AHC: Ottoman Empire falls by 1815
- Thread starter Will Kürlich Kerl
- Start date
The Serbian uprising coincides with the Montenegrin, Albanian, Greek, Bulgarian, Armenian and Macedonian, Arabian Peninsula uprisings. Egypt declares independence and clears the Levant from Ottoman control ending with a march to Constantinople. The Janissaries take control of the Porte and declare an new republic.
Or you could have Napolean deciding to make invading the Ottoman empire a priority instead of the Russian empire.
Err... what? Napoleon invaded Russia because Russia was trading with Britain, breaking the blockade of British goods to the Continent, and setting a 'bad example' for the other European powers.
Why on Earth would he attack the Ottomans?
Maybe his India-delusion gets a bit too out of hand, or maybe he decides that keeping Alexander I happy is more beneficial to France's interests than keeping Russia out of the Med.
Mehmet Ali initiating his bid for independence/domination is the other option.
Maybe have the French Revolutionary wars end earlier and without the rise of Napoleon so that the Austrians and Russians can focus their energies on dismantling the empire. Combine that with successful uprisings in the Balkans and Egypt as well as a possible invasion by Qajar Iran to recover Baghdad and we might just see an Ottoman empire reduced to at best, an Anatolian rump state.
John Farson
Banned
Was eliminating the Ottoman Empire doable by the early 19th century? Yeah, the days of Suleiman the Magnificent were long past, there was Napoleon's invasion of Egypt and the Empire had steadily been losing territory for over a hundred years, but I've always thought it still packed a bit of a punch... at least before the Greek War of Independence.
Would wiping out the family count so that the state has to get new rulers count? Because that is damn doable.
Thing is, the Korprulu's shtick was making the Sultan virtually powerless and ruling as Grand Viziers. They're not going to want to step into the seat themselves, they're going to want some poor bastard to sit there as their puppet.
On that Napoleon thing, what about the Russian accepting not to trade with Britain if Napoleon takes care of those pesky Ottomans in the balkans?
Trying to cement its hold and piss off the British by being a more direct menace on India, Napoleon agrees and invades, seeing it as a better deal as his men are experienced with fighting in the middle east climate, rather than in the russian winter
Trying to cement its hold and piss off the British by being a more direct menace on India, Napoleon agrees and invades, seeing it as a better deal as his men are experienced with fighting in the middle east climate, rather than in the russian winter
One could argue that the late 18th/early 19th century is the doable time for eliminating the Ottoman Empire, even more so than the period within which it was actually eliminated IOTL.
Provincial governors are setting up their own borderline-independent fiefdoms left and right; the army is weakened by a long and grueling reform process; even the Jannisaries are still around and they're at the peak of their counter-productivity; the subjugated peoples are even more restless and quick to revolt than they will be later on.
If multiple great powers concentrate on attacking the Ottoman Empire in such a state, who knows what might happen.
I think we're on the same page here--though I'd argue that the machinery of the Empire would probably survive this at this point.
My impression is that the Ottoman Empire only lasted so long as some of the great powers (particularly Britain) decided that it was necessary because of balance of powers reasons.
The idea of a deal between Napoleon and Russia where Napoleon helps Russia in exchange for Russia not trading with Britain is interesting. It would make an attack on Russia unnecessary.
The idea of a deal between Napoleon and Russia where Napoleon helps Russia in exchange for Russia not trading with Britain is interesting. It would make an attack on Russia unnecessary.
The Austrian could get control of the balkans.
For Napoleon that would be territory far away from the homebase with little strategic value to him and it is separated by the Austrian Empire.
They get what's West of the Hellespont, he gets what's south of Anatolia, modern Turkey is left there as a puppet state ruled by sympathetic but diminished rulers
For Napoleon that would be territory far away from the homebase with little strategic value to him and it is separated by the Austrian Empire.
They get what's West of the Hellespont, he gets what's south of Anatolia, modern Turkey is left there as a puppet state ruled by sympathetic but diminished rulers