills. On May 23rd an attack from troops of the US 45th division broke into the hills and ejected them.

They also faced occasional raids from the Luftwaffe but the air umbrella did a good job and keeping the skies largley clear. In the end only one LST and 2 landing craft were sunk by air attack while the troops faced only sporadic strafing. The Allied fighters shot down 12 German aircraft while AA fire brought down 5 more for the loss of 5 Allied planes (4 American and 1 British). The main reason, however, for the relatively quiet time at Salerno was that the Luftwaffe was focusing on Rome.

By this stage the Allies had landed 2 American P40 and 1 RAF Spitfire squadron to give local air cover.

May 23rd also saw troops from 1st US take Castellamare Di Stabia and jeep patrols were within 6 miles of Naples.

Naples

On May 22nd a popular uprising supported by most of the Italian troops in the city expelled the German garrison. The fighting had been short and fierce with 41 Germans and 287 Italians killed of which 94 were civilians. In the aftermath over 200 pro Fascist Italians were executed throughout the city as were 17 German prisoners.

Taranto front

The 8th Army had now landed 44th division (minus a brigade), 56th Division, 1st airborne (minus a battalion) and 6th Armoured division. On May 22nd troops from the 1st Airborne took Cerignola and pushed towards Foggia. Just before arriving they ran into an ambush by the German 1st Parachute division losing 12 men killed and 5 captured.

Meanwhile to the south British troops took Brindisi where they were again faced with the surrender of 7,000 Italians. So far only 2 battalions had actually joined the 8th Army but they received warm welcomes and were given food and scarce fuel wherever they went.

By nightfall on May 23rd one RAF P40 and one Spitfire squadron had arrived in the area.

Reggio

The Canadian 1st division faced destroyed bridges and occasional snipers as they plodded north up the toe of Italy in what was now seen to be a waste of time. By May 23rd they had advanced 35 miles.

Volturno Bridge

An attempt by German troops to move south towards Salerno was blocked by the US Airborne now joined by 3,000 Italian troops. They also prevented a German support unit heading north and took 52 prisoners in the process plus 9 trucks.

Dodecanese

Lord Jellicoe one of Britains growing band of Special forces heroes had parachuted onto the island of Rhodes on May 20th just a few hours before the Armistce. His orders were to contact the Italian commander Admiral Inigo Campioni and persuade him to join the Allies before the 7,000 Germans on the island had time to react. There were 38,000 Italian troops on the island and therefore enough to contain the Germans if they acted quickly.

Campioni was worried about the whole thing but the wording of the Armisitice was such that it was within his remit to aid the British and resist the Germans. Finally he received orders from Badoglio (one of the last he sent) to co operate with the British. This order arrived on the evening of May 20th. By this time the Germans had started moving and had already taken and disarmed 2,000 Italians. However, a battalion of 1st Airborne diverted from the Italian campaign were flown in, some on Halifax Bombers. By the morning of May 21st there was heavy fighting but the Germans had been contained while a Spitfire squadron was flown in to give air cover. The Germans were also subjected to air attack from Beaufighters while gunfire from the Dido Class cruiser HMS Cleopatra broke up a German troop concentration.

Meanwhile the small island of Kastelorizo fell without a fight on May 20th while on Kos Special Boat squadron troops landed and took the airfield and within hours a Beaufighter squadron arrived. The Americans used their B24's to attack the Luftwaffe on Rhodes (May 20th) and Crete (May 21st) severely limiting the Luftwaffe response. On Crete the Germans and Italians were now fighting each other with Italian fighters shooting down 3 German planes on May 21st alone. The whole Balkans now seeemd to be ablaze just like Churchill had always dreamed. Unfortunately, the Italians in Greece and Yugoslavia would not be ablaze for long. By May 22nd 9 Italian divisions in the Balkans had been disarmed along with 150,000 men while 25,000 men elected to remain with the Germans and helping to kill their former comrades. This left 6 Italian divisions fighting the Germans with 11 more disintegrating before their commanders eyes as 50,000 Italians troops deserted en masse and tried to make their way back to Italy by truck, stolen car or fishing boat.


Malta

The arrival of the battleship Roma on May 22nd meant that the whole Italian battlefleet was within the Grand Harbour. The Roma was berthed alongside the Vittorio Vento, Littorio, Andrea Doria, Giulio Cesara and the Caio Duilio which had been hit by a small bomb from a German Ju 87 as it tried to escape. All but two Italian cruisers had also arrived with one being sunk by a U boat and the other under repair and unable to sail. The one worry was that only 7 Italian submarines had arrived. It was known that at least 5 had refused to surrender, 2 were scuttled to prevent capture by the Germans and one had been sunk but the others were unaccounted for.

The sight of the Italian Fleet both stunned and gratified the inhabitants of Malta who had been collectively awarded the George Cross for their endurance during the long siege. Thanks to their long ties with Italy they were also able to hurl abuse at the Italian sailors in their own language.

Rastenberg

Hitler was now receiving bad news on top of bad news with extra helpings of bad news. It seemed like the Allies were everywhere. Rome, Naples, Taranto, Rhodes, possibly Greece. He wouldn't have been surprised if someone had told him the Allies had just landed at Calais too.

Hitler's confusion was overpowered by his anger at the news of Italians shooting at his men. He issued an order that all Italians above the rank of corporal captured after resisting his troops were to be shot. The rest were to be sent to concentration camps. He also demanded that Rome be held at all costs and he wanted Mussolini back in his hands.


Mussolini

The former Italian dictator was being moved from place to place to avoid detection. Unfortunately they hadn't counted on the Nazi fanatic Otto Skorzeny and his equally fanatical men. As well as being fanatics they were also very good at their job. Under orders from Hitler they had already killed Badoglio and would have killed the King too but Hitler thought that would turn too many Italians against him. The Germans still needed some Italian support to hold Rome.

Radio intercepts confirmed that Musolinis' location was to be moved on May 21st. With his location fixed, German glider borne troops landed under cover of night near the castle where he had been kept and waited for his convoy to emerge. Skorzeny personally led the attack shooting 6 men with his machine gun and executing 2 more with his pistol after confirming that they were of rank. The rest of the convoy were slaughtered after discovering it was a ruse and Mussolini was already gone.

On May 22nd Mussolini was bundled aboard a converted Italian Sm 81 and was to be flown to Sardinia. Unfortunately two Me 110 night fighters intercepted the aircraft and started shooting. Mussolini tried to seize the radio and tell the Germans who he was but the pilot punched him. On the second attack run the plane was hit and was forced to crash into the sea 12 miles short of Sardinia.

Mussolini's body was never found leading to many post war legends.

TBC

[abc123]

Originally Posted by Devolved

Happy and Glorious

Under orders from Hitler they had already killed Badoglio and would have killed the King too but Hitler thought that would turn too many Italians against him. The Germans still needed some Italian support to hold Rome.

I would prefer if germans killed the King, so that later Italian Monarchy has some chances of survival.