Independent Lapland
- Thread starter tom
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An independent Lapland needs a precocious sense of unity, a better climate, and maybe an urban civilization.
The Sami never had such things, AFAIK.
Maybe in the "warm" period (AD 850-1350) they could have achieved some political unity, but I definitely can't see them invading the Vikings and the Finns as hordes on reindeerback led by some local Gengis Khan...
They were simply too few, too primitive, and not aggressive. So their destiny was doomed.
The Sami never had such things, AFAIK.
Maybe in the "warm" period (AD 850-1350) they could have achieved some political unity, but I definitely can't see them invading the Vikings and the Finns as hordes on reindeerback led by some local Gengis Khan...
They were simply too few, too primitive, and not aggressive. So their destiny was doomed.
Grey Wolf
Donor
basileus said:
I was thinking on similar lines - you can have the whole of European polity break up into tiny states etc but its still likely someone will claim sovereignty over Lapland as its not got the power to resist
The only possibility I see is for it to be a puppet, sponsored by someone - eg if Russia in the nineteenth century spreads itself over all of the North of Scandinavia, then comes a war with Britain and France (analogus to the Crimean War) and after this war as much as possible of Russia is broken off, then perhaps just perhaps you would get a Lapp state which is basically a British client. Of course, Britain would have to be very angry at Sweden to do this!
Grey Wolf
Billy the Bear
Donor
Well to some extent we can say that they did, the Sami or other related groups probably roamed further south than they do today. The problem is that they were pushed away by agrucultural peoples when farming spread to Scandinavia. There could of course be a POD where early Sami spread faster and adopt farming as soon as they encounter it but I don't know if it's the most realistic thing that could happen.
Besides, this doesn't really give us an independent Lapland. We would just have Scandinavia with another dominant culture. The traditional "Lapland" still suffers from the problem that it doesn't have any good chance of supporting a succesful state in the bronze or iron age period. The climate up there isn't well suited for farming. Sure, if the Sami in Lapland adopt farming much faster than they did (not all Sami were/are reindeer herders, some became farmers but it happened very slowly) and they unify politcally to form a state we have a independent nation of Lapland but for how long?
They are going to have a very, very low population spread out over a very, very vast area. Today with modern agriculture and ways of supporting the population the Swedish and Finnish Lapland regions have 278,350 inhabitants in an area of 298,686 km2, 1000-2000 years ago the possible number of people being able to support themselves there would have been much lower. And since neighbouring states with better climate and farming opportunities most likely would have a higher population it's highly probable that they at the very least dominate any Lapland state politically so that it's independent in name only or they all out conquer it.
An independent Lapland is an interesting thought but I honestly can't see how such a thing could come to be.
In some ways, thats otl, and called Finland.
Suomi and Sami are surely the same word. The ones that settled down and farmed became a state that eventually got its independence, and the ones that stayed in the hinterlands, where they didnt have the population to form a state, didnt.
If you postulate more settling down, or herders and farmers maintaining a single identity, then youd just have a bigger Finland.
Suomi and Sami are surely the same word. The ones that settled down and farmed became a state that eventually got its independence, and the ones that stayed in the hinterlands, where they didnt have the population to form a state, didnt.
If you postulate more settling down, or herders and farmers maintaining a single identity, then youd just have a bigger Finland.
katchen
Banned
The Saami are the same people that are the Samoyeds or the Nenets in Arctic Russia and along the Ob up to the Yensei. But it comes down to the same problem that another listemember wrote about with Innuit developing a civilization. You need plants in the Tundra that can be cultivated and become the basis of agriculture. Or animals besides reindeer. Yak perhaps, if they can somehow spread throughout Siberia and the Arctic. Yak provide wool as well as milk and meat. And perhaps a trade route to the Far East via the Siberian Rivers. Perhaps with these advantages, the Sami can expand circumpolarly or at least as far as the Bering Strait or at least the Lena during the Roman Warm Period or the Minoan Warm Period. Maybe learn how to make boats with leather coverings like the Pomor did and navigate the Arctic seas that way and fish. It is out of these things that they will be able to build a civilization if a civilization can be built way up there.
It would be pretty easy to think up somewhat different Napoleonic Wars that in the north lead to a lot bigger chunk of Swedish Lapland and even some of the Norwegian coast being annexed by the Russians by the 1820s. Seeing the strategic potential of the new territories on the Atlantic coast, the Russians split this Lapland-Finnmark into a new administrative entity, directly controlled by St. Petersburg while the rest of the conquered area becomes a Grand Duchy of Finland.
Then, let's allow several decades of peace so the Russian rule up north is solidified. Russian interest in the area is almost purely military, and apart from developing ports and roads, later railways, the Russians adopt a pretty hand-offish attitude to it - like to the Finnish Grand Duchy IOTL. This Lapland-Finnmark becomes a distinct entity from Sweden, Norway, Russia and Finland, and after a while becomes considered a Sami homeland. Because of the low population, immigration is encouraged even from abroad - this is helped by a Lapland gold rush sometime in the 19th century. If Lapland-Finnmark is known abroad, it is consided the "European Alaska", a cold new frontier with natural beauty and wild natives.
After this there would be several possibilities how this Russian Lapland-Finnmark could become an independent state - ostensibly, because the low population and limited natural resources (until the late 19th century when the mineral deposits are uncovered) would mean that it would need a protector, whether that is a Scandinavian/Nordic power, Russia, Britain, Germany etc.