Retrospective US Presidential Election Results Thread

[The Red]

Originally Posted by Turquoise Blue

No. I was thinking, that Germany would go Communist, but a nastier form of Communism. The positions would be switched, you see...

I see, how does Eisenhower win on this war record then? I guess he could actually get sent to fight in WW1 in this TL, but he would only be a 2nd Lieutenant...

[Nerdlinger]

Crystalism? Makes it sound like a fantasy TL....

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by The Red

I see, how does Eisenhower win on this war record then? I guess he could actually get sent to fight in WW1 in this TL, but he would only be a 2nd Lieutenant...

Commie Germany starts WWII, by invading Bohemia (Czech half of Czechoslovakia in OTL) Due to the European powers more distrusting of Communism then Crystalism they declare war. The USA intervenes when Communist Germany tries to contact American Communists, like Foster, and Japan successfully takes over Hawaii. Japan and Russia had an ALT Sino-Soviet split earlier, so Russia fights against Japan, and Japan makes a deal with Commie Germany to fight Russia on two sides.

France is half-occupied, half-free (No Molotov-Ribbentrop, y'see) when Ike arrives. Franco-British forces has been holding off the Germans for a long while.

Eisenhower leads the Allied Forces in liberating Paris, Brussels, Berlin and Poznan from Communist oppression. Crystalist Russia takes East Poland and makes it a puppet.

Italy backstabs Germany in 1943, and switches to the Allies, overthrowing its Communist regime and restoring the Monarchy.

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by Nerdlinger

Crystalism? Makes it sound like a fantasy TL....

Well, Communism in an alternate universe sounds a little too friendly and cute, being about communities and all... Crystal white, you see...

[The Red]

Originally Posted by Turquoise Blue

Commie Germany starts WWII, by invading Bohemia (Czech half of Czechoslovakia in OTL) Due to the European powers more distrusting of Communism then Crystalism they declare war. The USA intervenes when Communist Germany tries to contact American Communists, like Foster, and Japan successfully takes over Hawaii. Japan and Russia had an ALT Sino-Soviet split earlier, so Russia fights against Japan, and Japan makes a deal with Commie Germany to fight Russia on two sides.

France is half-occupied, half-free (No Molotov-Ribbentrop, y'see) when Ike arrives. Franco-British forces has been holding off the Germans for a long while.

Eisenhower leads the Allied Forces in liberating Paris, Brussels, Berlin and Poznan from Communist oppression. Crystalist Russia takes East Poland and makes it a puppet.

Italy backstabs Germany in 1943, and switches to the Allies, overthrowing its Communist regime and restoring the Monarchy.

Very nice, Japan seems to be a lot stronger in this TL, has this to do with US meddling?

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by The Red

Very nice, Japan seems to be a lot stronger in this TL, has this to do with US meddling?

I haven't detailed that bit yet, but possibly.

[snerfuplz]

Given the domination of the Federalist Party in the beginning I would argue that all parties would probably be supportive of an increased role of the United States government. The Bank of the United States would also have survived more or less in its original form. Would explain why big government socialists are popular in this ATL while OTL politics was dominated by small government Democratic-Republicans. Also given the amount of Liberty candidates I would expect the Western United States is dominated by Native Dependent Republics which are probably subject to some form of assimilation much to the ire of the tribes or segregation but that is unlikely given the more racial tolerant this USA is compared to OTL.

The tricky part is the rise of the Greenback Party but I assume a more destructive Civil War, after all the goal this time would be to end slavery and white supremacy, would mean less gold for the United States. Granted my expertise on the gold standard is limited so I am not sure if less gold reserves would force the United States to adopt a greenback as an official currency of sorts. Perhaps the British Empire does this during a more destructive Napoleonic War setting a precedent for greenbacks.

One point about the Greenbacks I am going to think of them as an alliance between moderate progressives and socialists. Both groups are united to create a greenback and various other labor rights but after the success of introducing a Greenback of sorts the party reforms under the Union Labor still a union party of Progressives and Socialists. However, a split was inevitable as the Socialists wanted more reforms and the Progressives balked. The president at the time was part of the Progressive faction and used most of the old party apparatus to allow his successor to win under the Populists. The Socialists create their own party as the Socialist Labor Party, recalling the Union Labor Party. In 1900 Debs, the leader of the Socialist Labor Party, changes the name to just Socialist Party. TR, who now dominates the old Populist Party, leads an alliance with Republicans to win under the Republican ticket. However, this alliance proves unpopular, and split between moderates (social democrats esque) and more conservative progressives (social liberalism), leading to Debs being re-elected. Debs and TR in this TL are both considered among the preeminent statesmen similar to Gladstone and Disraeli.

