|
|
|
#5481
May 24th, 2011, 02:22 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
With the country in the middle of depression plus fighting criminal and subversive elements within the US, a new Southern "reconquest" is becoming more and more impossible
 The best case is to retreat from Mexico, but not all of it, get their puppet president to sign away the northern provinces in exchange for debts. "Relocate" the Mexican population south to their "own" country and you have thousands of square miles of land ready for explotation  
|
|
#5482
May 24th, 2011, 02:35 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I had believed it to be impossible for America to win the Big Southern Re-Conquest too. But it would be interesting to see them try. Either way America will be becoming a very bad place to live ITTL. Especially if you aren't white. I still think these disgruntled grunts are becoming a proto-Hell's Angels/Bonus Army organization. They could become the smugglers and soldiers of the new Mafia. Eventually probably turning on them and possibly the Mexican suppliers.
__________________
Editing rast's A Shift In Priorities. Redubbed Quote:
|
|
#5483
May 24th, 2011, 03:16 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Still really enjoying the TL, even if I'm not able to post as often.
I think it's important to keep in mind the special mentality of the ex-grunts, if they're anything like the Hell's Angels. They may be anti-social, but they're not necessarily anti-American. They feuded with the hippies and were often violent towards them. A group famously offered their services as an elite special forces unit in Vietnam. They probably primarily see themselves as capitalists working under a more primal law, but not one that would ever threaten their country. Obviously this is an alt-history, so things might be somewhat different, but since they're coming from a similar background as OTL, I think their strange sense of patriotism will remain the same. Not saying that'll stop them from doing business with the guerillas or that the feds will have the sense or the insight to see this crucial difference between them and the midwest gangs or the minority mobsters. Incidentally, if the new Irish/Italian/etc. mobsters are like their predecessors, they'll also be patriotic, and might even share information on their competitors. If they continue to prove willing to tone down the violence and cooperate with the feds, they could find themselves with a powerful ally against the more dubious Latinos, African Americans and midwest brigands. This could get rather unholy rather quickly, with the likes of Hoover (or whomever) as a sort of shadow gang czar, organizing criminal behavior in a "socially acceptable" way. I was pondering...as the situation worsens, the example of these "Robin Hood" gangs, which was culturally very strong IOTL, might grow even more concrete. We could see them repurposed as political figures, especially if they're "martyred." Populist politics, not necessarily left- or right-based.
|
|
#5484
May 24th, 2011, 09:01 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Some thoughts and observations:
1. Palmer is kidding himself if he thinks that the black gangs have little contact with the other gangs. The reality is that for obvious reasons they would have a hard time muscling into each others turf. So its easier just to do business. 2. The grunts/biker gangs regardless of any lingering feelings of patriotism never let that get in the way of making a quick buck. Opening up new drug markets, doing business with unsavory types and crossing every ethical line in the process would all be in a days work. That is if they are like OTLs Hells Angels just with a 20 year head start. 3. It may be neatly drawn up on a chart but that ignores the thousands of interactions every day. All of these people are talking with each other, even if its in the form of negotiations between armed camps. 4. The outlaws of the Mid-West main targets were banks, railroads, government and other symbols of power. With the depression deeper and longer lasting in TTL its entirely possible that a political element could come into play. In the very least if something happens that has all of them pushing in the same direction the results could be explosive. 5. The international angle. Max Bauer had best find a copy of Frankenstein because he is about to have his creation rebound on him. With the introduction of drug trafficking into the U.S. a new element is going to enter the scene, millions of dollars in profits. What's going to happen is that Bauer is going to discover that the pipeline he created during the T.A.W. flows both ways. When the Mexican guerrillas flush with cash arrive at his doorstep asking for all manner of ordnance, what's he going do, say no?
|
|
#5485
May 24th, 2011, 10:16 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
So, I must ask what is Mr. Smedley Butler up to ITTL.
__________________
Editing rast's A Shift In Priorities. Redubbed Quote:
|
|
#5486
May 25th, 2011, 05:07 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
#5487
May 25th, 2011, 06:20 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I had figured that Smedley Butler would be involved in rebuilding the USMC after the TAW or he would be in Asia like IOTL. Whether or not one agrees with his politics he was possibly one of the better administrative officers the US military has produced. That and in the wake of the TAW no one in Washington would commit career suicide by kicking a two time CMH winner to the curb for being right.
|
|
#5488
May 25th, 2011, 06:54 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
#5489
May 25th, 2011, 09:18 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
¡ HI ! ¡ WOW !, ¡ SCARY !
