Walker Vehicles

1948: An inventor by the name of Roger Jackson, after going through six months of bueracratic hell, finally gets to present his invention to a group of US generals. What is his invention, exactly? It is the Hydraullicaly Powered Bipedal Walker Vehicle Chassis--essentialy a series of hydraulic pistons linked together to a pair of jointed legs, capable of self locomotion given a power source. The generals are sufficiently impressed by Jackson's invention so as to give him a small grant--around $500,000--in order to allow him to continue his work. They would have given him more, if it wasn't for the postwar budget gutting in the US military. Jackson gets to work on a full size prototype the moment he gets back to Akron. After three months of grueling labor, and hours of lost sleep, the prototype is completed. It is large, essentially a box with two legs and a pair of articulated arms to be used as weapons mounts. However, it will start a revolution...


My reasoning behind this is simple. The period from around 1900--1960 was a time of great scientific advancement. It differed from later periods of scientific advancement in the 20th Century in that during that time frame, science and technology was pursued with a much greater enthusiasm among the general public than there is now, because it was viewed as the solution to the world's problems at that point. Had something gone slightly differently, this might have happened in OTL.

Wouldn't recoil be a limting factor, as well as stability in general?

battlemechs have gyros in Battletech to deal with that.

Michael said:

Wouldn't recoil be a limting factor, as well as stability in general?

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Four legs could be a good stabilizer.

There's one problem with this.

there are three ways of making a legged vehicle move.

a) track the movement of a person (or animal) walking 'inside'. This is, in a way, the easy solution, but it is tough on the pilot.

b) run a sophisticated computer system that controls and balances the movement of the leg and position of the body.

c) make the legs stiff, the feet broad and flat, and move very slowly, one leg at a time.

I think in the 40s, c) was the only viable solution technologically. The advantages over wheeled transport, unfortunately, are nil.

Romulus Augustulus said:

1948: An inventor by the name of Roger Jackson, after going through six months of bueracratic hell, finally gets to present his invention to a group of US generals. What is his invention, exactly? It is the Hydraullicaly Powered Bipedal Walker Vehicle Chassis--essentialy a series of hydraulic pistons linked together to a pair of jointed legs, capable of self locomotion given a power source. The generals are sufficiently impressed by Jackson's invention so as to give him a small grant--around $500,000--in order to allow him to continue his work. They would have given him more, if it wasn't for the postwar budget gutting in the US military. Jackson gets to work on a full size prototype the moment he gets back to Akron. After three months of grueling labor, and hours of lost sleep, the prototype is completed. It is large, essentially a box with two legs and a pair of articulated arms to be used as weapons mounts. However, it will start a revolution...


My reasoning behind this is simple. The period from around 1900--1960 was a time of great scientific advancement. It differed from later periods of scientific advancement in the 20th Century in that during that time frame, science and technology was pursued with a much greater enthusiasm among the general public than there is now, because it was viewed as the solution to the world's problems at that point. Had something gone slightly differently, this might have happened in OTL.

Click to expand...

True. It was within our technical capabilities to do. But we must ask one simple question, and this explains why we didn't do it. WHAT IS THE ADVANTAGE? "Walker vehicles" are not going to be capable of doing anything more than wheeled or tracked vehicles, and they are going to have some problems with instability. Indeed, it is likely that a "Walker" couldn't go into many areas that a wheeled or tracked vehicle could negotiate. So unless a compelling advantage can be shown...a REAL advantage, not something we might have seen in a cartoon somewhere...I really don't see why anyone would waste time and resources developing it.

one ATL i'm working on has the beginning of mecha robots with the first primitive walker weapons in WWII. In WWIII and WWIV the weapons are expanded and become actual mechs.

perhaps for combat in an urban enviorment, and the usefulness or cost of a military project has never been a real isssue here in america, just make it the pet project for a home district for a congressmen or something of that sort, or have it be played as the solution for wounded soldiers who want to be able to walk. I would think it would be useful for peacekeeping and a prestige project as well.

well, this sort of fits for the kind of program

Focus Area:Bipedal combat chassis


Title: IIS Bipedal combat chassis




Non-Federal Participants: Intelligent Inference Systems Corp., Sunnyvale, CA; University of Berkeley, Berkeley, CA; Stanford University, Stanford, CA.


Program Description: This project will develop legged combat program with 2 leg/2 arms that are reconfigurable for urban missions, building entry, and surveillance. These bipedal/quadrapetal platform will have biomechanical limbs, muscle-like actuators and fuzzy control, series of three prototypes, demo locomotion on various terrains, as well as stability.


