The ATL Automobiles & Automakers Thread.

Hey folks. This is a concept that I first thought of a little while back, and thought I'd post it again.

Basically, this is a general thread where you can post your ideas for ATL Automobiles.

Here is a slightly modified version of the template I used a while back(I do kinda prefer this, tbh, but you could use your own if you wanted to. =))

1. Timeline(e.g. Decades of Darkness, For Want of a Nail, etc.):
2. Model Name/Manufacturer:
3. Model Type:
4. Model Year(e.g. 1955 for the particular model):
5. Nation of Origin:
6. Production run: (ex. 1949-55)
7. Number built(both 7 & 8 can be skipped if you can't be bothered with those figures):
8. Engine: (ex. OTL's 1957 Corvette Stingray had a 283cid, or 4.7 liter V8)
9. Horsepower(optional, but recommended):
10. Drivetrain(FF, FR, MR, 4WD, etc.):
11. Transmission:
12. Weight:
13. Description(not required, but recommended):
14. OTL Equivalent(recommended, but if you can't think of one, that's okay.):

Here, I'll get started with a few idea of my own:

1. Timeline: Decades of Darkness
2. Manufacturer/Model Name: Goldenrod Patriot
3. Model Type: 2 door coupe
4. Model Year: 1936
5. Nation of Origin: New England
6. Production run: 1935-49
7. Number built: 54,428
8. Engine: 4.7 liter Inline 4 (steam powered)
9. Horsepower: 119 bhp @ 2,700 rpm
10. Drivetrain: FR
11. Transmission: 2 speed automatic
12. Weight: 3,300 lbs.
13. Top Speed: 95 mph
14. Description: This is a steam powered horst from New England. The manufacturer has had a long history of quality stretching back to its founding, even having a decent reputation in America, as well as much of the rest of the world.
15. OTL Equivalent: Closest equivalent appears to be the Doble steam cars.

1. Timeline: For Want of a Nail
2. Manufacturer/Model Name: Galloway Goblin
3. Model Type: 2 door sports coupe
4. Model Year: 1971
5. Nation of Origin: Confederation of North America
6. Production run: 1970-present
7. Number built: 265,000+ as of 1978
8. Engine: 4.6 litre V8
9. Horsepower: 294 hp @ 5,250 rpm
10. Drivetrain: FR
11. Transmission: 4 speed manual
12. Weight: 3,424 lbs.
13. Top Speed: 147 mph
14. Description: Bitchin' sports car made by the company founded by
Owen Gallaway.
15. OTL Equivalent: One of the guys involved with For All Nails compared it to an OTL Camaro of roughly the same era so I'll just go with that.

(p.s. Sandman361 suggested opening up the thread to OTL cars that never made production, so they can be entered in now, too. )

Anybody out there?

.........Surely somebody must be interested in this.

just give me a second.

Cali,

I think you will need to show a bit of patience.

Also you are not likely to get a huge number of responses as your request is very specific.

If you have perhaps opened it up to cars from OTL that were not made (but were proposed) I would have participated.

Timeline: Latin Pact TL.
Model Name/Manufacturer: Frazier Commander (Kaiser-Frazier Automotive)
Model Type/Class: Compact Utility
Body Style: Two Door Sedan
Model Year: 1949
Nation of Origin: West Germany/United States
Production run: 1949-1980 (Germany) 1953-1973 (US, Catalonia) 1960-1997(Mexico, Brasil)
Engine: Originally 1,131 cc air-cooled Gasoline/Petrol flat four
Horsepower: Originally 25 bhp
Drivetrain:Rear Engine, Rear-wheel drive, later 4wd as an option.
Transmission: 4-speed manual w/self-locking differential
Weight: Originally 1,900 lb
Description: A derivative of the little known pre-war German vehicle, the Kdf-Wagen, and it's war time development the Kübelwagen, the Commander was a simple vehicle designed to suit almost any use, by any person worldwide. Production began almost immediately after the buyout of the Volkswagen factory by Kaiser-Frazier, and proved to be quite the sucess, both in the Germanies, the United States, and abroad, especially in Latin America and Iberia. Although production compared to the Fraiser Beetle (sold as the Volkswagen Type 1 in Europe) or Kaiser Safari, production was still respectable. Sales took off after the introduction of Four Wheel Drive and the introduction of the 1500 cc 54 hp flat-four, and the 1300cc Diesel four. Production ended in 1980 in favor of a 4wd version of the A1 platform, under the same name.
OTL Equivalent: Volkswagen Type 82E Kübelwagen/Kommandeurwagen.

