1493 Retconned Mameluke War

[DuQuense]

?Whould It be possible to Retcon a more complete/Coherent TL for the Marluk War.?

I suggest something like this

Marluks attack into Libya, and are defeated at Tripoli by the Granadians. [Hafid Kingdom]

This triggers the Ottomans to attack into Syria, along with their Kights of Rhodes allies

The Marluks collaspe, triggering the Alodi to revolt, the Ethiopians send warriors to help

Seeing how complete the Marluks collasped in Syria, someone [either ottomans or some europe power] invades Eygpt.

Marluks are removed, [20 years early] and someone else now controls eygpt /east libya, while the Alodi control all of Nubia, and the Granadians control western Libya.

[AJNolte]

Keep in mind that the Christians would have attacked overland from Jafa straight into Jerusalem, thus splitting the Mamluks. I also think they would have still helped the Alodi, all be it perhaps in a more limited format.

[VulcanTrekkie45]

Then, the Moldavians, Wallachians, Austrians, and Russians sweep in on the side of the Ottomans...

[DuQuense]

Keep in mind that the Christians would have attacked overland from Jafa straight into Jerusalem, thus splitting the Mamluks. I also think they would have still helped the Alodi, all be it perhaps in a more limited format.[
problem here is that Nubia is 1000 miles south thru unknown [to europeans] territory. Even Kitchner in the 1880's had problems moving forces south to Katuroum. In 1500????????????

1494: The Ottoman Sultan, Bayezid, Caliph to the Faithful, Shadow of God on Earth, heir of the Prophet, accompanied by Prince Ahmed and every other good son of the Caliph (all the sons but Selim) join the army in readiness for the impending battle. All the Princes know that when their brother Selim is
captured, he will be killed for treason.

The Ottoman navy takes anchor outside of cannon range for now, off the coast of the Mamluk encampment...with a splinter of the navy sailing down to the coast of Jerusalem.

1494:
The Mameluke Sultan, az-Zahir Sayf-ad-Din Jaqmaq, ordered the mobilization of all troops in Eastern Egypt and Sinai to confront the advancing Ottoman troops. Upon reaching an agreement concerning Prince Selim's claim to the Ottoman throne, the Mameluke troops of Eastern Egypt and Sinai were deployed to assist Prince Selim in his questif I am reading this correct the Marluk troops are allied with Prince Selim

1494: Rhodean galleys, in conjunction with a large fleet on loan from their Catholic Majesties of Spain (who are eager to buff their already shiny crusader bonefides) launch a surprise attack on Jaffa, and after seizing the city, march directly for Jerusalem, laying siege to the city and calling ofor it's surrender. While the army encamps and part of the navy begins ferrying supplies inland, a large portion of the Rhodean and Spanish galley fleet begin harrying the Egyptian coast, feinting towards Alexandria. DAubusson also calls on the Maronite Christians of Lebanon to aidhis army, as well as the Lebanese Druze.
?Which side are the KoR's allied with here?

1494:
The Christian King of Nubia accepts the protection of the Muslim Mameluke Sultanate.
?any reason why? remembre there are two quasi indepentent berber/arab kingdoms between the Eygpt and Alodi

P1495: Jerusalem falls, and DAubusson enters it in triumph (I'm extrapolating this development from the extra troubles of expansion and rebellion). DAubusson leaves a substantial Spanish/Rhodean garrison in Jerusalem, bolstered by Maronite warlords from the Lebanon who have come to aid their Catholic bretherin.

Next, DAubusson turns his eyes to Alodi, asking for aid from his Spanish, Neopolitan and Milanese allies to "free this Christian kingdom from the savage and heathen Mamluks." A large naval squadron begins sailing for Alexandria, preparing to capture this city then send forces down the Nile, thereby cutting the Mamluks in half, trapping Selim's forces between the Christians and Ottomans and freeing Alodi. DAubusson also sends a letter to the Nagas of Ethiopia asking him to come to the aid of his Christian brothers in Alodi.
except that Alodi is a thousand miles south, and voluntary accepted the overlordship of the Marluks

1495 - The Mamelukes begin their westward expansion towards the Barbary Coast. The Sultan orders the amassing of all able-bodied troops to the western borderlands. He deploys all southern troops to monitor civil unrest in the Protectorate of Nubia-Alodia.With thousands of ottoman and knights of Rhodes runing around the Levant, and attacking in Eygpt- ?you mass all your troops in Libya?

