Most Updated UCS

[Archangel Michael]

Originally Posted by Ski

Erm the thing about democratic China and Taiwan is that the ROC (Taiwan) was a authoritarian state after WWII for a long time then progressed into democracy like today so it is quite confusing to have a Taiwan and Democratic China colour. It would be best to have one key for different states and another key for political structure like democracy, communist state, theocracy etc. but a version of this political spectrum idea has already been done so maybe you could modify it. Other than that seems quite good.

Holy fuck, I'm having flashbacks to 2004!

[Zajir]

Moldova is not a communist, the communists lost the elections in 2009 and the country is now goverened by a coallition of of four parties non of which are communist.

Also Mongolia should not be shown as dominant party as from 1996 to 2000 the opposition Democratic Party has goverened.

[Iori]

I think so far the maps have been far to complex, IE having far to many different versions of one thing, some of which make little real sense IMO, so I decided to do my own take on it.


The outline color is the countries de jure system of government while the interior, and main, color represents the de facto situation.
In the cases of the UK and Mexico this shows that while they're both Dominated by two parties their are still minor parties with seats nationally and in some cases govern sub-national entities.

[wormyguy]

Originally Posted by Iori

I think so far the maps have been far to complex, IE having far to many different versions of one thing, some of which make little real sense IMO, so I decided to do my own take on it.


The outline color is the countries de jure system of government while the interior, and main, color represents the de facto situation.
In the cases of the UK and Mexico this shows that while they're both Dominated by two parties their are still minor parties with seats nationally and in some cases govern sub-national entities.

I'm not sure what universe you live in, but where I live China is not a democracy and it certainly is not remotely comparable with the US.

[Orioes]

Perhaps instead of a system of colors a system of icons representing different elements of the governmental system.

Thus instead of making a color for "Semi-federal constitutional monarchy with a democratically elected multi-party Westminster parliament and uncodified constitution" you have the symbols for Con. Monarchy, Semi-Federalism, Multi-party and Uncodified. If you want to show de facto and de jure you have two lines showing what it is and what it pretends it is.

Pros: You can paste it on to UCS maps as is.
No need for dozens of obscure colors to fit each peculiar form of government.
Cons: Size, applying them to the relatively small European countries is difficult (and impossible from some of the smaller ones) so you either put it in the key or in the cartographic equivalent of a speech bubble.

[Maharajah]

Originally Posted by wormyguy

I'm not sure what universe you live in, but where I live China is not a democracy and it certainly is not remotely comparable with the US.

I think we'll need three tiers of colors: Another for for the de jure de facto situation.

[Iori]

Originally Posted by wormyguy

I'm not sure what universe you live in, but where I live China is not a democracy and it certainly is not remotely comparable with the US.

It's not a democracy, no, but it does technically have multiple parties with the CPC being the dominant one.

I was gonna move the orange color to a second row and give it connecting lines to both democratic and non-democratic, but I'm sick, and I was about ready to pass out as it was.

[Orioes]

A quick implementation of my idea using blocks of color instead of icons. I choose the facets of government to represent at random so if someone thinks something else would be more edifying (system of law for example) please mention it. The last two facets (Political Parties and Ideology) don't quite seem to work to me as P.P. assumes something resembling modern political systems and I. is both limited in how accurately it can describe a country and assumes a TL where the major political movements are the same as OTL.

Anyway what do you guys think?

And please if you intend to comment on it focus on the merits or lack there of of the actual system. Not that my representation of country X is inaccurate.

[Transparent Blue]

This seems to have been "drowned out" in the previous debate, so I will post it again.

Here is the second draft of my proposal for a new section of the Universal Colour Scheme, the future.

In case you're wondering, the auxiliary colours are sort of like "custom" colours. They are used to show an entity that is important in a certain work but has no colour (e.g. to show an Argentinian client state). They provide the following benefits:

- Convenience.
- They stop the frequent creation of new colours for trivial places.
- They eliminate the practice of giving an important but unusual country a colour that only partially fits (i.e. "analogues" that bear only slight resemblance).

Feedback would be appreciated.

SVG file: Attachment 93633

[RMcD94]

I think Orioes is the best one. But for each category do a Non-applicable/other box.