Model Name/Manufacturer: Fraizer Darrin (Kaiser-Frazier Automotive)
Model Type/Class: Sports
Body Style: Two Door Coupe or Convertible
Model Year: 1954
Nation of Origin: West Germany/United States
Production run: 1954-1970 (US) 1954-1977(Brasil)
Engine: Originally 1500 cc air-cooled Gasoline/Petrol flat four
Horsepower: Originally 60 bhp
Drivetrain:Rear Engine, Rear-wheel drive.
Transmission: 4-speed manual
Weight: Originally 1,808 lb
Description: Derived from the Fraiser Beetle, the Darrin, designed by "Dutch" Darrin, was an attempt to produce an in-house sports car design comparable to the sprightly MGs so popular among Americans after the end of the Second European War (1936-1944), to that end, some truly amazing talent had been brought in, including the chief engineer of the original Kdf-Wagen, Ferdinand Porsche, and in truth, the clash of engineer and designer produced something magnificent, even if the Porsche 356 was a better performer, and the MGA more powerful, and both were much more handsome, the Darrin was a delightful car to drive, and had the sheer reliability of the rest of the Kaiser-Fraizer line. Sales were brisk, and as improvements came, sales kept up, before it was replaced by a newer, sportier design in 1977.
OTL Equivalent: Volkswagen Type 14, Type 34 (Styling)

Model Name/Manufacturer: Hudson Hornet Mk II (Kaiser-Frazier Automotive)
Model Type/Class: Luxury car
Body Style: Two Door Coupe or Convertible, Four-door sedan.
Model Year: 1955
Nation of Origin: West Germany/United States
Production run: 1955-1960 (US)
Engine: 262 or 308 cu in Straight Six, or 331 cu in Cadilac V8.
Horsepower: 170hp (stock 308)
Drivetrain:Front Engine, Rear-wheel drive.
Transmission: 3-speed manual, 3-speed manual with overdrive, or hydramatic
Weight: 262 cu in - 3,520*lb
Description: Kaiser Fraizer's purchase of Hudson Motor Car Company in 1953 came as a surprise to many outside the Automotive industry, and even more inside of it, (although Kaiser's memoirs later proved the theory that he had bought Hudson mainly for Hudson's industrial portfolio and the rather valuable tooling for 20mm Oerlikon guns.) Still, the money Kaiser-Fraizer brought into the deal was more than enough to produce a champion luxury and performance vehicle. With a newer, sleeker and lower body, and improved aerodynamics (developed by the team of Erwin Komenda and Josef Mickl) the Hornet yet again took to the winner's circle, and solidified Hudson's reputation as not only a builder of tasteful luxury cars, but also as one of the premier performance marquees world wide. Surprisingly Hudson sold more Hornet MkIIs overseas than they did in North America, mostly in Latin America, Iberia and the United Kingdom.
OTL Equivalent: Hudson Hornet (1956)

(drool, slobber) VERY interested.



I was going on here to stash some to-read-later auto article links into my test thread, incidentally.


I used to be a moderator on Autoweek.com's Combustion Chamber, and led our exodus to MotorTrend.com when AW's forum (semi-temporarily) went under the surface.



I REALLY LIKE CARS.


I shall return.

from the President Obama Possessed by Stinkmeaner thread/timeline,

the Cadillac Floatwood Brougham!


Timeline: Obama Possessed by Stinkmeaner.
Model Name/Manufacturer: General Motors, Cadillac Division
Model Type/Class: Luxury
Body Style: Four door sedan
Model Year: 2019
Nation of Origin: United States
Production run: 2019-2050
Engine: Turbine
Horsepower: 600 hp equivalent
Drivetrain: Obamaversal Float-Drive.
Transmission: Presidential Overglide
Weight: 6,300 pounds
Description: The American president addressed the gathered heads of the American auto industry and demanded his flying freaking cars. The president's demand was obeyed.
The Floatwood Brougham mixed whimsical retro with cutting-edge tech developed in part by government-funded researchers and The Workshop in Greater Korea.
For the Floatwood Brougham, GM received praise in particular for being among the first to have flying cars with excellent stopping power without causing motion sickness for driver/passengers.
An extended and armored version of this vehicle served as one of the president's limousines.
OTL Equivalent: NONE.

from USA1978 and USA2011 switch places in time (or is it times in place?)

In USA1978 as ISOT'd to 2011, Ford and other American car producers felt inspired to debut "future-styled" cars in an exuberant boom of design and engineering.

This economy car, the 1979 no wait 2012 Ford Pinto, incorporated "new" engine tech taken from Ford's overseas divisions.