   .About that agency, they not see the dairy interactions between the distints criminal groups, and can´t see that criminality is on the rise because the economic disaster, if you don´t have work, and have alarming leves of poverty, for some time you can have valours and resist, but whith the pass of time and hungry, you know  , in any way, this criminal situation be really increasing the levels of violence, and maybe be afecting the capacity for comerce and economy, and because this situation be less and less money and resources for sustain the goverment and fixing the internal problems and sustain the external wars.And because the damm numbers of problems as economical disaster, internal crime and violence, loss of jobs, enviromental epic disaster, lost of farmers and cultivate land, external wars,etc.. i wonder if américa can survive as a united nation, or be broken in zones and groups, or their democracy or goverment falls, or the constitution and the bills of rights it be how to say, destroyed, in any way, in this magnificent timeline will see in América "interesting times" .Peace and good luck .
|
|
#5490
May 25th, 2011, 09:35 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
We just assume the drugtrade is bauers doing, i suspect that that was not something that needed to be introduced. There have always been elements that were prepared to do anything to make money. So am thinking bauer has nothing to do with it, it probably grew by itself due to the circumstances.
And why would the drugtrade have to cross the atlantic to mittel-afrika, I think it is already there. We saw in an earlier post that there is human trafficking, women/girls getting kidnapped to be used in brothels. So if that aspect exist, I have no doubt that there is also a drugscene. Maybe the ethiopian qat ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khat) becomes popular with the mittel-afrikan lower classes? edit: Quote:
Last edited by wietze; May 25th, 2011 at 09:44 AM..
|
|
#5491
May 25th, 2011, 09:56 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I require only three things of a man. He must be handsome, ruthless and stupid.
(Dorothy Parker) Harry Olsen felt torn between avarice and patriotism. The offer of the Mexicans was far too good to be ignored, but working for the enemies of the US? On the other hand, what business did the US have in Mexico and elsewhere in the south? The big bosses made the profits – and the poor grunts paid the bill. They had sent him, an innocent Midwest farmer’s son, drafted against his will, to stick it out in 1923/24 – fighting against these bestial Wetbacks. He could be glad to be alive still, but the large landowners, mine operators and oil magnates never had shown any gratitude in form of a bonus; they had just expected him to risk his bones for their benefit. Nor had Uncle Sam ever acknowledged his sacrifice. The war in Mexico had changed his life, had alienated him from his family and his former environment, and had made him a Disgruntled Grunt. The Mexican offer could transform his pathetic outfit – four guys and three broads, living from petty crimes and drug smuggling – into one of the most prosperous gangs around – and at the same time enable Harry to start a new life. Damn, he was close to thirty now, destined to become an old fart… – This was perhaps the last chance for a better life. The boys – Carl, Bobby and Ben – were quite calculable and not very bright; they were strong-arm men, typical bullies without any sophistication and higher aspirations. Compared to the girls, they were, however, intellectual light houses. Ginger was a lecherous analphabetic but sleeky bimbo, Ethel a boneheaded indolent hoe and Martha an infantile perverse teenage hustler. In short, the gang was just the ordinary trash that could be expected ending up in such a hopeless outfit… Fra Miguel wanted Harry to transport explosives and blasting accessories from Mexico to the US – and to hide the stuff at certain locations in Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and California. The initial amount to be transported was fifty tons, but more might be added later. Fra Miguel hadn’t said what he intended to do with these explosives, but Harry guessed that he intended to cut the rail lines from the US to Mexico. His powder monkeys would later pass the border controls disguised as simple seasonal farm workers carrying nothing but an austere food ration and a water bottle. The nice thing was that Harry could execute this job alone, while the gang continued smuggling and dealing drugs. He would take the pickup – and import ‘window putty’ from Mexico to the US, ready even to pay tax for it, in case some custom guys should see him cross the border. The operation would require several weeks, until the initial haulage had been distributed. – The payoff would be in gold, making Harry a millionaire. He could leave the gang to their fate, go to Hawaii or the Bahamas and live a life in luxury. – Yeah, a lazy life with some well-built hotties to care for his needs… A decent residence with a swimming pool, a cook, a driver and a personal secretary… Ginger had no idea what he had discussed with Fra Miguel. They hadn’t gang raped her, but had filled her up with Tequila and stoned her with hashish – and undoubtedly had interrogated her thoroughly about the gang, although she didn’t remember a thing. He had told Ginger – and later the gang – that the Mexicans were offering marijuana for three dollars per ounce, if the gang accepted at least five hundredweights – 500 pounds – per month. On this, Fra Miguel and Harry had agreed as cover story. This meant that the gang would be busy travelling to and from Cuauhtémoc all the time. And Harry had already found three gangs in California, who, deterred by the fifteen bucks to be paid in Hermosillo, were happy to buy the stuff for nine dollars per ounce from Harry’s outfit. Thus, the gang could make an easy living, even after Harry had left for his luxury mansion… The bottle was empty. Shakily, Harry rose from the rocking chair and stumbled into the house. Ah, yes, there was another bottle of whisky… Ignoring Ben and Martha, who were screwing vividly on the couch, Harry grabbed the bottle and staggered back on the front porch. Cheers! To a new life! – Harry removed the cork and drank from the bottle. Last edited by rast; May 25th, 2011 at 10:45 AM..
