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#1
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A different WW1, now encompassing the entire world actually
A different WW1
WW1 starts off the same, ottomans join the central powers, and attempt at an attack on the suez. but this time, the arabs do not rebel. the sultan convinces them that he is on the side of islam, and to stay on the ottoman side. the arabs do not rebel, leaving many troops free to attack the suez. the ottomans attack but fail, just managing to push the british back a few miles. The Indo-German conspiracy a few years back took place, but it failed. again, the germans send a group of diplomats to convince the Indians to rebel. along with the ottoman declaration of jihad, the indian muslim army units rebel, and following their example so does the rest of the country. because of this there is no Mesopotamian campaign, as there are not sufficient troops. the rebellion in india ties down thousands of British, Australian and south African forces. the rebels manage to capture delhi, but the british control most of the country. The ottomans along with arab tribesman are able to push the british back to the canal, as the british are without the help of the australians (tied down in india) or any other british troops. but they manage to hold the canal. Gallipoli goes the same, as does the Western front. with germans making significant gains. In the caucasus, the ottomans make easy gains in armenia and azerbaijan, but cannot go any further. An Ottoman and German declaration convince Emir Amanullah Khan to attack the British. After seeing the favorable conditions he declares war and lets loose the tribals on northern india. he then sends his army, along with fierce tribal warriors to attack russia, and liberate the northern islamic lands. The ottomans keep trying to dislodge the british from the suez, but are unsuccesful. The ottomans incite the egyptians to rebel, and attack the british and they do. along with the german spring offensive and the Spanish declaration of war on britain, and its subsequent attacks on france and portugal, the british cannot make any significant commitment to egypt, and soon egypt is quicjly overrun by the ottomans and the egyptians. the garrisons are slaughtered and the ottomans once again capture egypt. Italy which controls lybia is on the side of the allies. italy fears that the ottomans will recapture egytp, as german equipment has breathed back much life into the ottoman military. spared much of the heavy fighting they pour troops into lybia and attack the ottomans. the ottomans arm the sanusi who keep the italians pinned to the coast. In the caucasus the ottomans capture much land, as russia is falling apart and facing war on 5 fronts. with the fall of the suez canal, the british cannot supply india as easily, and most of india falls to the rebels, who make plans of independence from britian. the Afghans capture samarkand and tashkent, as the russian resistance falls in the face of the brutal afghan tribal warriors, who know only to fight. The british soon send an entire fleet to the suez canal in hopes of recapturing it. realizing how much importance lies in the suez canal, the germans also send a fleet, along with some turkish battleships they fight near the mouth of the canal, in a desperate battle which sees all but 1 turksih and 4 german battleships left, the entire british battlelfleet is destroyed. the british give up on egypt, and focus all of their strength in europe and spain. With the british out of the picture, a joint german and tukish force under german command bravely captures triploi in italian libya, though most if libya continues to be in Italian control. After seeing the marvelous victories that the sultan has brought to the ottomans, many people eschew the young turks. the sultan is granted all power, but a consitution is still in place. realizing that the ottomans cannot win the war wothout islam, they change the name of the empire to the Ottoman Empire of Islam, to appease the conservative tribesmen in the areas they are fighting in. The sultan begins using the title caliph more than sultan. he then does a bold move, that none would have had thought possible. he enters into an alliance with persia, persia, parts of persia were occupied by the british and russians. the persians join the central powers, and along with afghan, turkish and german help they oust most of the invaders. Iran, And Ottomans sign a treaty promising to divide the caucasus in half, and Iran also signs a treaty with Afghanistan in which they divide uzbekistan and modern day turkmenistan. Now India had fallen, excpet for some pockets of British, Australian and South African control. Russia is in internal crisis, and France and Britain are strained by the costs of war. When the United States enters into war with Germany, because of the zimmerman incident, this tilts the balnce of power to a stalemate. the germans are prevented from making more gains in france, and spain is checked in portugal. Greece declares war on the Central Powers and attacks the Ottomans. The ottomans are now prevented from making any more massive gains in africa or the caucasus, as they send troops to threace to fight greece. the stalemate in greece between Bulgaria and the Turks and Greece stands Iran and Afghanistan make significant gains in Central Asia, capturing most of turkmenistan for Iran and most of modern day tajikistan and uzbekistan for the afghans, by now most of the caucasus is also captures by the turks. The bolshevik revolution makes peace with all enemies, letting them keep their captured territories, while the new russia focuses on internal problems. this leaves afghanistan and iran to attack british india. the turks now can transfer many troops