Timeline: USA 1978 switches with USA 2011.
Model Name/Manufacturer: Ford Motor Corporation
Model Type/Class: compact
Body Style: two-door coupe
Model Year: 1979 erm 2012
Nation of Origin: United States
Production run: 2011-2015 (debuted 2011 as 2012 model)
Engine: Ford of Europe 2.0 liter four-cylinder gasoline engine
Horsepower: 130 hp
Drivetrain: rear-wheel drive
Transmission: three-speed automatic, four-speed stick
Weight: 2,600 pounds
Description: This Ghia-designed prototype had been on the international car-show circuit in 1977 and was sitting in a Ford hq warehouse when The Change occurred. It was subsequently rushed into production with "up to date" mechanicals developed overseas.
OTL Equivalent: Ford Pinto or Ford Focus, depending on who/when/where/how you ask.

Technical quibble: steam-powered cars (at least the Stanley and Doble steamers) had two cylinder steam engines under the chassis, not unlike a locomotive (remember, those had either two cylinders, one each side, for simple engines or perhaps four, for compound engines; I don't believe automotive steam ever used compounds). Under the hood was the boiler.

from "You Wake Up As Hitler" (on his tenth birthday) https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=144861&highlight=Montreal



Timeline: I woke up as Hitler on his tenth birthday.
Model Name/Manufacturer: Hitler Motors Joy Sedan
Model Type/Class: general purpose car
Body Style: Four Door Sedan
Model Year: 1925
Nation of Origin: Canada (Montreal)
Production run: 1925-1960 (Canada)
Engine: 1,500 cc air-cooled Gasoline/Petrol flat four
Horsepower: Originally 25 bhp
Drivetrain: Rear-Engine, Rear-wheel drive. (Later, limited edition four-wheel-drive.)
Transmission: 4-speed manual
Weight: 2,500 lb
Description: I had some pretty strong ideas about what kind of cars I wanted to make. Specifically, I wanted to um utilize designs (cough STEAL cough) for cars that were rugged, simple and fun. I particularly liked the idea of modifying classics like the VW Beetle as useful for Canadian usage.
Ah yes, I also have a thing for sports cars that weigh less than our bedroom set! So the next car is basically my recollection of the Lotus Seven brought to life about a decade or two early, give or take.
OTL Equivalent: Not sure. Chrysler Airflow? VW Beetle but 13 years early?

Sandman396 said:

Cali,

I think you will need to show a bit of patience.

Also you are not likely to get a huge number of responses as your request is very specific.

If you have perhaps opened it up to cars from OTL that were not made (but were proposed) I would have participated.

Click to expand...

Okay, point taken. Sorry if I seemed a little too impatient.

And given that there are a fairly decent number of OTL cars that had a really good chance but never got made, I guess we can open the contest to those, too.

@NothingNow: I had to LOL at the flying Caddy, btw.

from the President Obama Possessed by Stinkmeaner thread/timeline,

the Cadillac Branson!


Timeline: Obama Possessed by Stinkmeaner.
Model Name/Manufacturer: General Motors, Cadillac Division
Model Type/Class: Luxury
Body Style: Four door sedan
Model Year: 2021
Nation of Origin: United States
Production run: 2020-2050
Engine: Turbine
Horsepower: 600 hp equivalent
Drivetrain: Obamaversal Float-Drive.
Transmission: Presidential Overglide
Weight: 6,800 pounds
Description: The American president addressed the gathered heads of the American auto industry and demanded his flying freaking cars. The president's demand was obeyed.
The Cadillac Branson was named in honor of Field Marshall/NASA Chair Emeritus Richard Branson, the first American on Mars.
An extended and armored version of this vehicle served as one of the president's limousines.
OTL Equivalent: NONE.

CaliBoy1990 said:

Okay, point taken. Sorry if I seemed a little too impatient.

And given that there are a fairly decent number of OTL cars that had a really good chance but never got made, I guess we can open the contest to those, too.

@NothingNow: I had to LOL at the flying Caddy, btw.

Click to expand...

at mine or his?