[Orioes]

Originally Posted by Transparent Blue

Feedback would be appreciated.

SVG file: Attachment 93633

A good start though a number of those (Kazakhstan, Algeria, Vietnam) seem to be more the sort you would use the auxiliary colors for. Also I would avoid using blacks or dark grays for anarchy and the auxiliaries as they may be difficult to distinguish from the borders for both the editing program and viewer.

Originally Posted by RMcD94

I think Orioes is the best one. But for each category do a Non-applicable/other box.

Yes, I meant to include that (that is why Somalia's dominant ideology is blank) and will be sure to put it in in the next version.

What does everyone think the most edifying 3-7 traits to represent would be? I think the four we have right now seem acceptable though in the future I may split up Dominant Ideology into civil and economic traits and I may include a miscellaneous square for traits that don't directly fall into the other categories.

[Alex Richards]

A quick little thing showing the 5 current colours for Communist Factions. USSR and PRC colours shall be herefore reserved for a communist Russia/China. For an alternative, influential communist movement (Spanish, Hungarian, USA etc.) two alternatives are included. The final colour is for a communist state not alligned with any major faction (such as North Korea today).

[Transparent Blue]

Originally Posted by Orioes

A good start though a number of those (Kazakhstan, Algeria, Vietnam) seem to be more the sort you would use the auxiliary colors for.

Okay, thank you very much for your feedback.

What are the countries that you (and anyone, for that matter) think fall into that category, apart from those three examples?

[Trovador]

Transparent Blue, your idea is good, but I don't like two points:
-There are many countries with almost the same color, as the four green nations, or Japan-Australia-Russia (Japan and Russia are different, but Australia could be interpreted as any of them, at least in my monitor)
-You're introducing many new colours when there are already some tradition with other colours. For example, the venetian blue is the colour of European Union and an United Europe in most maps; the auxiliary colours, even if useful, are mostly used for Grossdeutschland, CSA and HRE, and could mislead those who would be reading the map. There's also already a brown'ish colour that is used, many times, to Australia, or the pale dutch-orange to South Africa...

The problem is that most of those "recorrent uses" are hardly never documented, so it's not easy to see what's established, and what is not

[ARR]

I apologize if I've revived a dead topic, but I ran into a snag while trying to make maps for my timeline: how do you decide which countries get their own color and which remain white? Why do countries like Mexico and Romania get their own color while Australia and Canada don't?

[Pkmatrix]

Originally Posted by ARR

I apologize if I've revived a dead topic, but I ran into a snag while trying to make maps for my timeline: how do you decide which countries get their own color and which remain white? Why do countries like Mexico and Romania get their own color while Australia and Canada don't?

It's entirely up to you - generally, only countries you want to emphasize or feel are important to the timeline/map get colors, UCS was only an attempt to standardize the common ones.

[strangeland]

Why are most people counting Japan and South Korea as conservative democracies? Both have extensive free speech and have had peaceful transitions of power.

re Mongolia: it's actually been one of the most successful post-Communist states, believe it or not, and developments there have generally paralelled Eastern Europe more than the former Soviet States. There have been peaceful transitions of power, and Freedom House classifies it as "free" unlike any of the 'stans.

[Helios Ra]

This thread is a bit inactive, but given the subject, it seemed to me that it would be relevant to post my own proposal for an improved UCS. This is just a draft, and there are a few more states that should be added to the boxes on the right. It's based on the maps from here and here, though I've added a few colors to mark nations that I felt should be represented. Any thoughts?

EDIT: Updated copy is on next page.

[Augustus Montes]

Originally Posted by Helios Ra

This thread is a bit inactive, but given the subject, it seemed to me that it would be relevant to post my own proposal for an improved UCS. This is just a draft, and there are a few more states that should be added to the boxes on the right. It's based on the maps from here and here, though I've added a few colors to mark nations that I felt should be represented. Any thoughts?

Attachment 97745

Wouldn't Iraq and Afghanistan be shown as American occupied?

[Ski]

Its all fine except a newer colour for Ukraine has been suggested on other maps. It is green too but much a lighter electric green. See link

http://www.alternatehistory.com/disc...postcount=3058