How about Mammoth Cavalry?

Since someone has suggested Bull Cavalry just recently, I am going with a sugestion first mooted in the ASB forum (as part of a shared worlds game). Suppose mammoths did not become extinct and managed to survive the end of the Ice Age, in some frozen polar/tundra region in the far north. What chances might you see of their being domesticated in the way elephants are, what might they be used for if so, and hypothetically, could one "do a Hannibal" with them? What are the possible drawbacks to this? (Size, possibilities of social groupings, differences in culture in mammoth areas, shape of tusks even?)
 
it wouldn't be 'cavalry' so much as 'mobile tower'.... like the OTL war elephants... they'd serve to put your archers up above the rest of the battlefield and scare the enemy horses, but they'd likely be a bit dangerous to your own side as well...
 
Well, it's hard to say. Elephants are tricky creatures, and even assuming that mammoths are domesticable (which is not a given - African elephants to all intents and purposes aren't), there would still be a few problems.

- elephants don't make good cavalry anyway. They are big, impressive, noisy and fairly useless, the Maus to the horse's T-34, is you will. Only males are at all aggressive naturally, and being large creatures without natural predators, even they tend to be fairly sanguine about their environment. If you are that big and strong, there really isn't a lot that you have to worry about, I guess.

- mammoths must have been eating machines. A body that big designed for living in low temperature requires huge amounts of food, and plant food doesn't have that many calories. Modern elephants tend to spend much of the day foraging, and even if given high-energy food they need to spend leisurely hours munching it (the same is true for bulls, BTW). So your cavalry will spend half the day or more ambling through the meadows having vegan lunch.

- mammoths were cold-adapted. An animal this big and this well insulated is likely to have overheating issues even in what we would consider relatively mild summers. Homo sapiens civilisation tends to thrive in temperate-to-warm zones. That means unless you either posit a major POD or a very modern timescale (with the appropriate technologies in place), potential mammoth riders will be nomadic groups with very few resources to spare, which means domesticating anything in the least bit impractical or difficult might just be out of the question. Your typican Nentsi family grouping can't devote the same time and dedication to the effort as an Indian kingdom or Mediterranean city state.

- mammoths might just be natural hippies, or completely intractable, or too stupid, or too smart, or too damn ornery. There is no way of knowing, but chances are there will be some problem, because most big animals have domestication issues.
 
the woolly mammoth of Siberia wasn't all that big, about the same size as the Indian elephant; in fact, DNA says that the two were very close relatives. Elephants may not be scared of much, but they are kinda twitchy to deal with... tamed Indian elephants occasionally go nuts and kill their handlers. Plus, they tend to spook at loud noises, fire, etc. They were notorious in ancient times for running amok on their own side after being panicked. Woolly mammoths were indeed totally adapted for cold dry weather, and couldn't take even temperate climes for long. For that matter, they couldn't take cold wet weather either...
 
Well, it's hard to say. Elephants are tricky creatures, and even assuming that mammoths are domesticable (which is not a given - African elephants to all intents and purposes aren't), there would still be a few problems.
African elephants are domesticable in the same degree as Indian cousins. e.g. Those used by Hanibal were African elephants.
 
African elephants are domesticable in the same degree as Indian cousins. e.g. Those used by Hanibal were African elephants.

*North* African elephants, extinct today. It is true you can tame African elephants, but as of today the effort involved is huge and the undertaking uncertain. It is possible they could be domesticated eventually, but the fact that it hasn't worked yet indicates that it certainly won't be easy.
 
*North* African elephants, extinct today. It is true you can tame African elephants, but as of today the effort involved is huge and the undertaking uncertain. It is possible they could be domesticated eventually, but the fact that it hasn't worked yet indicates that it certainly won't be easy.
They were of the same species. Well, AWAIK this still under debate there are one or more species of African elephants, but IMO they aren't very different in this regard. In cases, even they are a few, when this was tried they appeared domesticable. Now I don't have source on hand, but as I can remember this was done in Congo.
 
*Ahem*

The North African Elephant (Loxodonta africana pharaohensis) was a possible subspecies of the African Bush Elephant (Loxodonta africana), or possibly a separate elephant species, that existed in North Africa until becoming extinct in Ancient Roman times. These were the famous war elephants used by Carthage in the Punic Wars, their conflict with the Roman Republic. Although the subspecies has been formally described,[1][2] it has not been widely recognized by taxonomists. Other names for this animal include the North African Forest Elephant, Carthaginian Elephant, and Atlas Elephant. Originally, its natural range probably extended across North Africa and down to the present Sudanese and Eritrean coasts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_African_Elephant
 

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Well, the same issue has been discussed in Russian AH-board a hundred times already. Almost all the discussions ended up in confrontation between Russian heavy elephantery and Ukrainian armoured mammothery...:D
Yes, mammoths, like elephants, are tricky creatures. We simply cannot know their real behaviour. Still, I am inclined to think that they, by behaviour, were close to domesticated Indian elephant. That taken for a basic hypothesis, we can extrapolate now.
Firstly, mammoths were migrating animals and moved aft and fro across the whole European continent. That poses certain questions about possibility of their domestication and raising.
Secondly, (if we take that they were very much like Indian/Asian elephants by behaviour) their behaviour in the battlefield would be extremely unpredictable; fire, nailed boards, an occasional spear or a noise may make them uncontrollable, and acting on their own they would knock warriors off their back, trample the infantry behind them, make panic all over their retreat. Whatever mighty and horrific, these would never be reliable troops.
 
IIRC, the North African elephants were small, even smaller than Indian elephants. I always wondered if they tamed them back in those ancient days by bringing tamed Indian elephants and trainers over....
 
It's a matter of exposure to hominids. What we call African Elephants today, the sub-Saharan variety, had upwards of a million years of evolution side-by-side with proto-humans before humans began domesticating things. They have - like most animals in Africa - an instinctive reaction to the sight of bipedal apes. This was not true of Barbary, Levantine, Mesopotamian, and Indian Elephants, which is why all those were tamed and turned to war at one time or another. They lacked genetic.... "preconceptions" about humans to make taming and domestication more difficult.

Ever wonder why horses and donkeys (and onagers, heck) have been domesticated, but zebra haven't? Why we raise sheep and goats, but not gazelle? Why the main domesticables on the continent - African cattle and camels - are imports from the middle-east? Why domestication of dogs happened in southern China, and not humanity's cradle? It's all about exposure time.

That said, I'd more categorize (non-African) elephants as "possible to tame" rather than "domesticated." They don't seem to have been bred into something new. They just happen to be vaguely agreeable.
 
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