Map Thread IX

[Simreeve]

Okay, admittedly I haven't posted much yet in the 'Wider Still, And Wider' TL that I started a few weeks ago, that's because I got bogged down in deeper research for it. However one thing that I have been doing, off-site, is continuing to develop its maps. This is an updated version of the map that I posted before, for 1913 (specifically the end of June in that year), which is the latest point in TTL's history for which I've got anything worked out.

The main POD was King George II of Great Britain dying over a decade earlier than happened IOTL, leading to the succession of his son Frederick rather than the latter's son George [III]. Frederick, and his prime minister William Pitt, managed to make a deal with the American colonists before discontent in the colonies escalated too far: 'America' was granted what we would basically recognise as 'dominion' status, and Britain reduced its protection for those of the native tribes with whom we didn't already have good treaties. With that problem solved, the Empire had just enough of an added edge (compared to IOTL) to fare even better than was historically the case in our own TL when the next crisis arose... and success, to some extent, continued to breed further successes. I'm not saying that everything went well for them, certainly not, but some of you would probably label the thread a 'Britwank' anyway...

(Oh, and ITTL a certain 'Napoleone Buonparte' fought for the Kingdom of Sardinia rather than for -- or as ruler of -- France...)


There was a 'Six Years War' -- sometimes called 'The Great War' -- fought during the period 1906-1912, and this map shows the situation after most of the peace treaties have been ratified and carried out.
Winners: The British Empire (both in general, and for some of its 'realms'), the German Confederation, Italy, the Netherlands, Denmark-Norway, Sweden (now with added Finland), Roumania, Greece, Portugal, Japan, Siam, American Federal Republic of Missouri.
Losers: France (now not only minus almost all of its own former empire but with the motherland largely under foreign occupation too), Prussia, the Russian Empire, the Ottoman Empire, Spain, Mexico, Gran Colombia, Persia, Afghanistan.
'Survivors': the trio of Hapsburg-ruled kingdoms in central Europe.
New nations: Poland, Jugoslavia (basically Serbia + Bulgaria; mostly under Ottoman control pre-war), Hashemite Arab Kingdom (most of Syria, Jordan, & Iraq; ditto), Estonia,Venezuela (as an Imperial client-state), Transcaucasia (basically Georgia + Armenia, mostly under Russian rule pre-war but also with gains from the Ottomans; 'Red'), Azerbaijan (formerly Russian-ruled, now effectively an Ottoman protectorate).

Colouring on the map is basically as per RCS, although with the shades which that allocates to Australia re-assigned to TTL's 'Kingdom of America' instead (and the area that's actually in the RCS 'American states' shade being the breakaway nation of 'Missouri'...), with a few of the recently-suggested additions (the most obvious ones used here being, I think, those used in the cases of the UPCA and of the nation including what IOTL we'd call Uruguay) too. However the only truly-'Unorganised' territory left is Antarctica and so where the shade designated for that status appears elsewhere on this map it actually signifies 'International' control of some kind -- or, where it outlines filling in a particular nation's colour, rule by that nation under a mandate from the newly-established 'Council of Nations' -- instead.

[Clandango]

May I ask why North America is so fractured?

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Clandango

May I ask why North America is so fractured?

Quebec didn't want to share a goverment with the 'American' colonies, so Canada became a 'realm' (i.e. 'dominion') separately from them and later on. British & American forces subsequently added 'Louisiana' (in the wider sense) to 'America' too, but the northern section of this -- the bit in RCS 'American' colours -- was eventually allowed to become a separate nation and a republic, under the name of 'Missouri', although it's still allied to the empire: It should have been included separately in the list of 'Winners', which I'll edit accordingly after making this post. More intensive settlement in that nation earlier on than for the corresponding area IOTL reduced the extent of American migration even further westward into the Oregon country, which consequently chose to combine with the British colonies of 'Columbia' and 'New Albion' in a separate 'Kingdom of Columbia' instead when that was suggested in the 1850s. The province of 'New Mexico' is separate from both America and Missouri (which effectively share control over it), and from Columbia too, because those nations can't agree on how to divide it up between them.

[Kaiphranos]

Originally Posted by Simreeve

Okay, admittedly I haven't posted much yet in the 'Wider Still, And Wider' TL that I started a few weeks ago, that's because I got bogged down in deeper research for it. However one thing that I have been doing, off-site, is continuing to develop its maps. This is an updated version of the map that I posted before, for 1913 (specifically the end of June in that year), which is the latest point in TTL's history for which I've got anything worked out.

Is there supposed to be some sort of key for those letters in 'Missouri'?

[Tallest Skil]

Originally Posted by Simreeve

Map

The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation!

Official name: "The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation, and the Netherlands, too."

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Kaiphranos

Is there supposed to be some sort of key for those letters in 'Missouri'?

Oops! Those are basically just there, in that version, as a reminder to me. They're the first letters of the states' names: F => Franklin, M => either Madison or Monroe (I haven't decided yet), W => Washington, A => Adams (after John, not Samuel), the more easterly of the two 'J's => Jefferson and the more westerly one => Jackson, and L => Lee.
There was briefly a 'B' (=> Burr), but only briefly...

[TurkishCapybara]

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil

The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation!

Official name: "The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation, and the mostly independent Netherlands, too."

I think that makes more sense.

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil

The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation!

Official name: "The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation, and the Netherlands, too."