to greece and libya. greece is quickly defeated and and opts for peace, rather than destruction, they cede small parts to both bulgaria and the ottomans. the greece affair is short and quick. Now the ottomans send troops to Libya, but the british from sudan and other african colonies keep attacking the ottomans. the ottomans send massive armies to the sudan, under the banner of islam they make a treaty with the natives, that they would be left alone if they fight the british. they are armed by germany and in the sudan rebellion once again ensues. The rebellion is quickly put down, and no other british or french colonies rebel, except india and algeria, led by Abd-el-qader's grandson they attack french garrisons and the Algerian french colonial army joins abd-el-qader, and they attack algerian cities controlled by the french. the ottomans provided with an inlet (granted by greece previously) m attack the balkans and annex a significant portion of albania and serbia. By now the ottomans and germans are in deadlock with the italians. the ottomans, free of fighting on all fronts except this one send all available troops to libya. along with german command they take libya in a fortnight and the italian garrison is ejected. Germany and Austria now provided with an easier route to attacking italy, besides crossing the alps transfer troops to libya and then attack italy by sea. the situation in europe is mostly a stalemate. russia has fallen, austria-hungary void of the russian and italian probelm, transfers troops to the western front aiding their german counterpart. In the middle east, all of the tribes of the interior in the arabian peninsuala join the ottomans and oust all british "infidels" from the peninsuala. Britain secretly makes a deal with germany, it would pull our of the war in exchange for leaving all its colonies intact. they do this behind frances back. the german and spanish assault on France succeds and they reach paris. from both sides. left with no choice france seeks peace and much of their colonial possesions and mainland territories are lost. withdraws and so does italy. The central powers end out victourious. The ottomans control many oilfields, and become rich. the germans are left the dominant power in europe and spain controls much of southern france and portugal. india is independent. they partition the country into two halves (much like modern day india)without any violence what do u think? i will upload map of results soon |
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#2
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#3
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ebrybody can read that map?
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#4
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if you cant read it right click and click on view image
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#5
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ottowank!!!!
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#6
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![]() ottowank? |
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#7
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#8
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what does ottowank mean?
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#9
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Unbelieviable OttoWank.
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A Cadet will not lie, cheat, steal, or tolerate those who do. Yeah, I tried that, didn't work out too hot. |
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#11
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Is that.... is that... is that.... Ot ot ot Ottoman Indonesia ??!!
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#12
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It looks like some one threw up then tried to make a map out of it.
Some parts are ok.
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Originally Posted by TheDifferenceEngine Communists don't care who has your toothbrush. |
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#13
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Mujahid786, if you're having trouble with making maps, I'd suggest paint.net, it's a good program for stuff like this. If you're satisfied with your maps, then ignore my suggestion, it really wasn't meant as an insult. Ignore Jay too, he's being a bit of a troll here.
As far as your scenario is concerned, well, some people have already brought up how it's making an Ottoman-wank type scenario. What they're saying when they use that phrase is that it's a scenario where the Ottomans do extremely - in their view excessively - well. Your POD - that's Point of Divergence, or thing you changed in case you're wondering - seems to be that no Arab Revolt occurs. That's well and good, indeed it clearly would've led to a more succesful Ottoman Empire. Heck, until the Arabs revolted, they were actually doing quite well against the British, holding at Galipoli and defeating any other invasion forces they faced. When the Arabs revolted, it was all over for them though. From this POD, you infer an Egyptian uprising and an Afghan/Spanish declaration of war on the Entente. The Egyptian Revolt concept is one that'd I'd agree would be a possibility, especially if the Ottoman Empire was doing as well as you had it doing in your TL up to that point. If the Turks had actually managed to get the concept of Arab nationalism involved in the struggle on their side, then so much the better - the Egyptian Revolt you envision could well have taken hold, although I would say that the idea seems a bit less plausible than your original POD. The Spanish declaration of war is where things seem to veer away from that which is probable. Spain