Confederate Political Parties
- Thread starter ConfederateFly
- Start date
Grey Wolf
Donor
ConfederateFly said:
I tried working this out elsewhere once :-
http://pub158.ezboard.com/ftheworldatwar70879frm5.showMessage?topicID=93.topic
Grey Wolf
I had a go at this as well for my CSA stories. I ended up with the CSA having the Democratic Party and the Constituionalist Party which was a very isolationist, states rights party. The USA had the Republicans, who resembled the Radical Republican/present day Democrats, the Democratic Party which was rather Dixiecratic in manner and the Populists who were sort of New Deal Democrats.
"All Politics is Local"
The Confederacy might take a while to become a two party state. There would be a period where every politician calls himself a Democrat but there are different factions and currents. Some fault lines:
1] Slavery -- In some states (eg. Virginia) the cause of abolishing slavery at the state level (with the slaveowners being compensated of course) would be an important issue. Less so in the Deep South states--at least initially. I am a firm disbeliever is the common AH notion that the CSA will decide the slavery issue at the national level.
2] How Weak should be our National government be? There would be a division between the Medium Weakers and SuperWeakers. A Strong CSA is a contradiction in terms. This is why the CSA will not decide slavery at the national level. It is also why fantasies of CSA military adventurism are Cloud Cuckooland.
3] How should we view the Yankees? I see a three way split between those who are confrontational, those who hope for eventual friendly relations and those who argue for a cool indifference.
4] Long run there is considerable potential for Populism to emerge with an appeal to the poor whites. This of course has nothing to do with pathetic fantasies of CSA militarism.
5] In Texas a poltical faction advocating becoming its own nation again is I think inevitable (note this does not mean a second Lone Star Republic is inevitable--merely that it would be vigorously debated).
The Confederacy might take a while to become a two party state. There would be a period where every politician calls himself a Democrat but there are different factions and currents. Some fault lines:
1] Slavery -- In some states (eg. Virginia) the cause of abolishing slavery at the state level (with the slaveowners being compensated of course) would be an important issue. Less so in the Deep South states--at least initially. I am a firm disbeliever is the common AH notion that the CSA will decide the slavery issue at the national level.
2] How Weak should be our National government be? There would be a division between the Medium Weakers and SuperWeakers. A Strong CSA is a contradiction in terms. This is why the CSA will not decide slavery at the national level. It is also why fantasies of CSA military adventurism are Cloud Cuckooland.
3] How should we view the Yankees? I see a three way split between those who are confrontational, those who hope for eventual friendly relations and those who argue for a cool indifference.
4] Long run there is considerable potential for Populism to emerge with an appeal to the poor whites. This of course has nothing to do with pathetic fantasies of CSA militarism.
5] In Texas a poltical faction advocating becoming its own nation again is I think inevitable (note this does not mean a second Lone Star Republic is inevitable--merely that it would be vigorously debated).
David S Poepoe
Banned
My ATLs have seen such parties as the Democrats, the Dixiecrats (probably a spliter group), the Constitutionalists, the Conservatives and the Radicals.
Like Tom_B I think the anti-slavery movement will begin within the individual states and most likely the border states first. However, the Confederate Constitution does provide that a constitutional convention can be called by a set minimum of states. Its possible that slavery may be constitutional done away with.
However, I think it likely that some move towards a stronger central government would occur starting in the 1880s, once a 'new generation' of politicians have come to office.
I also think it likely that Texas will eventually flirt with independence its racial composition has it looking more West and Southwestward than the Deep South. It is also the only real 'frontier' state the Confederacy has (not bothering to consider Missouri) and that will influence its views.
In my ATL the Radicals, aka the Radical Rebels, are for a stronger central government and abolishment of slavery. They just may polymorph into the Conservative Party by the mid-20th century, I haven't quite figured that out yet.
Like Tom_B I think the anti-slavery movement will begin within the individual states and most likely the border states first. However, the Confederate Constitution does provide that a constitutional convention can be called by a set minimum of states. Its possible that slavery may be constitutional done away with.
However, I think it likely that some move towards a stronger central government would occur starting in the 1880s, once a 'new generation' of politicians have come to office.
I also think it likely that Texas will eventually flirt with independence its racial composition has it looking more West and Southwestward than the Deep South. It is also the only real 'frontier' state the Confederacy has (not bothering to consider Missouri) and that will influence its views.
In my ATL the Radicals, aka the Radical Rebels, are for a stronger central government and abolishment of slavery. They just may polymorph into the Conservative Party by the mid-20th century, I haven't quite figured that out yet.
Here is a could be list of Confederate Presidents from 1862-2004
Jefferson Davis 1862-1868
Robert Barnwell Rhett 1868-1874
Howell Cobb 1874-1880
John Breckinridge 1880-1886
John Gordon 1886-1892
Sydney Jefferson Lee 1892-1898
"Rooney" Lee 1898-1904
Felix Robertson 1904-1910
Woodrow Wilson 1910-1916
Braxton Taylor 1916-1922
Augustus Johnston 1922-1928
Harrison Longstreet 1928-1934
Jake Featherston 1934-1940
Strom Thurmond 1940-1946
Fielding Wright 1946-1952
George Wallace 1952-1958
George Patton 1958-1964
Lyndon Johnson 1964-1970
Sydney Jefferson Lee III 1970-1976
Jimmy Carter 1976-1982
Strom Thurmond 1982-1988
Jake McDaniel 1988-1994
Wm Jefferson Clinton 1994-2000
John Edwards 2000-present
Jefferson Davis 1862-1868
Robert Barnwell Rhett 1868-1874
Howell Cobb 1874-1880
John Breckinridge 1880-1886
John Gordon 1886-1892
Sydney Jefferson Lee 1892-1898
"Rooney" Lee 1898-1904
Felix Robertson 1904-1910
Woodrow Wilson 1910-1916
Braxton Taylor 1916-1922
Augustus Johnston 1922-1928
Harrison Longstreet 1928-1934
Jake Featherston 1934-1940
Strom Thurmond 1940-1946
Fielding Wright 1946-1952
George Wallace 1952-1958
George Patton 1958-1964
Lyndon Johnson 1964-1970
Sydney Jefferson Lee III 1970-1976
Jimmy Carter 1976-1982
Strom Thurmond 1982-1988
Jake McDaniel 1988-1994
Wm Jefferson Clinton 1994-2000
John Edwards 2000-present
I think of my Presidents Fielding Wright, Strom Thurmond, and Jake Featherston(from Turtledove) would form the Freedom Party as the closest relation to the Nazis of Germany. What do u think of my list of Presidents?
Michael E Johnson
Banned
---KKK
Knights of the white Camelia
Freedom Party
The Whigs
the KKK----
I'm curious what is the difference between KKK and the KKK?
Knights of the white Camelia
Freedom Party
The Whigs
the KKK----
I'm curious what is the difference between KKK and the KKK?
David S Poepoe
Banned
Why doe this interpretation of the Confederacy look more like OTL South after Reconstruction than what an independent South would look like? The KKK would only be founded in response to such thing as the Freeman's Bureau, blacks getting the vote, etc. While the Confederacy would probably centralize to a degree, it would certainly be far less centralized than the US Government of OTL.