The Baltic Project

Churchill's Dream

Admiral Fisher's plan for an amphibious invasion of Pomerania in 1915/1916 to march on Berlin and end the war. He managed to get as far as three shallow-draught 32-knot cruisers (Courageous, Glorious, Furious) for fire support. Churchill went for Gallipoli instead.

Let's consider Churchill's Dream instead, his proposal to take the islands of Borkum and Sylt by an amphibious landing and to construct an artificial island with fortified caissons on Horn Reef. If nothing else, it might force the High Seas Fleet out into waters controlled by the Royal Navy. A landing on Heligoland might also be needed to safeguard the rear and provide a support base...

Thoughts, thread-writers, any ideas?
 
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Well points for ballsiness. If troops even land in half decent numbers I can see it being a major defeat for the British, the Germans would certainly find the numbers to beat them back. Best hope is the Expedition is successful enough to pull pressure off of the Russians for a time. Hell even if Berlin is seized it wont stop the Kaiser's war machine dead.

Major problems I can see are the HSF, and the neutrality of the Scandanavian nations - frankly if the British launch such an operation, the Germans are going to put major pressure on Denmark which depending on how the British handle Copenhagen could lead either to German troops invading or Denmark joining the Central Power (through under duress or British ham-fistedness).

Actually this strikes me as a great way to lure the German Fleet out into battle though, patch together a bogus invasion fleet, leak some false intelligence and send the Senior Service out to me them. God's knows if it would go better than Jutland but its an interesting idea.
 
H'mmm...

...Fisher was certainly sincere. Me, I'd have taken Heligoland back (we had it to 1879) and then used it as a base to mine the German port channels. :D
 
Found it...

:eek:...But I swear I'd no idea it existed. Honest, guv...

Perhaps if Roger Keyes had sunk blockships in the North Sea end of the Kiel Canal, as he did at Zeebrugge, the High Seas Fleet would have had a tougher time. But first we need to get rid of Heligoland...

...The Germans turned it into a naval base - could it be taken by a naval bombardment and a landing by the Royal Marines?

It might draw the High Seas Fleet out to where the Royal Navy could cream them - and it wouldn't need too much preparation, unlike the Baltic Project.
 
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Not for Fishers project but....

Their Finest Hour Volume 2 (Winston Churchill)

I have always been fascinated by amphibious warfare, and the idea of using tanks to run ashore from specially- constructed landing craft on beaches where they were not expected had long been in my mind. Ten days before I joined Mr. Lloyd George’s Government as Minister of Munitions on July 17, 1917, I had prepared without expert assistance, a scheme for the capture of the two Frisian islands of Borkum and Sylt. The object was to secure an overseas base for flotillas and cruisers and for such air forces as were available in those days, in order to force the naval fighting, in which we had a great numerical superiority, and establishing close blockade relieve the pressure of the U-boat war, then at its height, against our Atlantic supply-line and the movement of the American armies to France. Mr Lloyd George was impressed with the plan, and had it specially printed for the Admiralty and the War Cabinet.

It contained the following paragraph, 22C, which has never yet seen the light of day.

The landing of the troops upon the island (of Borkum or Sylt) under cover of the guns of the Fleet (should be) aided by gas and smoke from torpedo-proof transports by means of bullet-proof lighters. Approximately one hundred should be provided for landing a division. In addition a number – say fifty- tank landing lighters should be provided, each carrying a tank or tanks (and) fitted for wire cutting in its bow. By means of a drawbridge of shelving bow (the tanks) would land under (their) own power, and prevent the infantry from being held up by wire when attacking the gorges of the forts and batteries. This is a new feature, and removes one of the very great previous difficulties, namely, the rapid landing of (our) field artillery to cut wire.

And further, paragraph 27:

There is always the danger of the enemy getting wind of our intentions and reinforcing his garrison with good troops beforehand, at any rate so far at Borkum, about which he must always be very sensitive, is concerned. On the other hand, the landing could be affected under the shields of lighters, proof against machine gun bullets, and too numerous to be seriously affected by heavy gunfire (i.e. the fire of heavy guns); and tanks employed in even larger numbers than are here suggested, especially the quick moving tank and lighter varieties, would operate in an area where no preparations could have been made to receive them. These may be thought new and important favourable considerations.

In this paper also I had an alternative plan for making an artificial island in the shallow waters of the Horn Reef (to the northward).