Ummm... To be honest, I'm not quite sure offhand where those shades came from as it apparently wasn't RCS, but they're meant to be generic 'British Dominion' shades (one for provinces, one for territories) which I'm currently using for three separate 'realms' within the Empire -- Columbia (western North America), Terrae Australis (Australia, apart from the west, and New Zealand), and the Philippines -- that aren't yet quite fully independent enough to be shown with separate shades of their own.
I agree that the main shade used there is regrettably close to the RCS shade for the Netherlands, too, and I'll change over to the RCS-approved ones instead before next time I post any version of this map. If by 'Cong' you were referring to Cambodia, that is actually in 'Netherlands influence' shade because the Dutch now have a protectorate over the country following their defeat of the former French colonial regime during the recent war...

[Xhavnak]

Originally Posted by Simreeve

SNIP

Interested in the independant Estonia sitting on its own there - any particualar reason it has managed to stay free ?

[Klisz]

Originally Posted by PRFU

If you're so concerned then allow more than one attachment per post.

The maps you posted weren't even attached to the posts you posted them in. You could have posted them all at once.

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Xhavnak

Interested in the independant Estonia sitting on its own there - any particualar reason it has managed to stay free ?

Allied intervention during the ongoing break-up of the Russian Empire, and strong support within the empire's Scandinavian allies for its regained independence to be recognised. The colour that I've used for it is supposed to denote influence of Denmark-Norway, and it's actually becoming a sovereign Principality under a spare member of that kingdom's royal family.

[Xhavnak]

Originally Posted by Simreeve

Allied intervention during the ongoing break-up of the Russian Empire, and strong support within the empire's Scandinavian allies for its regained independence to be recognised. The colour that I've used for it is supposed to denote influence of Denmark-Norway, and it's actually becoming a sovereign Principality under a spare member of that kingdom's royal family.

Interesting, how did the Russians manage to hang onto Latvia - was there not the same level of support ?

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Xhavnak

Interesting, how did the Russians manage to hang onto Latvia - was there not the same level of support ?

There was a larger 'White Russian' military force there, and more dissension between different factions -- White Russian, Red, Lettish nationalist, pro-Prussian -- too, so as the allies don't want either the Reds or the Prussians to seize it they're currently backing the 'White' governor as the least of three evils. This situation might well change on any later maps, but my next project on this theme (apart from adding a key to this one) will probably be a 1905 map to show the pre-war situation instead.

[kasumigenx]

This is a Map of Europe after the Mongols decided not to Withraw in Eastern Europe after the Death of the Khan causing more destruction in Europe and the Mongols even attack Italy, after the Invasion Poland and Hungary lost territories which became Vassal to the Mongols.

[Simreeve]

Originally Posted by Simreeve

Ummm... To be honest, I'm not quite sure offhand where those shades came from as it apparently wasn't RCS,

I've looked again, and actually it is from RCS but for South Africa (which explains the similarity to the shade for the Netherlands, I suppose) rather than 'generic British Dominion': Probably I originally chose to use this for Columbia because one of the 'gBD' shades was too similar to one of those for Canada for my liking, and then used it for those other two Realms too because they and Columbia are all at about the same level of self-government...

[Numb]

Originally Posted by PRFU

Last one!

here, i made a moving gif for you:

[PRFU]

Originally Posted by Beedok

Posting them in their own thread would have been a good idea. Here no one who will want them will ever find them because by tomorrow we'll probably have like 5 more pages on this thread. Also as their own thread there would have been no complaints and would actually receive a constructive discussion about them.

Originally Posted by TurkishCapybara

The only thing I see wrong with my post is that I started a sentence with "And". Where are the other errors?

Originally Posted by deathgod

Oh, please. Don't be ridiculous, please.

a) Once more, I do not see how you put any effort in those maps. I don't count pushing a button as "effort". If you wrote the program yourself, of course, you are free to advertise it in this thread, but please don't flood it with half a dozen or so blank maps taking up unnecessarily much space. I believe we've got a blank map thread somewhere, anyway.
b) See above.
c) I think almost everyone here will agree that randomly generated green shapes on dark blue are uninteresting.

I am doing just that -- try to extrapolate. Those maps are bad, IMHO, and don't warrant so many examples, so what is bad about them? That they're blank and randomly generated without any consideration. So, just do thought-through, handdrawn (mousedrawn? ) maps showing an interesting, preferably unique, development or situation.

Originally Posted by Klisz

The maps you posted weren't even attached to the posts you posted them in. You could have posted them all at once.

Wow, all that because I 'spammed' the map thread with, erm, maps.

AnywayI don't wanna derail this thread any further, so I'll reply to you here, where its at least vaguely relevant.

Originally Posted by Numb

here, i made a moving gif for you:

Thanks man!

[metastasis_d]

Originally Posted by TurkishCapybara

The only thing I see wrong with my post is that I started a sentence with "And". Where are the other errors?

This:

Originally Posted by TurkishCapybara

He wants the standards and rules to be upheld. You could of uploaded them all to an image hosting website and posted them all in one post. And you reaction was not required.

That should be "could have" or "could've".
Also, "And you reaction" should be "And your reaction."

[Abhakhazia]

You may remember this ugly map..
Kind of ugly but I thought it was good, so now I cleaned it up!
The cleaned up version, to compare.

[metastasis_d]

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil

The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation!

Official name: "The Cascadi-Cong-South-Stralia Federation, and the Netherlands, too."

Don't forget the rest of Oceania