Jewish China (Reprised)

1881: Tsar Alexander II assassinated. A Jewish radical, one Gamochov, was blamed for this. Massive pogrom ensued in Russian, and many Russian Jews fled. A sizeable number fled to Russia's new and burgeoning mining and railway concern in Manchuria.
1882: Russian Jews established several communities in Manchuria, building mines and maintaining railways. Several richer families also diversify into lumber and agriculture.
1883: The Jewish commuity in Manchuria, centred around Harbin and Changqun, established Jewish schools for their children.
1885: Desirous to improve relations with the Chinese, who due to various reasons respect or at least fear foreigners (to them Russian Jews are foreingers just as Englishmen), the Jewish schools opened annexes for the Chinese. Noting carefully the missionary schools' failure and resultant resentment caused amongst the Chinese, they refrain from teaching Judaism. However, since many of the teaching staff are devout Jews, some ideas inevitably leaked across.
1887: A young Theodor Herzl, Austrian Jew, purchased a copy of the Atlas of China by Jesuits, commissioned by the Emperor Qianlong of the Manchus. He noted with some interest the city if Xian in western China. Further studies showed him that there were Jewish enclaves in Kaifeng, ancient capital of China.
1890: The Russian Jews gained a reputation of being more even-handed than other foreigners in China, principally because Jews were very well aware of importance of good relations with their host country. Jewish communities in Manchuria engaged in more charity work, and unlike their Christian counterparts, did not seek to tie religion into it for practical reasons. Jewish businesses in Mahcuria flourish. Other Eastern European Jews migrate to the foreign concessions in China rather than America.
1894: The Drefus Affair.
1895: Sino-Japanese war ended in complete Japanese victory. Japanese troops committed atrocities in Manchuria. The various Jewish communities protected a number of Chinese in their settlements. Japanese soldiers did not pursue since the Jewish settlements were technically in the Russian sphere of interest.
1896: Theodor Herzl published Der Judenstaat, a chapter on the Chinese city of Zion (Xian) was found therein.
1897: The First Zionist Congress. The Jewish writer and amateur archaeologist Israel Zangwill gave a speech on the ancient pyramid Xian*, sparking some speculation. Jewish migration to China increased into a steady trickle. The Manchu government was happy to leave what they saw as foreingers alone, being fearful of reprisals from the Western countries from which the Jews came.
1899: Boxer Rebellion in China, Jewish communities escaped the worse of it due to their good reputation compared to other foreigners, and the distance of their main settlements from the main areas of Boxer activity
1901: Seven western powers plus Japan suppressed Boxer rebellion in China Peking sacked, Russian troops ransacked a number of Jewish homes along with the Chinese ones. Dowager Empress Cixi fled all the way to Xian, where a Jewish delegation met with her; normally she would refuse audience to foreigners, by that time the dowager Empress was too shellshocked by anything from outside China that she acquiesced. A number of Jewish lawyers accompanied the Chinese delegation to the negotations. Boxer Protocol signed by Dowager Empress Cixi of China, a little less harsh than historical. For this office the Empress granted free passage to all Jews and some land around Xian.
1903: Kishinev pogroms, more Jews fled; some to Manchuria, and a number to Xian.
1905: Russo-Japanese war ended in Japanese victory. Minor pogrom ensued in Russia. More Jews fled to Manchuria, now freer from Tsarist influence. Israel Zangwill formed the Jewish Territorialist Organisation. Zion (Xian) was one of the possible destinations.
1910: The Manchurian Jewish communities numbered some 300,000 Jews mainly of Russian Jewry, with major settlements in Harbin, Changqun and Port Arthur; in Shanghai and Canton there were some ten thousand Jews in each city; in Xian, a burgeoning Jewish community of some 50,000.
1911: Year of the Chinese revolution. A number of Jews supplied Dr. Sun Yat-Sen's revolutionaries with funds and arms, as well as connections with Western sources which Jewish communities in said countries could furnish. As a result Dr. Sun and the nascent republic held very favourable view of the Jews, viewing them as 'almost Chinese' in sympathy.
1912: Yuan Shikai succeeded Sun as President of the Republic of China
1915: Yuan Shikai crowned himself Emperor, triggering revolt all across China. Yuan died shortly after. Period of the Warlords began in China. Jews kept to themselves, while maintaining a reputation of educators and philantropists, as well as reliable merchants.
1917: China joined the Great War on the side of the allies
1919: Treaty of Versailles revealed that China would not be rewarded for her efforts, and that Germany's concessions in China were to be given to Japan instead. This triggered protests all across China. There were some rumbling amongst intellectual that the Jews did better in 1901.
1925: Death of Dr. Sun, Chiang Kai-Shek succeeded.
1927: Kuomintang purgeg the Chinese Communist Party
1928: Mukden Incident, a railway 'accident' arranged by Japan killed the warlord of Manchuria. Soviet Union established the Jewish Autonomous Oblast around Birobidzhan, on the border with Manchuria. A number of Jews, with tacit Soviet permission, went over the border to Manchuria.
1931: Japanese invaded Manchuria, swiftly taking over the entire territory. Tension between the Japanese occupation troops and the local Jews, who controlled a majority of the railway and mining assets, as well as a good portion of lumber mills and much good agricultural land. Japan established Manchukuo, the puppet state, headed by the ex-Emperor of China, Puyi
1932: Puyi issued edict confiscating an amount of Jewish property. This aroused sympathy for the Jews amongst the Chinese.
1933: Nazi Party came to power in Germany. Jewish emigration from Germany increased. Due to Western nation's reluctance to accept Jewish refugee/ emigrants, many moved to the by-now burgeoning Jewish communities in China, now numbering almost a million and a half.
1935: Due to increased Japanese colonisation of Manchuria, tension finally came to a boil as Japanese colonists with the support of the Kwantung Army and Puyi's Manchukuo authorities seized much land belonging to the Jews, and Japanese colonists looted a number of Jewish properties on the night of 22nd of July. This is known in Japan as 'Karistoru no Yoru', or Crystal Night, in reference to the broken glass. A number of Manchurian Jews migrated to other parts of China, most notably Xian (Zion).
1937: The second Sino-Japanese war began. Rape of Nanking. The defiant Jewish Quarter harboured almost twenty thousand Chinese from the Japanese, leading to various incidents in which Jews were murdered and Jewish property ransacked.
1938: Emigree Jewish engineers and technicians in China greatly boostered China's war effort. In Xian (Zion), a Jewish volunteer brigade between refugees from Nanking and Manchuria and local Jews formed.