|
|
#5492
May 25th, 2011, 10:01 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
I seriously doubt the Mexican's plans are as simple or 'clean' as Harry imagines.
While he's probably right about the rebels intending to use the explosives to blow up the railways to hinder US logistics, I would be very surprised if it was the only thing they're doing with it. - Kelenas
|
|
#5494
May 25th, 2011, 10:21 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
What could cross the Atlantic, though, is cocaine and marijuana and the idea of producing drugs in Africa and selling them in Europe. I don't see Khat or the like becoming fashionable in Europe, but the traditional ones - opium, cocaine, marijuana and the like, are already known there. A cheap and steady supply could easily be established. And then we'll see COMECON anti-drug agents accompagnying Mittelafrikan Black-Prussian soldiers destroying drug farms in the neighbouring African countries...
|
|
#5495
May 25th, 2011, 10:22 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
The first rule of blackmail is to get the mark to perform activity that further implicates themselves. Damned if someone doesn't tip off the FSS that an American working with the Mexicans smuggled explosives into the U.S. and Harry had best continue to play ball or else he'll have the Feds chase him to the ends of the Earth.
As for Max Bauer I do not think he is aware of the drug trafficking in Mexico. It's sort of like old beer bottles left at a camp site, you don't know they are there till you step on one. Which is an apt comparison because there are interests on both sides of the Atlantic who would crawl over broken glass to get to the opportunities to be found in Mexico at this moment. There was a reason I brought up Frankenstein. Also how much do you want to bet that Harry is underestimating Ginger. Last edited by Peabody-Martini; May 25th, 2011 at 10:28 AM..
|
|
#5496
May 25th, 2011, 10:43 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
However, the training detachment in Venezuela knows what's happening - and they are very interested in learning more about it... Expect Olga Alekse'eva to become active soon.
|
|
#5498
May 26th, 2011, 07:42 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
¡ Hi ! to WIETZE: ¡ THANKS !
, opps, because i was to tired, i forget to say in my worries about America´s futures the options of inner colapse/inner crush, civil war, enviromental epic disaster, or some class of how to say, "SOMALIZATION" as desert with violent warlords fighting, you know, in any way, is suspect that Rast the great be doing some scary, epic and magnificent about America, in short, will see interesting times.Peace and good night .
|
|
#5499
May 26th, 2011, 07:53 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
¡ HI ! ¡ WOW !, ¡ SAD !, ¡ WOW !
.Yep, that´s the tragedy, if the cirscunstancies were a little diferent that Harry Olsen it be a real hero, with a decent work, a decent life, etc.. but that warrior how to say, the options for a decent life was closed by the great depresion, the economic crisis, the enviromental disaster, a blind goverment, etc.. the scary situation is that a lot of war veterans it be going in the Harry Olsen way of life, you know , and finnally, another big internal problem for USA: another scary big epic wave of terrorism, i wonder what be the objetives, the economy, historical monuments, ballot box, etc... .Is late, i going to sleep. Peace and good luck .
|
|
#5500
May 26th, 2011, 08:37 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Life is nothing but a competition to be the criminal rather than the victim.