1496 - The Alodian Nubians begin an open revolt against their Mameluke oppressors. The Christian King of Nubia approaches Rhodes for assistance.
Only two years after inviting them in you are kicking them out.

1496 - Led by Prince Selim, the army of the Ottoman Empire marches towards their southeast border, intent on removing the Mamluks from the area*. The majority of those janissaries who aren't in the Rumeli of the Empire are accompanying the army.
what happened to the 1494 allaince with the Marluks


Spring 1496: Half of the janissaries who were in the Ottoman army fighting the Mamluks, joined with Selim (their favorite to inherit the Ottoman throne). The other half of the janissaries, fearing loss of privledge and status - not to mention the very existance of their Order - met them in open and pitched battle on the plains north of Jerusalem. The Bayezid-loyal ones won the day. The disloyal ones fled to Egypt and Persia, while the loyal ones were given residences in Rumeli.

Poets in the ensuing weeks and months, would call this the Janissary Civil War.


Summer 1496: Selim is captured by soldiers loyal to his brothers Ahmed and Korkud. Invited to dine with his brothers, Selim is poisoned during the dinner.
1496: Naples reasterts her claim to the defunct Kingdom of Jerusalem. They send troops to Jerusalem to back up the Crusaders.
Fall 1498: Having been injured in battle against the Mamluks, Bayezid finds his wounds are still a pain to him. First making certain that Prince Ahmed is in Constantinople, Bayezid embarks on the hajj, dining with regional nobles and notables on the road to Mecca.

Bayezid dies as he is making his return from completing the hajj. Ahmed, closest to Constantinople, grabs the throne; most of his brothers are already dead from battle and disease, but Ahmed orders the death of every surviving brother, save for Korkud, whose loyalty Ahmed considers to be beyond question.

To mark the coronation, a sailor brings to Constantinople something he has found and wrapped with the greatest of care: the hand of John the Baptist, found abandoned in a cave.

I think whe have some date problems here

[Keenir]

if I am reading this correct the Marluk troops are allied with Prince Selim

Selim's allied himself with them, yes, in the hopes of a victory that increases his chances of becoming Sultan.

what happened to the 1494 allaince with the Marluks

Selim led that wing of the army closer to the Mamluks so he'd be closer to friendly soldiers when he switched sides. (nothing worse than having to run the length of Anatolia with a ticked-off army on your tail) :)

[AJNolte]

In response:
1. Rhodeans and allies came in on the side of the Ottomans, grabbing Jerusalem from the Mamluks while their backs were turned.
2. When I talked to Ramero, he indicated that Alodi placed itself under the protection of the Mamluks under heavy Mamluk pressure, and rebelled once they got the chance.
3. You'll have to ask him why he moved his troops to Libya.
4. Missed the bit about Selim switching sides.
5. Anyway, the point of the Nile campaign was to keep the Mamluks from reinforcing Nubia, and only turned into a general invasion of Egypt once we realized that the Mamluks had, uh, left?
6. Dates: yep, we need to retcon/clarify dates.

If we can get the agreement of the Mamluks/Alodi, another course might be more sinsible:

1. Selim allies with the Mamluks, Ottomans and Mamluks prepare to clash in Syria.
2. After quiet negotiations with the Ottomans, Rhodeans, backed by Spanish and later joined by Niapolitans and Milanese, sweep into Palestine, capture Jerusalem and ally themselves with the Maronite Catholics.
3. Mamluks send an expedition into Jerusalem to retake it but are rebuffed. Spanish and Rhodean galleys, along with Itallians, begin engaging the Mamluk fleet and inflict a stinging defeat on it. The Mamluks had previously begun their conquests in North Aftrica.
4. Alodi take the opportunity to seize the territory Ramero previously indicated. The Mamluks are forced to sue for peace, as they have now been crushed in Syria, are unable to take back Palestine, have lost considerable territory to the Alodi (and their Ethiopian allies if you want in DQ) and are facing an increasingly restive situation in Egypt.

The peace treaty worked out so laboriously in international discussions can stand, minus the provisions about the Coptic protectorate (which we might be able to put back in later when the Mamluks inevitably try to take stuff back and are inevitably crushed).

How does this sound?