Oh I assuming if a party like the Greenbacks and Populists win elections back to back they must be doing something right policies wise same with Socialist Labor in 1896 followed by the Socialists in 1900

Also I am leaning to a war with Mexico revolving around American fears of a Conservative (not in the American sense but in the Mexican sense) government and thus supports a liberal insurrection to root out "aristocrats" and "solve the plight of the Yaqui and Maya among other native tribes" given USA love for tolerance in ATL. Of course wanting to grab territory is on the mind as well

Just some thoughts for now

[freethinker]

Originally Posted by Turquoise Blue

No. I was thinking, that Germany would go Communist, but a nastier form of Communism. The positions would be switched, you see...

that would be interesting... I love seeing Reagan be torn apart in different quarters .. always

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by freethinker

that would be interesting... I love seeing Reagan be torn apart in different quarters .. always

Yeah. By the way, an important consequence of my write up is that the colour most associated with fascism is not gray, but white.

[freethinker]

So the average person will see Monarchism and Fascism as the same things in this TL. I wonder if International Pressure will cause the end of the British Monarchy

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by freethinker

So the average person will see Monarchism and Fascism as the same things in this TL. I wonder if International Pressure will cause the end of the British Monarchy

Well... That might happen. Who knows, in this world, there might be no Monarchies at all, in the present day...

[QuoProQuid]

Not to butt in to the current conversation, but I have a question about the 2012 Retrospective Election that will happen (eventually).

Assuming that Americans Elect gets the 1% of the vote to qualify, what would happen should they win the election? They are going to be listed on the Presidential ballot in a majority of states... but without a candidate.

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by QuoProQuid

Not to butt in to the current conversation, but I have a question about the 2012 Retrospective Election that will happen (eventually).

Assuming that Americans Elect gets the 1% of the vote to qualify, what would happen should they win the election? They are going to be listed on the Presidential ballot in a majority of states... but without a candidate.

*gulp* If that happens... Well... We're fucked. We'll just leave America in a constitutional crisis, and focus on the TLs.

[Jasen777]

Their elector slate could be listed easily enough.

[Stolengood]

Originally Posted by Nerdlinger

Crystalism? Makes it sound like a fantasy TL....

Crys-STAL!

[Fleetlord]

Originally Posted by QuoProQuid

Not to butt in to the current conversation, but I have a question about the 2012 Retrospective Election that will happen (eventually).

Assuming that Americans Elect gets the 1% of the vote to qualify, what would happen should they win the election? They are going to be listed on the Presidential ballot in a majority of states... but without a candidate.

Will Americans Elect still have their ballot spot without a candidate?

Even if they do, I honestly don't see them breaking the 0.05% without a candidate. Americans Elect will die as it lived... with nobody giving two shits about them.

[metastasis_d]

Originally Posted by Turquoise Blue

Well, Communism in an alternate universe sounds a little too friendly and cute, being about communities and all... Crystal white, you see...

You really should have asked if we were clear, to which we could have replied crystal.

[JSmith]

Originally Posted by snerfuplz

Given the domination of the Federalist Party in the beginning I would argue that all parties would probably be supportive of an increased role of the United States government.

This is what I was thinking.If this isnt the POD of the ATL its almost certainly the MO of the ATL

[Nerdlinger]

Originally Posted by QuoProQuid

Not to butt in to the current conversation, but I have a question about the 2012 Retrospective Election that will happen (eventually).

Assuming that Americans Elect gets the 1% of the vote to qualify, what would happen should they win the election? They are going to be listed on the Presidential ballot in a majority of states... but without a candidate.

The cutoff is 0.05%. I've only included parties with actual candidates. For example, "unpledged Democratic electors" received 0.42% of the national vote in 1960, but I didn't put them in the poll.

[Turquoise Blue]

Originally Posted by Nerdlinger

The cutoff is 0.05%. I've only included parties with actual candidates. For example, "unpledged Democratic electors" received 0.42% of the national vote in 1960, but I didn't put them in the poll.

Yeah, but that's not a real party, isn't it? But the Americans Elect Party is...