WI: Zhukov Rules after Stalin

Lets imagine now that Stalin and Beria never plotted against Zhukov after the Second World War, they do so out of fear of his power (which is why they got rid of him in the first place.)
Come 1953 and Stalin's death Zhukov is still Supreme Military Commander of the Soviet Occupation Zone in Germany, and also its Military Governor.
IS their anyway we can use this to get Zhukov into power by at least 1955?
And if so what are the results?

The Soviet-America relationship should have developed well if Eisenhower and Zhukov had continued to work together.
—Lucius Dubignon Clay.

Zhukov and Eisenhower were personal friends. In fact Zhukov and Eisenhower even toured the Soviet Union together in the immediate aftermath of the victory over Germany. While Zhukov established good relations to all of his Allied counter parts his relationship with Eisenhower was the closest even going as far as to exchange views about matters such as judging war criminals, rebuilding Germany, relationships between the Allies and defeating the Japanese Empire.

Could a Zhukov leadership stopped the cold war?

Very interesting idea.

Rather than the 'What If It Happened' school of thought, I prefer to follow the 'Why Didn't It Happen' concept.

IE - What is required to prevent Stalin and Beria killing Zhukov? He is a big threat to Stalin's power hence he was eliminated.

If you can find a way for him to survive that doesn't involve tearing the Soviet Union apart at the same time you could have a very interesting TL.

DevonPasty said:

Very interesting idea.

Rather than the 'What If It Happened' school of thought, I prefer to follow the 'Why Didn't It Happen' concept.

IE - What is required to prevent Stalin and Beria killing Zhukov? He is a big threat to Stalin's power hence he was eliminated.

If you can find a way for him to survive that doesn't involve tearing the Soviet Union apart at the same time you could have a very interesting TL.

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Zhukov wasn't killed you know. He was just dismissed from the governing of the Soviet Occupation Zone in Germany... he lived until 1974...

DevonPasty said:

Very interesting idea.

Rather than the 'What If It Happened' school of thought, I prefer to follow the 'Why Didn't It Happen' concept.

IE - What is required to prevent Stalin and Beria killing Zhukov? He is a big threat to Stalin's power hence he was eliminated.

If you can find a way for him to survive that doesn't involve tearing the Soviet Union apart at the same time you could have a very interesting TL.

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Yeah as Comisario mentions he didn't die but was politically outplayed. Had he been able to keep hold of his power over the Red Army he could have made a powerplay after Stalin, OTL he was excluded to the Urals were beria saw him as his biggest rival. Yet Zhukov still managed from this weaker position to help Khrushchev kill Beria (for being a british spy ) and stopped a Pro-Stalin coup against Khrushchev by threatening military action.

But if we keep him in power then he could take over the USSR,a more friendly regime to the west in the 50's-70's

First of all, prejudice against the Napoleonic figures in the USSR was very strong, so IMHO, Zhukov coming to power after Stalin is highly unlikely and improbable event. Secondly, the distrust among the Cold War rivals was deep and I don't think a single individual or a few would be able to thwart it.

Again with "Red Army in control" idea? I mean seriously, RA was not German, Pakistani or some random African nation military itching to get in power.

At best RA is going to act during a coup to either help it or halt it but will not go for ultimate prize itself.

And neither did Soviet Union have a history of military rule or military interfering with those in power.

aktarian said:

Again with "Red Army in control" idea? I mean seriously, RA was not German, Pakistani or some random African nation military itching to get in power.

At best RA is going to act during a coup to either help it or halt it but will not go for ultimate prize itself.

And neither did Soviet Union have a history of military rule or military interfering with those in power.

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I dont aim for Zhukov to become a military dictator with the Red army in Control. But have Zhukov not the Red Army in control. Like how Beria not the NKVD tried to become leader.

As for would the Army help in a coup?
The 4th Guards Kantemirovskaya Tank Division or the 2nd Guards Tamanskaya Motor Rifle Division helped in the August coup so historical evidence says they would. (Even though that coup is entirely different)
Zhukov as Minister of defence used the threat of the Red Army against Stalinists many times.