at that time was very much a spent force - it was poor, unstable and its military was rather inept, as well as poorly equipped. You envision it making significant gains, and well, it just really isn't plausible that something like that would occur, since Spain was at that time not so far from its own Civil War. Sure, Spain might tie up some French troops, and it might prove a headache for the Portugese, but it'd not really be that much of a threat against the Entente, certainly not as much of a threat as you depict it being. The Afghan intervention was indeed a possibility, but you do two things which I would not agree with. Firstly, you've got all of the Afghans coming in as one, when in reality they were very disorganized - indeed, so strong were their tribal hates that it's actually quite likely that some tribes would have joined with the British as a result of the main Afghan tribes siding with the Central Powers. Then you've got the Afghans really running wild in Central Asia. Well, they'd probably be able to raid to their hearts content in Russian Central Asia - it's too big an area to be effectively managed by the Imperial Russians, especially when they're involved in a huge war in Europe, and the Tajiks are as always restless - a restlessness that could be played upon by the ethnically-Tajik tribes in northern Afghanistan. The significance of those successes, though, seem a touch overdone. The Afghan successes in India also seem a bit overdone. The British never made full use of India's population base, partially out of the Indian sense that the war was a European affair, and therefore their reluctance to become involved. If the Afghans went and got the Indians to think that they did have a reason to become involved, then not only would they probably become more friendly with the Brits, but it also would've been a simpler thing to arm some Indians to fight. The Australians and New Zealanders would've still been available for other theatres, in my opinion. Since your other points flow from those points, I'll just let it be with what I've said now. Please understand that I do not mean to sound hostile or in any way condescending. I'm just trying to point out some stuff I think you could improve in your TL. Well, that's my two cents worth, take it or leave it as you will.
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Respect one another - even if you disagree. That, I feel, is the best advice I can give.
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#14
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How about if you make an intelligent comment instead of a "drive by" criticism?
It's not unbelievable at all except for Indonesia. The Ottomans really did conquer the Caucasus in WWI, and the Arabian peninsula was technically Ottoman except for the coast from Aden to Qatar. If the Germans had won, there's no reason to expect Libya to not go back to the Ottomans, although I don't know about Algeria. |
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#15
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Quote:
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#16
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it does seem that i made a little mistake woth spain, but for the sake of the timeline lets make it so the spanish were properly armed at the time. they gained so much by picking up the scraps of the former french colonies in africa. |
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#17
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after ww1 and an astounding Central Power victory, the world was changed in a mere fortnight. The ottoman empire had wrestled its way back to being a foremost power, the germans had the french under their thumb and the austrohungarians had made an astounding victory against the russians. other minor allies such as Spain, Iran and Afghanistan had also gained land and resources from the Russian and French Defeats. India had fought its independence and had made a muslim northern country (pakistan) a hindu southern one (hindustan) and a sikh state in punjab province (khalistan).Though the rest of the british colonies had remained in their hand due to a secret deal with the germans.
in 1920, The British had been simmering due to the loss of India, their "pearl of the empire" they resolved to take it back even by force. they decided to invade from nearby burma. the british pushed into india and had taken the provinces of Assam, Adhar PRadesh and the eastern lying states. the combined forces of the threee new states were not enought to stop the british and the british pushed on reaching as far as madras. enraged, germany severs contacts with the uk in retaliation of attacking an ally. they also mass troops neear their border with burma from german indochina. Britain, scared of more conflict(as it was just recovering from the great war) backed out, retreating from india and, making peace. the indian states, fearful of another invasion, let ottoman and german techinicians and officers to train their army. in around 1923, the austro hungarian empire begins to break up, starting with the rebellions of the balkan provinces and the independence of bosnia, herezgovania, czechia and other provinces. the country fell apart, and the new states created were austria, hungary, czechia, etc. serbia and russia were quick to sweep up any of their lost territories, with russia retaking, the ukraine, and lithunia and poland. serbia overran most of the balkans, and making their long sought after slav kingdom of Yugoslavia. Germany, seeing the dangers of a russia and serbia against their borders took the austrian homeland, in the guise of "protection." soon germany would befall the same danger. 