-To be continued...


*There are a number of earthern pyramids in Xian, this is actually true
 
This brings us to a funny joke about Brezhnev, "Q: What is Brezhnev's nightmare? A: Jews eating matzo with chopsticks in Red Square," or alternatively, "Q: What is Brezhnev's greatest fear? A: When the Chinese learn to fight like the Jews, and the Jews learn to reproduce like the Chinese." Funny, huh?

Getting back on topic, I think that the migration to China is plausible enough, but a Jewish China is stretching it.
 
Romulus Augustulus said:
This brings us to a funny joke about Brezhnev, "Q: What is Brezhnev's nightmare? A: Jews eating matzo with chopsticks in Red Square," or alternatively, "Q: What is Brezhnev's greatest fear? A: When the Chinese learn to fight like the Jews, and the Jews learn to reproduce like the Chinese." Funny, huh?

Getting back on topic, I think that the migration to China is plausible enough, but a Jewish China is stretching it.

Oh, it is stretching it alright. It was originally a challenge from some other fellow whose name escaped me at present, and this was, barring some slight changes, my response. Having finished a project recently I have renewed my interest in this and just thought I'd work on it again, that is all.

And, yes, against my better judgement this does have an effect on the balance of power between China and the Soviet Union in later years.
 
Romulus Augustulus said:
Can you at least get some funny jokes out of it?

I've been trying, evidently to little success, since you didn't notice them... There's the pun with Xian and Zion, and there's the reference to the old Japanese imperial song, Shina no Yoru. Uh, I'll try harder...
 
Romulus Augustulus said:
I noticed Xian/Zion, but I just thought that was a linguistic bastardization for political ends, not a joke.

Well, it is in universe. But I meant it as a pun. Not that it's funny if one has to explain it, mind.
 
This is a somewhat interesting idea, but the idea of the boxers not turning on the Jews doesn't seem realistic. Interesting timeline though. How much intermarriage would you expect?
 
Wendell said:
This is a somewhat interesting idea, but the idea of the boxers not turning on the Jews doesn't seem realistic. Interesting timeline though. How much intermarriage would you expect?

Main idea being they are far from the main areas of boxer activity, as stated. They concentrated in Xian and Manchuria, neither of which really saw much Boxer activity.

I'll get to intermarriage in a bit, when I begin to convert China in earnest.
 
NFR said:
Main idea being they are far from the main areas of boxer activity, as stated. They concentrated in Xian and Manchuria, neither of which really saw much Boxer activity.

I'll get to intermarriage in a bit, when I begin to convert China in earnest.
Do you really think that the Chinese could be converted to Judaism en masse that recently in history?
 
Wendell said:
Do you really think that the Chinese could be converted to Judaism en masse that recently in history?

I think a significant enough proportion would, enough to make an impact. Just look at the Fau Loong Gong (sp?) furor or the fact that the chinese have set up an "Official Catholic Church". Just because the ruling class is nominally atheistic communist doesn't mean the average peasant/citizen is as well.
 
cranos said:
I think a significant enough proportion would, enough to make an impact. Just look at the Fau Loong Gong (sp?) furor or the fact that the chinese have set up an "Official Catholic Church". Just because the ruling class is nominally atheistic communist doesn't mean the average peasant/citizen is as well.
But the Chinese are an old civilization. They don't convert easily.
 
Maybe not too farfetched. My paternal grandparents were Russian who fled during the Revolution in 1917 and arrived, together with lots of others, in Shanghai. My grandmother was Jewish and there was a sizeable Jewish population in the city already living there. They had been there for centuries.

I doubt however that any large scale Jewish emigration from Tsarist Russia would settle in Manchuria. It is too close to Russian territory and therefore to Russian soldiers.Like the real life emigres they would head for the southern cities.
 
Wendell said:
But the Chinese are an old civilization. They don't convert easily.

Yes but at the time of the ATL, China is in a state of severe flux. The old regime is failing and there would be a lot of uncertainty amongst the population. This makes for a much better chance at conversion than a stable solid government. Just look at Rome, christianity arrived at a time when the empire was going to hell in a hand basket and found fertile ground in which to plant itself.
 
Mmm...it's a long shot...so, maybe. I'd say 6 out of 10,000 worlds would have a similar outcome, provided they diverged around this time. And speaking of ancestry...my maternal grandparents were originally Uighurs from Xinjiang, who fled into Soviet Central Asia and settled in the Uzbek SSR during the Japanese invasion of China and those other chaotic events.
 
Wendell said:
Do you really think that the Chinese could be converted to Judaism en masse that recently in history?

Not really, no, but then that's why it's a challenge. Go back to the original thread if you want to see more.

The hard part really is to make China religious. China's really not very religious. Superstitious at time, and prone to cults at others (which usually lead to large scale rebellions, which may be one reason why the Chinese have general reservations about religions), but religious? Not often.
 
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