[DuQuense]

I rearranged stuff and spread it out a little.
How does this look for the war

1493
Prince Selim-enters into secret negotiations with the Marluk's.

1494
Led by Prince Selim, the army of the Ottoman Empire marches towards their southeast border, intent on removing the Mamluks from the area*.
The majority of those Janissary's who aren't in the Rumeli of the Empire are accompanying the army.

1494
Muhammahad XII has a fight with his Mother, and moves along with most of the Army of Granada [and the Treasury] to Zarzis in southern Tunisa.

1494:
The Mameluke Sultan, az-Zahir Sayf-ad-Din Jaqmaq, ordered the mobilization of all troops in Eastern Egypt and Sinai to confront the advancing Ottoman troops.
Upon reaching an agreement concerning Prince Selim's claim to the Ottoman throne, the Mameluke troops of Eastern Egypt and Sinai were deployed to assist Prince Selim in his quest


1495
The Mamelukes begin their westward expansion towards the Barbary Coast.
The Sultan, looking more to the battles in the Levant sends a small but powerful army, he believes will be able to conquer Tripolitania, and Tunisia, as both are suffering from Warlordism.

He also sends some troops with supplies for the Arab/Berber Kingdoms Fighting Alodi


1495
The Ottoman Sultan, Bayezid, Caliph to the Faithful, Shadow of God on Earth, heir of the Prophet, accompanied by Prince Ahmed and every other good son of the Caliph (all the sons but Selim) join the army in readiness for the impending battle. All the Princes know that when their brother Selim is captured, he will be killed for treason.

The Ottoman navy takes anchor outside of cannon range for now, off the coast of the Mamluk encampment...with a splinter of the navy sailing down to the coast of Jerusalem.


1496
Half of the janissaries who were in the Ottoman army fighting the Mamluks, joined with Selim (their favorite to inherit the Ottoman throne).
The other half of the janissaries, fearing loss of privledge and status - not to mention the very existance of their Order - met them in open and pitched battle on the plains north of Jerusalem.
The Bayezid-loyal ones won the day. The disloyal ones fled to Egypt and Persia, while the loyal ones were given residences in Rumeli.

Poets in the ensuing weeks and months, would call this the Janissary Civil War.

1495
The Marluks recapture all of Libya east of Tripolitania.

1495
Makuria, & Nobatia, begin winning some battle pushing Alodi away from the Coast.
The king of Alodi, send envoys to Ethiopia and to Europe requesting aid

1496
Rhodean galleys, in conjunction with a large fleet on loan from their Catholic Majesties of Spain (who are eager to buff their already shiny crusader bone fides) launch a surprise attack on Jaffa, and after seizing the city, march directly for Jerusalem, laying siege to the city and calling ofor it's surrender. While the army encamps and part of the navy begins ferrying supplies inland, a large portion of the Rhodean and Spanish galley fleet begin harrying the Egyptian coast, feinting towards Alexandria. DAubusson also calls on the Maronite Christians of Lebanon to aid his army, as well as the Lebanese Druze.


1496
Jerusalem falls, and DAubusson enters it in triumph.
DAubusson leaves a substantial Spanish/Rhodean garrison in Jerusalem, bolstered by Maronite warlords from the Lebanon who have come to aid their Catholic bretherin.

1496
The Army of Granada, Using their knowledge of the terrain, and the fact of the Marluk's long supply train defeat the Marluk army just east of Tripoli.

1496
The mini civil war over in Ethiopia, King Eslander sends an Army north to help his Christian Brother in Alodi.
Most of the troops sent are followers of the provincial Strongmen, farther weakening them.

1497
Next, DAubusson turns his eyes to Alodi, asking for aid from his Spanish, Neopolitan and Milanese allies to "free this Christian kingdom from the savage and heathen Mamluks."
A large naval squadron begins sailing for Alexandria, preparing to capture this city then send forces down the Nile, thereby cutting the Mamluks in half, trapping Selim's forces between the Christians and Ottomans and freeing Alodi.
DAubusson also sends a letter to the Nagas of Ethiopia asking him to come to the aid of his Christian brothers in Alodi.

1497
Selim is captured by soldiers loyal to his brothers Ahmed and Korkud. Invited to dine with his brothers, Selim is poisoned during the dinner.