1930: THe communists in russia were eager to export their brand of government. underground communists were funded by the russians. an extreme crackdown on the communist parties led to rebellion by the communists and the populace that supported their ideas. the facist element of germany also took the oppurtunity of a germany in crisis and also put their arms in the fight. eventually taking over the entire german state. deposing the kaiser and the government, they deal with the comunists harshly and kill most of them in raids. adolf hitler quickly rises up the ranks of the party to become chancellor and brings his harsah methods of killing jews and other.... (u noe the story) Japan invades china, blah blah blah, Nazis kill jews, mussolini fights people, like in real timeline. Soviet nazi pact never happens, the germans take all of poland. the germans now having taken poland, and plan to attack france. the french plan to take back the lost territories. The spanish civil war which brought the facsist regime to power allies itself with hitler and along with italy, and germany it attacks france. the french army which had been building up since its loss in WW1 repels the spanish and italian attacks. though the germans quickly advance on paris, capturing it after a lenghty seige. britain which opted to saty out of the war, due to the spanking it recieved in ww1. but after bombs began to drop on london, britain swiflty entered the war, sending massive amoutns of troops to france, to recapture paris. Spain which focuses its atacks on portugal takes lisbon and then the rest of the country easily. the english bogged down in france send a small army, but it is later defeated. italy, wanting to revive its glory, attacks most of the balkans, taking albania and then attacking yugoslavia. yugoslavia joins the allies then and attacks germany from the south. Distracting german forces for some time. using this oppurtunity the british then take paris, and the lost french territories quickly. Meanwhile the soviet union remains neutral, despite its friendsip pact with hitler. Hitler demands the control of oilfields and so does britian and france, to fuel their jets and tanks. russia refuses and germany attacks them. the germans quickyl advance on russia. things happen much as real ww2. Now the ottomans and iran which both host tons of oil, comr from a lot of pressure from both sides. the ottomans refuse, and continue to stay neutral. germany and her allies enraged, decide to attack turkey. italy attacks the ottoman province of tripolitania, expecting a quick victory as in 1911, but the money from oil revenues and new military equipment decisively chases out the italians. the german from captured russian territory, advance on turkish held crimea and the caucasus. bribing iran with money and weapons, the latter declares war on the ottoman empire and attacks baghdad and the ottoman caucasus. the ottomans not able to withstand a double attack withdraw from the caucasus and retreat to anatolis. the italian armies attack the ottoman held lands in the balkans. The turks had reinforced these position immensely not wanting to lose their balkans holdings as well. the italians meet massive armies and are stuck in the ottoman portion of albania. jihad is once again declared on the christain invaders attacking the sacred lands of the muslims. Japan, which had joined the axis, conquers much of east asia, like in rel TL. they then attack ottoman indonesia and malaysia. They quickly conquer it as the ottoman garrison is quickly defeated. the ottomans wage a guerilla warfare, harrying japanese forces and supplies. The japanese enroach on all of south east asia. they then come onto the border with india. india decalres its neutrality, but the japanese do not respect it. they see indias resources as a prize and want to annex it. the south asian states of khalistan, pakistan and india fight the japanese and bog down their forces on bengal. the ottoman garrisons in their indonesian holdings are transferred to there, to aid the indians. the call for jihad is answered by the sunni afghan emir, who attack the heretic shia shah of iran. along with sovet forces, the tribal militias of afghanistan attack the iranian lands around the caspian. they tek most of it and the afghan emir attacks the iranian provinces of sistan, and balochistan, and khorasan. Pakistan also attacks iran from the west. the iranians in trouble are about to fall, but germany needing the oil of iran, sends massive troops numbering in the thousands to reinforce iranian positions. the ottomans quickly overrun khuzistan and capture tabriz. The russians conquer all of their caspian holdings, driving back the germans and iranians to ottoman held tabriz. the ottomans quickly capture the iranian provinces of baku and armenia. the iranians hold their own better in their historical heartland, driving back attack after attack, by the afghans, pakistanis, turks and russians. In the european front the spanish have taken tolouse and are in the proces of taking provence. the germans recapture paris and the british and french forces are driven to normandy, which is the only allied held part in all france. the vichy government controls most of france like real TL. in the balkans, the yugoslavian army is driven back to belgrade by the unstoppabel german froces. italy has taken bosnia and the ottomans have held out in albania. greece, joind the allies and reinforces the turkish postions along tirene. by now the japanese attack pearl harbour, prompting the americans into the war. the americans first attack the spanish held territories in africa, along with turkish and berber soldiers from the east. the spanish garrisons had been stripped to fight in france were easily overwhelmed and the americans captured their territories along with the ottomans. the american and ottoman army proceded to attack the