Overlooked clichés

[Hominid]

I'm not sure if there's a thread on this already, but can anyone think of any overlooked clichés?

[maverick]

Cliches that happen but people like them? or cliches that nobody notices?

[Hominid]

Originally Posted by maverick

Cliches that happen but people like them? or cliches that nobody notices?

The second one, mostly, but the first might apply.

[Abdul Hadi Pasha]

Istanbul and the Aegean coast of Asia Minor going to Greece. It happens in every TL where it's possible, and some where it's not. People take it for granted and have probably stopped even noticing it.

There's always an Israel. People also take this for granted and have probably stopped even questioning it.

[counterblitzkrieg]

-Japan becoming a world power or at the least a regional power in East Asia, never mind that what happened in OTL where Japan managed to transform from a backward isolated country to a modernized one in a few decades was considered a miracle by many.

-Spain balkanized, this happened surprisingly often that I doubt many have noticed

-Britain always gets Australia and New Zealand, there's not much TL that have otherwise

[maverick]

Originally Posted by Abdul Hadi Pasha

There's always an Israel. People also take this for granted and have probably stopped even questioning it.

You mean Palestinean Israel or any Israel? Because there's always the "Pin the Zion on the Eurasia"

-Japan becoming a world power or at the least a regional power in East Asia, never mind that what happened in OTL where Japan managed to transform from a backward isolated country to a modernized one in a few decades was considered a miracle by many.

Not overlooked, it's mentioned in the wiki.

-Spain balkanized, this happened surprisingly often

Also, Portugal taking Galicia, because it looks good on a map

[Xen]

More often than not if the POD takes place before the American Civil War the south will win, although the South winning is a popular POD, even when its not the POD it occurs in alot of TL's

If there is an independent CSA, then the United States compensates its losses by taking Canada

Cuba almost always ends up as a state in the US or an independent CS

[Ofaloaf]

Originally Posted by Abdul Hadi Pasha

Istanbul and the Aegean coast of Asia Minor going to Greece. It happens in every TL where it's possible, and some where it's not. People take it for granted and have probably stopped even noticing it.

This used to be an issue, but most people seem pretty aware of it by this point. There's still a few cases of Greek Constantinople/Anatolia-only Turkey, but those are less common now than they used to be.

"Arbitrary-Lines Africa" is still a major problem, though.

[The Kiat]

Originally Posted by Abdul Hadi Pasha

Istanbul and the Aegean coast of Asia Minor going to Greece. It happens in every TL where it's possible, and some where it's not. People take it for granted and have probably stopped even noticing it.

There's always an Israel. People also take this for granted and have probably stopped even questioning it.

There isn't an Israel in the AHN Universe

Originally Posted by counterblitzkrieg

-Japan becoming a world power or at the least a regional power in East Asia, never mind that what happened in OTL where Japan managed to transform from a backward isolated country to a modernized one in a few decades was considered a miracle by many.

-Spain balkanized, this happened surprisingly often that I doubt many have noticed

-Britain always gets Australia and New Zealand, there's not much TL that have otherwise

Nor do the Limeys get their mits on New Zeeland.

[Thande]

Originally Posted by Ofaloaf

"Arbitrary-Lines Africa" is still a major problem, though.

Isn't that OTL?

[Ofaloaf]

Originally Posted by Thande

Isn't that OTL?

Not quite-- the OTL borders did/do roughly follow watersheds, at least, which is more than can be said about half the AH Africa maps out there.

[Gladi]

Bright day
Czechs and/or Slovaks obliterated. Yeah, I am biased, but it is true.

[Dan1988]

Originally Posted by Abdul Hadi Pasha

Istanbul and the Aegean coast of Asia Minor going to Greece. It happens in every TL where it's possible, and some where it's not. People take it for granted and have probably stopped even noticing it.

There's always an Israel. People also take this for granted and have probably stopped even questioning it.

Those are two clichés that I'm not going to use - if so, it's probably going to be subverted so that:

*There is always an Ottoman Empire, whose territorial definition on a map is more or less going to be the same, but which has Istanbul and the Aegean coast of Anatolia.

*Likewise, the Ottoman Empire retains control of the vilayets of Şam and Mısır. Ergo, no Israel for you (though maybe a Jewish A.O. for the Ashkenazim).

[Emperor Norton I]

Originally Posted by counterblitzkrieg

-Japan becoming a world power or at the least a regional power in East Asia, never mind that what happened in OTL where Japan managed to transform from a backward isolated country to a modernized one in a few decades was considered a miracle by many.

Depending on the era you're talking about, this is sort of part of a counter-myth of Japanese fanboyism which overstates Japan. That being the reaction to the idea that Japan is so awesome and futuristic with the idea that the Japanese were cave people eating rocks on a barren island with a thumb up their butt for a few centuries (and both of these go too far to extremes). Before isolation, Japan was actually roughly on par with European nations. As a matter of fact, Japan used and produced more guns than an average European nation and I believe used them on a larger scale (they reverse engineered Portuguese designs and made them like crazy from then on). Natural resources are also overstated as an issue for pre-isolation Japan; they had enough for a pre-industrialized society. So pre-isolation or without isolation, and if they can make a navy that doesn't suck, some expansion is in the realm of possibility to varying degrees.

If you're talking about post-Meiji, Japan did become a regional power.

Japan wanking, though, is probably a overused cliche.

[Ofaloaf]

Originally Posted by Gladi

Bright day
Czechs and/or Slovaks obliterated. Yeah, I am biased, but it is true.

It's easier to find a book on Croatians than it is to find one on Czechs or Slovaks, in my experience. It's very tempting to simply disregard both groups simply because the author may not know much about them.

[Seraph]

How about this one?
In any ATL where Confederates wins and then fights the US again in WW1 in a trench warfare like the Western Front despite the frontlines being much longer the Western Front.

Personally, I can't see either side having enough troops to that makes maneuver warfare impossible.

[othyrsyde]

Originally Posted by Xen

Cuba almost always ends up as a state in the US or an independent CS

I agree with you on Cuba; and few take into account the very different culture that fills the island, then the largely Protestant, English Speaking, and firmly anti-misogynist US.

[maverick]

Originally Posted by othyrsyde

and firmly anti-misogynist US.

Because the United States of 1865-1898 was a paradise of equality and liberty for everyone?

[othyrsyde]

Originally Posted by maverick

Because the United States of 1865-1898 was a paradise of equality and liberty for everyone?

Oh yes indeed, just ask an Indian...well if you can find one

[Yelnoc]

Europe is always the most advanced part of the world.

Africa is always the least advanced part of the world.