Para 30. One of the methods suggested for investigation is as follows: A number of flat bottomed barges of caissons, made not of steel but of concrete, should be prepared in the Humber, at Harwich, and in the Wash, the Medway, and in Thames. These structures would be adapted to the depths in which they were to be sunk, according to a general plan. They would float when empty of water, and thus could be towed across to the site of the artificial island. On arrival at the boys marking the island seacocks would be opened and they would settle down on the bottom. They would subsequently be gradually filled with sand, as opportunity served, by suction dredgers. These structures would range in size from 50’ x 40’ x 20’ to 120’ x 80’ x 40’. By this means a torpedo and weatherproof harbour, like an atoll, would be created in the open sea, with regular pens for the destroyers and submarines and alighting platforms for aeroplanes.

This project, if feasible, is capable of great elaboration, and it might be applied in various places. Concrete vessels can perhaps be made to carry a complete heavy gun turret, and these, on the admission of water to their outer chambers, would sit on the sea floor, like the Solent Forts, at the desired points. Other sinkable structures could be made to contain stores rooms, oil tanks or living chambers. It is not possible, without an expert enquiry, to do ore here than indicate the possibilities, which embrace nothing less than the creation, transportation in pieces, assemblement and posing of an artificial island and destroyer base.

Such a scheme, if found mechanically sound, avoids the need of employing troops and all the risks of storming a fortified island. It could be applied as a surprise, for although the construction of these concrete vessels would probably be known in Germany, the natural conclusion would be that they were intended for an attempt to block yup the river mouths, which indeed is an idea not to be excluded. Thus until the island or system of breakwaters actually begins to grow the enemy would not penetrate the design.

A year’s preparation would however be required.

 
Fisher's Baltic Project is pretty much similar to the Schlieffen Plan - it never existed in the form we credit it. Fisher's plan was a smoke screen to cover the construction of the light battlecruisers Glorious, Courageoue and Furious.
 
the idea is generally crazy

first of all ww1 armies could not do long sustained advances of any serious sort

second the Germans had training divisions, and regiments on leave in Germany more or less all the time

so even if the British where able to somehow land 2 corps on German soil, braving tides, mines and the HSF they would still be screwed, since landing that many men requires an enormous supply base, and in the first critical hours and days, the Germans, making use of their highly developed rail net, would box them in with superior forces. For fear of getting torn up by naval support, they would instead just stand off and beat the bridgehead in with artillery (which they had a lot of, and in damn big calibers too) Soft sand doesn't make for good trench digging and the British would get mauled till they gave up on the enterprise... think Anzio but 10 times worse followed by shameful evacuation
 
It depends on your objectives...

Bearing in mind the other excellent TL on the Baltic Project, why not consider Heligoland, Borkum, Sylt and the Horn Reef. The objective is to lock up the U-boats and the High Seas Fleet, or to draw the High Seas Fleet out into a battlefield where the Royal Navy calls the shots.

Edited first post accordingly...
 
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Any invasion of the German coast lures the Grand Fleet into a battle of attrition vs. German coastal defenses and naval light forces (subs, torpedo boats and destroyers). See the damage the Ottoman Navy did to French / British fleet when this stunt was tried to use to force open the straits. This type of operation would result in huge losses and allow the Germans a chance to grind the GF down.

Michael
 

Susano

Banned
Fisher's Baltic Project is pretty much similar to the Schlieffen Plan - it never existed in the form we credit it. Fisher's plan was a smoke screen to cover the construction of the light battlecruisers Glorious, Courageoue and Furious.

Ah? Interesting.

Well, it wouldnt have worked for the simple facts that the RN would not and could not (yay, mine warfare!) cross the Danish Belt Straits, so how are they going to operate in the Baltic Sea? To mention nothing of supply and logistics,of course.
 

Markus

Banned
Any invasion of the German coast lures the Grand Fleet into a battle of attrition vs. German coastal defenses and naval light forces (subs, torpedo boats and destroyers). See the damage the Ottoman Navy did to French / British fleet when this stunt was tried to use to force open the straits. This type of operation would result in huge losses and allow the Germans a chance to grind the GF down.

Michael


And Borkum was fortified. No idea to what degree but there were concrete bunkers and at least four shore batteries by 1909. This would have gone wrong worse than Gallipoli.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
A landing in Pomerania would probably have been welcomed by and killed off by the Prussian police and training divisions. a) Does Britain even have the army for two amphib landings at once and still hold the west front and b) how do they plan to break through the Sund without c) pissing off the Scandinavians... You'd basically have a second Gallipoli and most of the navy board sacked.
 

Markus

Banned
A landing in Pomerania would probably have been welcomed by and killed off by the Prussian police and training divisions. a) Does Britain even have the army for two amphib landings at once and still hold the west front and b) how do they plan to break through the Sund without c) pissing off the Scandinavians... You'd basically have a second Gallipoli and most of the navy board sacked.

But that could have ended the war ... albeit not in the way Fisher expected. :D
 
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