Expected Military Application(s): Urban operations pose particular threats to military personnel. There are emerging requirements for armored surveillance in urban operations, including surveillance within buildings that have not been secured. Bipedal support would ease fatigue of soldiers and have an important psycological aspect , because they can negotiate narrow alleyways and easly navigate rough terrain, the combine the benefits of wheeled vehicles and the infantryman of the past.
Expected Commercial Application(s): The most likely commercial markets are first, private security sector, which has stringent demands for access to hazardous areas, and where the cost of advanced bipedal chassis systems is no barrier. The second market is in law enforcement. A robot that provides robust locomotion comparable to humans would find widespread use in law enforcement and fire fighting. The largest commercial market, which is likely to drive down the cost of these units, is the application in factories or mining.

robertp6165 said:

True. It was within our technical capabilities to do. But we must ask one simple question, and this explains why we didn't do it. WHAT IS THE ADVANTAGE? "Walker vehicles" are not going to be capable of doing anything more than wheeled or tracked vehicles, and they are going to have some problems with instability. Indeed, it is likely that a "Walker" couldn't go into many areas that a wheeled or tracked vehicle could negotiate. So unless a compelling advantage can be shown...a REAL advantage, not something we might have seen in a cartoon somewhere...I really don't see why anyone would waste time and resources developing it.

Click to expand...

A fully functioning walker vehicle could - potentially - negotiate terrain that today is inaccessible for anything short of helicopters. Perfect for mountain warfare, for one thing, and it could be made signally smaller than a tank. A very basic design wouldn't be much larger than an infantry soldier, but allow the occupant to carry a squad support weapon and be relatively impervious to smallarms fire.

The problem is that the best anyone has been able to do in the field (and admitted to - who knows what's going on in secret labs) is a machine that can slowly walk upstairs, but needs to be carried down. And it cost millions to build.

Maybe I should clarify a bit. Jackson is, first of all, a genius. Next of all, the thing's stability is regulated by a mechanical computer and a simple gyroscope. It is capable of going relatively fast. The main electronic thing is a whole bunch of rheostats linked to pressure sensors that in turn are linked to some hydraulic controls that control various other things about the walker's balance. As for recoil, there's a way around that too...the walker leans forward just enough to compensate whenever it fires. Besides, big walker vehicles isn't where this is going...

...what I'm planning is what someone might call an exoskeleton. Basically, although the initial big walker project doesn't work too well (technology too primitive to allow a short term combat vehicle) the experience gained proves invaluable in robotics work. Semi humanoid vehicles for construction and such begin to gain wide use. The main short term military application is as a sort of powered suit--basically, a network of hydraulics and motion sensors that you put on that allows you to run faster and such.

So it's a Battlemech...

See this for example;


*the guy goes into the little pod

i remember taht! the guy built it in his backyard and his kids play in it. ahhh if i only had such a father...

No. It's more like a Cyber from Empire Earth. But piloted. Or like an exo from OGRE.

Consider robots of today aren't very good walkers and mechs in the 20th century are very unlikely. I remember just 10 years ago or so where Honda showed off their new robot which was the cutting edge because it could walk well.
For exoskeletons the US military is working on those now and at the moment has one where you can walk for a hour or so- batteries won't last any longer and all of its extra strength is put into carrying its huge battery.

There are actually some pretty impressive "walking tractors" that have been developed for use by the logging industry. One company doing work is here:
http://www.plustech.fi/Walking1.html


With some reading through their stuff I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to backwards-extrapolate how early it would be possible to develop something like this. Their main advantages are that, as stated, they can more easily maneuver their way through forested and mountainous terrain that traditional tracked (and even wheeled) vehicles simply cannot navigate.

The biggest problem is that *two-legged* walkers are very, very difficult to get balanced and I don't know if that would really work by "now" even in an accelerated timeline. But something like this, with 6 legs or so, would work well as a military vehicle with just a little bit of a timeline tweak (basically getting the tech to where making one of these able to move fast is feasible).

Militarily you have a problem if its a mech. Its alot easier to damage/destroy a leg than it is a track. One Stinger from a window into the "knee" and the mech will fall. On the other hand a mech can carry more weapons.

The problem I see, and 'see' is the right word, is that a walker vehicle has too high a profile and would therefore be very easy to hit. Think about it, a turreted vehicle presents a very low, small profile. A Walker is upright with lots of itself exposed.

It'd have a higher profile then a tank but it'd also have a less wide profile and I'm sure it could crouch or something of the sort.