From "Gasoline Becomes Dirt Cheap" I present the GMC Sprint

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=183455

1. Timeline: Gasoline Becomes Dirt Cheap
2. Model Name/Manufacturer: GM, GMC brand
3. Model Type: two-seat commuter runabout
4. Model Year: 2011
5. Nation of Origin: USA
6. Production run: 2011-2020 (Then it was increased in size as per consumer demand.)
7. Number built: about 250k total
8. Engine: 9.0 liter gasoline V8 (base), 12.0 liter gasoline V10 (optional)
9. Horsepower: 500 hp @ 1800rpm, 620 hp @ 1300rpm
10. Drivetrain(FF, FR, MR, 4WD, etc.): FR (front engine, rear drive)
11. Transmission: five-speed automatic
12. Weight: 20,500 pounds
13. Description: Ideal for commuting, around-town errands, first dates and showing off the mother of all sound systems.
14. OTL Equivalent: Pontiac Fiero, Honda CRX

1. Timeline: African Superpowers
2. Model Name/Manufacturer: Westland Automobile Corporation
3. Model Type: Westland Springbok
4. Model Year: First is 1971, second is 1995, third is 2007
5. Nation of Origin: East Africa, Japan, South Africa (1982 onward), New Zealand (1989-2004), Argentina (1970-1985)
6. Production run: 1970-2014
7. Number built: 2,446,322 (all models)
8. Engine: Wankel Rotary, 1970-1991 models two-rotor, 1992-2014 models three-rotor, turbocharging optional from 1976-1985, standard 1986-2004
9. Horsepower: 140 horsepower (1971), 360 horsepower (1995), 275 horsepower (2007)
10. Drivetrain: FR
11. Transmission: five-speed manual (1970-1985), six-speed manual (1986-2004), seven-speed manual (2005-2014)
12. Weight: early models around 2200 lbs, grew to most about 3000 lbs
13. Description: Two-door sports car
14. OTL Equivalent: Mazda RX-3 and RX-7

The Westland Springbok was born out of co-operation between the design-seeking Westland Automobile Corporation in Nairobi, East Africa and the cash-strapped Toyo Kogyo Company in the late 1960s. One of the first successful uses of Wankel rotary engines in automobiles, the Springbok would go on to be one of the most popular sports cars ever made, with nearly two million and a half million units sold all over the world as the Westland Springbok and Mazda RX-3, RX-7 and RX-8 between 1970 and 2014, and eventually led to the merger of the two companies in 1985. The technological development between the two companies led to more and more powerful and excellent handling versions of the Springbok until the end of the fourth generation of it in 2004, by which time its performance was incredible, but its price - starting at R85,000 (about $60,000 USD) was such that its sales were slow. The fifth generation was a much simpler car and a slower one, but more in line with the spirit of the original 1970 Springbok.

CaliBoy1990 said:

@NothingNow: I had to LOL at the flying Caddy, btw.

Click to expand...

That's his. My stuff is all Kaizer-Fraiser or Hudson.

Whilst we are on the same theme ():

1. Timeline: African Superpowers
2. Model Name/Manufacturer: Joseph Ganz Auto Design, Pty. Ltd.
3. Model Type: Ganz Phaëton
4. Model Year: Shown is the estate car variant of the Mk3 Phaëton, of which Mk3 models are much sought after by car collectors
5. Nation of Origin: South Africa
6. Production run: Mk1: 1948-1956; Mk2: 1957-1970; Mk3 1970-1989; Mk4 1990-1998; Mk5 1999-present
7. Number built: 42,190,785,980 (all models)
8. Engine: Air-cooled H4 initially for Mk1, later options for both Mk1 and Mk2 included variations on the air-cooled H4 theme, including later H6 and H8 varieties - both air-cooled and water-cooled (the latter usually turbocharged) - and water-cooled H4 models
9. Horsepower: Information not avaliable at this time
10. Drivetrain: FR, 4WD standard
11. Transmission: three-speed manual (Mk1 and Mk2), four-speed manual (Mk2 and Mk3), six-speed manual (Mk3 to Mk5)
12. Weight: Information not avaliable at this time
13. Description: Small family car (Mk1), Large family car (Mk2), Executive car (Mk3-present)
14. OTL Equivalent: Mk1 - Volvo PV444; Mk2 - Volvo Amazon; Mk3 - Monteverdi Sierra; Mk4 & Mk5 - unique models with no OTL equivalent

Brief description: The Ganz Phaëton is one vehicle that has entered the collective memory of South Africans as the quintessential South African car - as South African as rugby and braaivleis. This is largely due to the genius of Joseph Ganz, a Hungarian-born German auto designer and engineer who was forced out during the Nazi era due to being Jewish. Having settled in South Africa, he began desinging a small car which would be affordable for the average family. Most notable among his promotion efforts, when the Mk1 Phaëton was unveiled in 1940, was the signing of contracts obligating purchase of a Phaëton after The War (TM) was over.