1497
The Marluks ask for terms, and the war ends.
the Ottoman's receive Syria, and the Levant outside of Jerusalem.
Tunisia receives Tripolitania.
Alodi receives all of Nubia south of the old pre Marluk border. That there are two Muslim Kingdoms in the area, is ignored in the peace settlement.
The Crusaders [except they do not call themselves that] receive Jerusalem, and Alexandria.

1497
Naples reasserts her claim to the defunct Kingdom of Jerusalem. They send troops to Jerusalem to back up the Crusaders.

Fall 1498: Having been injured in battle against the Mamluks, Bayezid finds his wounds are still a pain to him.
First making certain that Prince Ahmed is in Constantinople, Bayezid embarks on the hajj, dining with regional nobles and notables on the road to Mecca.

Bayezid dies as he is making his return from completing the hajj.
Ahmed, closest to Constantinople, grabs the throne; most of his brothers are already dead from battle and disease, but Ahmed orders the death of every surviving brother, save for Korkud, whose loyalty Ahmed considers to be beyond question.

To mark the coronation, a sailor brings to Constantinople something he has found and wrapped with the greatest of care: the hand of John the Baptist, found abandoned in a cave.


Everyone got something; Ottomans got Syria/ Levant, Tunisia got Tripolitania, Alodi got Nubia, The KoR got Jerusalem, and the Marluks got eastern Libya.
Whe recon out the piece about the Ottomans sending troops in Arabia, and whe are back on track,
And whe wait till about 1510's to launch the second Marluk War.

[AJNolte]

Sounds like a plan to me. Anyone have any objections?

[Glen]

?Whould It be possible to Retcon a more complete/Coherent TL for the Marluk War.?

I suggest something like this

Marluks attack into Libya, and are defeated at Tripoli by the Granadians. [Hafid Kingdom]

This triggers the Ottomans to attack into Syria, along with their Kights of Rhodes allies

The Marluks collaspe, triggering the Alodi to revolt, the Ethiopians send warriors to help

Seeing how complete the Marluks collasped in Syria, someone [either ottomans or some europe power] invades Eygpt.

Marluks are removed, [20 years early] and someone else now controls eygpt /east libya, while the Alodi control all of Nubia, and the Granadians control western Libya.


If everyone agrees, then yes, it would be possible. The current version is still in rough draft. At some point the events will have to be finalized so people have a stable history, but this is early and the changes seem mild.

[Glen]

If everyone agrees, then yes, it would be possible. The current version is still in rough draft. At some point the events will have to be finalized so people have a stable history, but this is early and the changes seem mild.

Anyone else need to 'bless' the retcon?

[The Sicilian]

Hold on. Who exactly controls Jerusalem? The Knights? Naples? Ottomans?

[Keenir]

Hold on. Who exactly controls Jerusalem? The Knights? Naples? Ottomans?

Ottomans (get tithed to)...though it is fairly autonomous & ruled by the King of Naples (also the Latin Patriarch)

actually, I think Jerusalem is the one place thatdoesn't have a Knights commandry.
:)

[DuQuense]

After the end of the war in 1497, whe are back on track with all that Rex Islam and D Argaondon Patriarch of Jerusalem posts.

just the whole- Go help Alodi-never got past the capture of Alexandria.
I think the Attackers would withdraw as part of the peace, but whe need a post about Alexanderia and what happens.

@ Glen; I think everyone involved has agreed to the 1493 thru 1497 war, and you have to go the the individual posts now for the post 1497 followups

[Glen]

Okay...now I need to know which events need to be taken out of the timeline.

[DuQuense]

I believe this is what needs to come out. the rest is a matter of changing dates to make it flow correctly, or some new stuff.


1494:
The Christian King of Nubia accepts the protection of the Muslim Mameluke Sultanate.1495 - The Mamelukes begin their westward expansion towards the Barbary Coast. The Sultan orders the amassing of all able-bodied troops to the western borderlands. He deploys all southern troops to monitor civil unrest in the Protectorate of Nubia-Alodia.1496 - The Alodian Nubians begin an open revolt against their Mameluke oppressors. The Christian King of Nubia approaches Rhodes for assistance.

[AJNolte]

Well, actually, yes it does. I just realized that I forgot to officially write that up: I will do so post haste. Ottomans (get tithed to)...though it is fairly autonomous & ruled by the King of Naples (also the Latin Patriarch)

actually, I think Jerusalem is the one place thatdoesn't have a Knights commandry.
:)