(Bertrand Russell) With wonder, Don Lázaro Cárdenas, president-elect of the already liberated portion of Mexico, was looking at his visitor, who had introduced himself as John Rutherford – and was claiming to have subverted the US between 1923 and November 1925, in service of Pancho Villa’s revolution and the war against US intervention. “We smashed the US mobsters and replaced them with our creations, Latino and Negro crime networks. We were responsible that the US repealed prohibition on alcohol. And we created the US porn industry.” “Who’s we?” asked Cárdenas, noting that Rutherford was speaking excellent Spanish. “Well, that was a large-scale enterprise – directed by me. My chief assistants were Herbert Jones, William Ampleforth, and Robert Aaronson. – But at that time we were still known as Martin Ivanovich Latsis, Yakov Khristofovich Peters, Genrikh Grigor’evich Yogoda and Lavrentiy Pavlovich Beria. We were known to insiders as the Cheka Gang. – Sadly, Comrade Beria was killed as Robert Aaronson in the Second British Civil War.” “And you are suggesting to repeat your effort for the benefit of the Mexican Republic?” “Exactly, there’s a lot of work to be done. Unfortunately, the time was much too short to wholly and exhaustively subvert the US. Much of what we created in these days deteriorated afterwards due to lack of superior direction. – You know, in November 1925, with much help from the Russian Okhrana, FSS and FCFA cracked down on our support organisation in Panama, and we were forced to abandon operations in the US. – But quite a lot of our people escaped undetected – and may well respond to a certain signal and rally for a second round.” “So, what exactly would be the benefit of accepting your offer, Mr. Rutherford?” “Our organisation will be self-financing, no costs accruing to the Mexican treasury. Our aim is weakening the US from inside, corrupting their society until it breaks down.” “I concede that Mexico would be better off with a number of smaller northern neighbours – in place of the big, bad and brute Uncle Sam. Do you think you can achieve that?” “Difficult to predict… – But we can try it. A fragmentation of the US certainly will be a major improvement for Mexico – and the world.” “True. – But how will you accomplish that?” “First of all, addiction to heroin and opium must be fostered. – You know, your current drug smuggling focussing on marijuana and cocaine won’t really hurt the US. Neither the working man relaxing with a joint, nor the manager getting extra drive from a sniff do damage to the capitalist economy. But the heroin or opium addict is incapable of keeping up normal work routine. As long as he – or she – is happy, work doesn’t appeal at all; and when unhappiness and deprivation set in, the desperate hunt for the next shot – or the money to pay for it – forces the addict to steal, rob or prostitute himself. – Thus, heroin and opium damage the economy twice: By eliminating workers and by creating drug-related crime…” “I see. – That’s cruel, but will it suffice to bring down the US?” “Well, it’s a first step. – There are many fault lines that can be exploited. – We have the Ku Klux Klan, which is in league with the Southern elites, they are pro-prohibition and anti-drug; if drug abuse and alcoholism spread out from the big Northern cities they may have second thoughts about the Union. – Then there is the Midwest, where farmers – despite some dust storms – produce far more foodstuffs than the markets require, forcing prices continually down. These people are in a bad fix – and are prone to resort to violence. We can promote this development by targeting law enforcers – and making it look like they have been killed by gangsters. – And, of course, we can re-utilise our old Latino and Negro networks to further divide the ethnic groups. – Or we can take a free ride on Action La Salle; bombs exploding in the neighbourhood always drive US citizens to extreme and unwise reactions…” “Okay, Mr. Rutherford. The Mexican Republic will not know that your organisation exists, nor will it rush to your aid should you run into difficulties – or provide any funds for your benefit. But you also will not be hampered in executing your plans. You will be considered a private non-governmental organisation operating on an autonomous agenda without any connection to my government. – Thank you for your visit, and please keep me informed about your progress once a week, just out of personal interest.” On Saturday, July 30th, the secret signal was published in several important newspapers worldwide. And around the globe, quite a number of former Cheka Gang associates and former staff members of Ephraim Sklyansky’s cadre training unit were now waiting for the second signal, telling them where to go. In Byalistok, however, Fajga Mandlstajn, who was still recovering from the heavy wounds sustained in Spain, decided that this time she would not follow the call. The grievous injuries and loss of blood had made her survival a very narrow affair – and had entirely changed her perspective. Once she was well again, she would go looking for a decent father for the children she intended to have…
|
 |
| Thread Tools | |
| Display Modes | |
|
|
Linear Mode
