Jacobin republics vs. Bonapartist kingdoms?

Faeelin

Banned
One comment that's confused me is that if you propose, say, puppet republics in germany, there's a consensus that the germans would unite against France.

Okay, let's compare the record. Bonaparte annexed imperial territory left of the rhine. He set up a new kingdom of westphalia and placed a corsican on its throne.He abolishes a thousand year reich.

And yet he still gets support in germany, because the princes are greedy.

If a first consul or somesuch ruled france, and was in a position to set up, say, the republic of hanover, would the princes really react differently if they still got land?
 
well . . . yes, the fear would be that if they can overthrow one german royal house they might decide to overthrow others, although Hannover might have been seen as a special case . . . .

You can't bandwagon with someone you think has an ideological agenda aimed ultimately at your destruction unless you're stupid as well as greedy.
 
arguably that's a normal part of dynastic politics, something a sufficiently greedy and incautious Prince could cooperate with, rather than a fundamental threat to the order of society.

I see your point though, a lot would depend on the attitude adopted towrds teh German Princes. If the Jacobins had gotten far enough to try to overthrow the german princes on ideological grounds of course teh Princes would have rallied against them. If OTOH, this republic imposing regime is willing to work with MOST of the Princes and offer them a share of the spoils then a measure of support for French aims is certainly possible.

You'd need someone sufficiently republican to want to impose republics on Germany who was also willing to work with, and offer rewards to, some dynastic states, which probably isn't as unlikely as it sounds.
 

Leo Caesius

Banned
Perhaps something along the lines of British India would arise, with a Republican territory controlled by a German congress surrounding numerous intractable but disparate Princely States.
 

Faeelin

Banned
Matthew Craw said:
arguably that's a normal part of dynastic politics, something a sufficiently greedy and incautious Prince could cooperate with, rather than a fundamental threat to the order of society.

The acknowledgement that anyone can be an emperor isn't a threat? Of course, what bonaparte should have bee naware of was that lots of people saw him as the heir to the revolution.

Matthew Craw said:
I see your point though, a lot would depend on the attitude adopted towrds teh German Princes. If the Jacobins had gotten far enough to try to overthrow the german princes on ideological grounds of course teh Princes would have rallied against them. If OTOH, this republic imposing regime is willing to work with MOST of the Princes and offer them a share of the spoils then a measure of support for French aims is certainly possible.

Yep.

Matthew Craw said:
You'd need someone sufficiently republican to want to impose republics on Germany who was also willing to work with, and offer rewards to, some dynastic states, which probably isn't as unlikely as it sounds.

Considering how many people thought that only the french could worka republic? not at all.
 
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