iberian peninsuala, advancing from british held gibraltar they captured granada and cadiz after a short seige. the spanish outcry from the "return of the moors" (berber elements of the turkish army) prompted the spanish to withdraw from provence and fight the incoming invaders, the joint turco-american force along with the gibraltar garrison was halted near seville. in the east, much goes as real TL. the indian forces drove out the japanese, and captured burma from the retreating japanese. the indians instead of being embroiled in a lenghty seige opt for peace with japan, as do the pakistanis and sikhs. pakistan then turns all her full might towards iran, along with tribal and afghan soldiers they overran iranian balochistan. the turks which had captured the iranian half of the caucasus, attacked the german held ottoman territories, the germans were driven back to the crimea. but the germans had begun the invasion of britain. Spanish and German troops crossed the english channel, British troops fighting in the Normandy, Spain and Asia are recalled to defend the homeland. mass conscriptions begin, sending millions of men to the front. The germans are overwhelmed as the british use human wave tactics. mass panicking occurs in major cities, riots break out. most british infrastrucutre breaks down. though the military holds on, and pushes the germans out. the germans are chased back to france, where the british begin the liberation of france. Soon Hitler abandons his ally in the middle east. all german troops are pulled out. Iran soon falls, as four invading armies take tehran from all four different sides. The shah abdicates in favour of his young son Mohammad Reza Shah Pehlavi. The new shah is forced to cede Tabriz and the Caucasus to Turkey. The Russians gain most of central asia and The Northern Caucasus. The Afghans take Mashhad, and Samarqand, in Uzbekistan. Pakistani forces seize the Iranian Baluchistan. Now with Iran out of the picture, the Russians send reinforcements to break the Seige of Stalingrad. Turkey sends thousands of soldiers into the balkans to fight the italians. Now something worse happens. Tiger Tanks roll into Belgrade, proclaiming the new Facsists Repeblic if Yugoslavia. Yugoslavian troops are directed to fight the Ottomans. Turkish troops retreat to greece. GErman, Italian and Yugoslavian troops attack greece, and capture much of the northern regions. In the far eats, much goes as the real TL, Americans island hop with japanese. in europe, the Spanish are defeated in a series of battles by the american and british armies. The american soon capture madrid. The facsist leaders are killled and Spain switches sides to the Allies. Spanish troops begin battling Germans in France, much of Southern France is liberated with American Help. Russia begins a new offensive aimed at driving the germans out of russia for good. millions of men, tanks and planes ready for battle. Meanwhile the Italians try their hand in Libya once again, they attack libya, capturing tripoli. they soon capture the whole coast, and move east towards egypt.Ottoman troops halt the italian advance, and americans are called eastwards, to trap the italians in a pincer movement. Artillery and air bombardments weaken the italian armies. Soon the ottomans, and american begin their attack, they trap the army, and the italians surrender, this is seen as a major blow to the italians. public opinion begins to sway. Allied froces begin planning D-Day. Much goes as planned in real TL. in the eastern front same TL, Russians advance, so the british and americans. In the Balkans, Hitler sends all troops to combat the avance of the allies. the ottomans and greek troops make easy gains, liberating albania and belgrade. The Battle of Berlin begins, though now stiff resistance is met, and both sides do not make gains. the stalemate stays for more than a year. in the east, the americans drop the A-bomb on Japan, and the latter surrenders. The germans, still hold through, and allied forces retreat as a smaller bomb is dropped on berlin, but still massive amounts of people are killed. all german leaders die, and the war in europe finishes. The french gain back their lands, that were taken in WW1. The germans are in the same position as real TL, same as japanese. The soviets take much lost land that was gone in WW1. the ottomans, grant independence to indonesia, though gain some iranian lands. Afghanistan, pakistan, all make gains at the expnese of iran. most goes as real TL after the war. |
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#18
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how come hitler came to power in germany if they've won ww1?
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#19
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Map after WW2
jIm sure there doesnt need to be any explaining to the map. if anybody cant understand which country is whcih ask. |
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#20
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Basically, the whole influence of a stronger Spain would be hard to calculate. There would be, in my opinion, a good chance for the Central Powers also gaining some additional allies in the Balkans, or whatever. The whole affair brings up the infamous Butterfly affect - who knows what the world would look like, if the Entente had had to take into account a stronger Spain. Heck, French troops might've ended up on the border with Spain, which might've weakened the French at some key point... the possibilities are really more or less endless! Anyways, interesting stuff, eh? ![]()
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Respect one another - even if you disagree. That, I feel, is the best advice I can give.
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