Question
- Thread starter jczak97
- Start date
Hey thanks for the help first off.
Ok, so secondly, Some of the ideas I had were that the English would play a larger role in the civil war, not by direct invasion of the North but by supplying the CSA through Mexico.
During the Civil War, the Mexican Reform War it's the war where Maximillian was placed in charge of Mexico. During which technically it was England, France and Spain who invaded but UK and Spain didn't have the same plan Napoleon had. My plan was to have UK take Monterrey and the surrounding area and funnel in supplies to Texas fueling the Civil War.
Another idea I had, which is a little more of a long shot, is that Utah would join the CSA. I have a POD in mind where during the Utah War, things go south and some long lasting scars are embedded.
I sorta want to have the CSA survive, but I'm open to ideas.
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Anaxagoras
Banned
If they're going to directly support the South, there's no reason for them to do it through Mexico. It would be a simple matter for the Royal Navy to break the blockade at, say, Mobile. Besides, only a miniscule amount of supplies could get to the main battlefields of Virginia and Tennessee if they had to cross the Rio Grande and the endless plains of southern Texas, not to mention the great distance across the Mississippi River.
I can see the Mormons using the distraction of the Civil War to attempt to throw off the yoke of the federal government, but I don't see how this would actively aid the Confederacy.
Trench warfare was used on a wide scale during the war, especially in 1864/5. You mentioned Cold Harbor, but it was used on a much more extensive scale during the fighting around Petersburg and Atlanta.
For the Mormons, I was thinking more of a WWII allies situation. The South and the Mormons may not see Eye to Eye but they both have a common enemy in the union. Also, it would deplete some of the troops that are used to help fight the CSA by keeping them in the west.
The English navy breaking the blockade, I mean I'm thinking that's what I may have to do but I don't want them to have to go flat out and declare war on the US. Could they muster enough of a Pirate force to cause the blockade to slip up in enough places or would that be a little to extreme.
Finally, I really didn't know that Trench Warfare really was used aside for Cold Harbor. If that's the case I may make Southern Commanders a little more willing to use trenches.
I think I figured out where I'll start it, I'm thinking somewhere around the start of the 1800's
Just one more question Anaxagoras, would you be willing to help to help me with this.
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This was another idea that someone sent me. Granted I don't know much about the Abolitionist movement in England.
I'm thinking the CSA surviving is too much of an overdone wank, personally. If you can think of a unique/creative way to make it happen (other than simply 'UK INTERVENTION B/C UK IS DA BEST'), I'd go for it. Other than that, a TL where the CSA -doesn't- survive, but rather the ACW is a Pyrrhic victory for the Union (such that they're too weak to enforce Reconstruction, etc.).
A POD during the 1820s or something would be best, gives enough time for the South to build up proper strength and build alliances. Could have some OTL legislation pass, some not. Could have more foreign direct investment in the South by the Brits (in the case of a much more reactionary Great Britain---another POD idea).
Alternately, have the Brits never outlaw the Atlantic Slave Trade (by Abolitionist MP William Wilberforce, 1807 I think---have him die of his gastroenteritis or whatever he had), and the abolitionist movement dies in its cradle, pushing worldwide abolition movements back several decades (and thus push back the ACW, or at least make it not about slavery and more expressedly about states' rights---more states may join the secessionists in opposing the oppressive federal government).
Alternately still, or additionally, have a bigger domestic push against conscription in the Union such that their forces are significantly hampered or otherwise occupied putting down revolts in the North, allowing the South to gain more ground more quickly. This, combined with the previous two would be my choice for having the CSA survive. A reactionary Great Britain that has not yet outlawed slavery (something happens to twist moralism in the US, too) that's more willing to invest in the South (military investment most importantly, possibly help industrializing), plus a more unstable North, minus the moral highground of the Abolition Movement.
I'm thinking the CSA surviving is too much of an overdone wank, personally. If you can think of a unique/creative way to make it happen (other than simply 'UK INTERVENTION B/C UK IS DA BEST'), I'd go for it. Other than that, a TL where the CSA -doesn't- survive, but rather the ACW is a Pyrrhic victory for the Union (such that they're too weak to enforce Reconstruction, etc.).
A POD during the 1820s or something would be best, gives enough time for the South to build up proper strength and build alliances. Could have some OTL legislation pass, some not. Could have more foreign direct investment in the South by the Brits (in the case of a much more reactionary Great Britain---another POD idea).
Alternately, have the Brits never outlaw the Atlantic Slave Trade (by Abolitionist MP William Wilberforce, 1807 I think---have him die of his gastroenteritis or whatever he had), and the abolitionist movement dies in its cradle, pushing worldwide abolition movements back several decades (and thus push back the ACW, or at least make it not about slavery and more expressedly about states' rights---more states may join the secessionists in opposing the oppressive federal government).
Alternately still, or additionally, have a bigger domestic push against conscription in the Union such that their forces are significantly hampered or otherwise occupied putting down revolts in the North, allowing the South to gain more ground more quickly. This, combined with the previous two would be my choice for having the CSA survive. A reactionary Great Britain that has not yet outlawed slavery (something happens to twist moralism in the US, too) that's more willing to invest in the South (military investment most importantly, possibly help industrializing), plus a more unstable North, minus the moral highground of the Abolition Movement.