AHC: Etruscans replace rome

[Muwatalli']

Can the Etruscans replace Rome and make a similar empire as Rome did?

[Emperor Norton I]

Don't we know very little about them?

[NikoZnate]

It could happen, but first consider the Romans: The Roman Empire grew out of a single city state that developed into an empire over time due in no small part to an obsession with its own security (being ruled by the Etruscans and then seeing their city sacked by the Gauls made the Romans pretty paranoid).

The Etruscans, by contrast, were organized into leagues of city states and were by nature rather fractious and not very imperialistic. You could try butterflying Rome away, or "Etruscanizing" it, and that could give you an Etruscan civilization that survives and goes on to behave something like the Greeks, i.e. planting colonies around the Mediterranean and still conducting wars among the various leagues. Hell, if you want you could even have an Etruscan version of the Peloponnesian War and an Etruscan Alexander the Great analogue, but IMO any Etruscan Empire resulting from that would be short lived.

If you want a united Etruscan state, you could create a leader who unites all the various leagues under a single banner and then he/his successors duke it out with Carthage for control of the Med... Or you could have the Etruscans briefly conquered and then expel their conquerors later, resulting in a united, paranoid (and therefore pre-emptively expansionist) Etruscan state.

[Fardell]

Originally Posted by NikoZnate

It could happen, but first consider the Romans: The Roman Empire grew out of a single city state that developed into an empire over time due in no small part to an obsession with its own security (being ruled by the Etruscans and then seeing their city sacked by the Gauls made the Romans pretty paranoid).

The Etruscans, by contrast, were organized into leagues of city states and were by nature rather fractious and not very imperialistic. You could try butterflying Rome away, or "Etruscanizing" it, and that could give you an Etruscan civilization that survives and goes on to behave something like the Greeks, i.e. planting colonies around the Mediterranean and still conducting wars among the various leagues. Hell, if you want you could even have an Etruscan version of the Peloponnesian War and an Etruscan Alexander the Great analogue, but IMO any Etruscan Empire resulting from that would be short lived.

If you want a united Etruscan state, you could create a leader who unites all the various leagues under a single banner and then he/his successors duke it out with Carthage for control of the Med... Or you could have the Etruscans briefly conquered and then expel their conquerors later, resulting in a united, paranoid (and therefore pre-emptively expansionist) Etruscan state.

Basic TL

Pre 4th Century BC
Rome "Etruscanized"

223 BC
Alexander doesn't die.

210s BC
Alexander conquers the Etruscan League

Early 2nd Century BC
Macedonian Empire collapses

Late 2nd Century BC
Etruscan Hegemon defeats Carthage, begin empire building

[The Ubbergeek]

Basicaly, some reason for political unity..

Did the Etruscan kings of old ruled over Rome only, local potentats, or where actually like kings of Latins and Etruscans?

[Muwatalli']

Originally Posted by The Ubbergeek

Basicaly, some reason for political unity..

Did the Etruscan kings of old ruled over Rome only, local potentats, or where actually like kings of Latins and Etruscans?

Well, they were kings of Rome only, but they were Etruscan, and therefore they had strong ties with the real Etruscan cities.

[Muwatalli']

Originally Posted by Fardell

Basic TL

Pre 4th Century BC
Rome "Etruscanized"

223 BC
Alexander doesn't die.

210s BC
Alexander conquers the Etruscan League

Early 2nd Century BC
Macedonian Empire collapses

Late 2nd Century BC
Etruscan Hegemon defeats Carthage, begin empire building

Could the Etruscans also unify in reponse to a Gaulic invasion? Are there also be other reasons for them to unify?

[Muwatalli']

Originally Posted by Fardell

Basic TL

Pre 4th Century BC
Rome "Etruscanized"

223 BC
Alexander doesn't die.

210s BC
Alexander conquers the Etruscan League

Early 2nd Century BC
Macedonian Empire collapses

Late 2nd Century BC
Etruscan Hegemon defeats Carthage, begin empire building

would the Etruscas actually go to war with Carthage, since it was allied with the Etruscans OTL

[Dathi THorfinnsson]

Originally Posted by Muwatalli'

would the Etruscas actually go to war with Carthage, since it was allied with the Etruscans OTL

Well, OTL, you had the Greeks (and, later, the Romans?) for the two powers to work together against. Also, Etruria was a land-power and not very expansionist. Thus there was little source of conflict.

ITTL, if there is no Rome, and Etruria is trying to expand (filling that role), they'll be in competition with the Carthaginians.

[robertp6165]

Originally Posted by Muwatalli'

Can the Etruscans replace Rome and make a similar empire as Rome did?

Not without some alterations to the OTL Etruscan political structure. I did a timeline where something like this had occurred...basically the Etruscans destroy Rome in 450 BC, but they adopt something similar to the Foedus Cassianum as the basis of a permanent league.

[Lysandros Aikiedes]

Etruscans replace Rome? The Etruscans preceded Rome. It was apparently ruled by Etruscans before they abolished the monarchy. Shouldn't that be "the Etruscans pre-empt Rome"?

[kasumigenx]

The other question is would the Etruscan Empire turn Italic later on since the Italics were more numerous than Etruscans.

[ImmortalImpi]

Originally Posted by kasumigenx

The other question is would the Etruscan Empire turn Italic later on since the Italics were more numerous than Etruscans.

Source? Etruria was a rather large place in comparison to Latium.

[The Ubbergeek]

Originally Posted by ImmortalImpi

Source? Etruria was a rather large place in comparison to Latium.

Latins were Italics, but Italics were more than Latins - Sabines, osces, etc...

[kasumigenx]

Originally Posted by ImmortalImpi

Source? Etruria was a rather large place in comparison to Latium.

Italics have more territory than Etruscans.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Italy.svg.png

[Errnge]

Originally Posted by ImmortalImpi

Source? Etruria was a rather large place in comparison to Latium.

Latins, Sabines, Samnites, Veneti, Oscans, Greeks, Messappi: it wasn't just the Romans and Etruscans who inhabited Italy.