Danth said:

I dont aim for Zhukov to become a military dictator with the Red army in Control. But have Zhukov not the Red Army in control. Like how Beria not the NKVD tried to become leader.

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And how do you separate the two? Zhukov could, in theory, resign from military and get some civilian post. But he'll be at a disadvantage against people who were already in place and had their own base of support. Same thing if he goes for supreme position from his position as defence minister.

So either way he'll lack significant support from state aparatus and only advantage he has is his military background and standing within military. In other words, he can only get there with Red Army coup.

Danth said:

As for would the Army help in a coup?
The 4th Guards Kantemirovskaya Tank Division or the 2nd Guards Tamanskaya Motor Rifle Division helped in the August coup so historical evidence says they would. (Even though that coup is entirely different)
Zhukov as Minister of defence used the threat of the Red Army against Stalinists many times.

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However the big difference is that military would back one side and get/keep that in power rather than install themselves there.

What if Stalin lives a few years longer.
He begins his long awaited second purge and as some historians have argued Stalin begins to send millions of Jews to four large newly built labor camps in Western Russia.
Could Zhukov have been forced to act if he had the Red Army on side.
With the Moscow Garrison on side the Kremlin is occupied by the garrison on the pretext of protecting the Politburo and Stalin but in reality place Stalin, Beria, Molotov and other hard core Stalinists under arrest.

Danth said:

What if Stalin lives a few years longer.
He begins his long awaited second purge and as some historians have argued Stalin begins to send millions of Jews to four large newly built labor camps in Western Russia.
Could Zhukov have been forced to act if he had the Red Army on side.
With the Moscow Garrison on side the Kremlin is occupied by the garrison on the pretext of protecting the Politburo and Stalin but in reality place Stalin, Beria, Molotov and other hard core Stalinists under arrest.

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Why would Zhukov intervene? He's a Soviet general, hardly some giant champion of human rights.

Zhukov's other problem is that he never displayed the level of political skills needed to take and hold power. Even Kruschev, who outmaneuvered Zhukov handily when he decided he was too dangerous, eventually got deposed by Brezhnev. Zhukov would be eaten alive if he tried to make an independent power play.

Just a Rube said:

Zhukov's other problem is that he never displayed the level of political skills needed to take and hold power. Even Kruschev, who outmaneuvered Zhukov handily when he decided he was too dangerous, eventually got deposed by Brezhnev. Zhukov would be eaten alive if he tried to make an independent power play.

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This, more then anything else, is what dooms Zhukov from ever being leader of the Soviet Union. The man was a supremely professional soldier... and that is about it. He was not a politician and did not know how to work a political system.

Maybe after Stalin set up a triumvirate, with Zhukov leading the Military side of it.

Just a Rube said:

Why would Zhukov intervene? He's a Soviet general, hardly some giant champion of human rights.

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He has seen how these Stalinist purges tend to develop in the past, so he will have very little doubt about his eventual survival.

The reason he can tell himself is easy: The boss seems to have lost his marbles so we need to act before he endangers the Rodina by destroying the red Army (again)

Could someone else have used Zhukov as a front-man? Put the war hero out for the public, but meanwhile do the dirty politicking behind the scenes?

It would have to be, presumably, someone Zhukov would have trusted, or at least be willing to cooperate with for the good of the Rodina.

cpip said:

Could someone else have used Zhukov as a front-man? Put the war hero out for the public, but meanwhile do the dirty politicking behind the scenes?

It would have to be, presumably, someone Zhukov would have trusted, or at least be willing to cooperate with for the good of the Rodina.

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Would anybody go for it? Russia doesn't excaally have a history of puppets, people who wanted to rule got their asses on top for theselves.

Plus whoever would be pulling the strings would be paranoid enough to worry that Zhukov might cut them at some point and turn against him.