With victory for the Allies during WW2, an improved version of the Mk1 was put into production, with "contract cars" (Kontraksmotorvoertuigen in Afrikaans) delivered first. The Phaëton - particularly in its Mk1 and Mk2 guises - were the most popular and fast-selling domestic-built cars in South Africa, with even the Prime Minister driving one. The Phaëton was also widely exported, with exports of the Mk1 beginning around the early 1950s to Rhodesia, East Africa, and South-West Africa. Currently, the Mk5 is exported all over the world. Mk1, Mk2, and Mk3 Phaëtons are sought after by South African car collectors, particularly the Mk1 "contract cars" and Mk3 Phaëtons built from 1970-1979. The photo below of a Mk3 Phaëton estate car shows one version that is sought after (due to the rarity of this particular body style, most Mk3s on South African roads today usually being saloons, cabriolets, bakkies, or estate vans).

This has got to be one of the more interesting threads I've come upon.

Oh, and here's the kicker: Dr. Ing. (doctor-engineer) Joseph Ganz is actually a real person - it is him, not Dr. Ing. Ferdinand Porsche, who can be claimed to be the actual inventor of the Volkswagen Beetle.

Dan1988 said:

Oh, and here's the kicker: Dr. Ing. (doctor-engineer) Joseph Ganz is actually a real person - it is him, not Dr. Ing. Ferdinand Porsche, who can be claimed to be the actual inventor of the Volkswagen Beetle.

Click to expand...

That's great.

Well, two more Latin Pact TL Kaizer-Fraizer-Hudsons:

Model Name/Manufacturer: Hudson Hornet Mk III (Kaiser-Frazier Automotive)
Model Type/Class: Luxury car
Body Style: Two Door Coupe or Convertible, Four-door sedan.
Model Year: 1960
Nation of Origin: United States
Production run: 1960-1964 (US)
Engine: 258 or 308 cu in Straight Six, 380 cu in Hudson V8 or 424 cu in Hudson V12
Horsepower: 240hp (stock single carb 308)
Drivetrain:Front Engine, Rear-wheel drive.
Transmission: 4-speed manual with overdrive, or hydramatic
Weight: 262 cu in - 3,900**lb
Description: The Successor to the legendary Mark II Hornet, the Mark III is rather something of a footnote, only being really notable for the usual Hudson virtues (Low cd, a big straight six, and great handling,) the introduction of Air-conditioning 4wheel independent suspension (derived from Citroen's Hydropneumatic system,) and the V8 and V12 engines. Additionally for the first time the Mark III did introduce the options of Aluminum body panels and 4-wheel Disk Brakes on low end models. Performance of the 424 Coupe was amazing, although in a straight line it could be beaten by a Galaxie Thunderbolt or a B-Body Belvedere with the 426 cu in Hemi V8. The best selling model was again the 308 Sedan.
OTL Equivalent: None.

Model Name/Manufacturer: Kaiser Henry J. (Kaiser-Frazier Automotive)
Model Type/Class: Midsize/Economy Car
Body Style: Two Door or Four Door Sedan, four door wagon.
Model Year: 1964
Nation of Origin: West Germany/United States
Production run: 1964-1976 (US, West Germany, Brazil)
Engine: Originally 1679cc air-cooled Gasoline/Petrol flat four
Horsepower: Originally 68 bhp
Drivetrain:Rear engine, Rear-wheel drive.
Transmission: 4-speed manual, 3-speed automatic
Weight: 2Door-2,200*lb, 4 Door - 2300lb, Wagon - 2600lb
Description: a Further Diversification of the Kaiser-Fraizer rear-engined line, the Henry J was a simple enough family sedan, although initially not that much of a success outside of it's engines and transmissions. It was too big for many european and latin american buyers, and underpowered and cramped for many North American buyers, although the 1679cc four was a popular option for the smaller rear-engined models. Surprisingly, what saved it was the 1968 fuel crisis, after Hurricane Edna destroyed much of the gulf coast oil refining infrastructure after coming ashore almost directly on top of the Port of Houston, sparking the Recession of 1968. With rising fuel costs after the event, and a significant scarcity, as much of the infrastructure needed to import fuel from Mexico and Venezuela had also been damaged, and the prices continued to remain high until the completion of the massive Cochimetl I Pipeline in 1972 alleviated the problem once and for all. Sales of the Henry J, along with all other Kaiser-Fraizer Rear engined models took off almost overnight, requiring a second production shift to be brought in. Sales would be discontinued in 1976 to be replaced by a Front engined vehicle on the A1 Platform.
OTL Equivalent: Volkswagen Type 3 and Type 4.