1493 Sign Up

[Glen]

Sign Up Rules:

You pick an OTL nation from 1492/3. Every twenty-four hours after the thread is posted, you may pick another (not twenty-four hours after your last pick). If you have missed one or more twenty-four hour round(s), you may select as many nations as there have been rounds to catch you up. The only advantage of choosing nations every twenty-four hours is to maximize your chances of getting assigned the nations you are most interested in.

People can release nations at any time if they decide they do not want that one, and may trade for nation(s) not yet chosen up to the number of rounds selection is up to. There is no limit to the number of nations you may select total, but please be realistic and choose a manageable number. Also recommend you choose nations you are familiar with if possible. Especially desirable would be people selecting nations they are familiar with that most people are not.

Remember, the first several decades you will have to be fairly true to the nation's OTL character, making plausible changes to the timeline (though if well selected, those can be cumulative and have some significant effects over time).

[arctic warrior]

[/QUOTE]
Where is that? Can someone translate this for me?:confused:

Ditmarschen is west of the Duchy of Holstein, north of the river Elbe. It's marked on the map here:
A 1477 Map

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/historical/shepherd/central_europe_1477.jpg
__________________

[Glen]

Claims to date (day 36ish):

Glen - England, Ireland, Swiss Confederacy, Duchy of Savoy, Monaco, Trent, Montferrat, Mohecan Tribe, Ngai Tahu, Nga Puhi, Oahu, Kaua'i, Maui, Hawai'i (Big Island), White Sheep Turkomen, Tahiti, Basel, Brixen, Ragusa, Bear Huron, Cord Huron, Lenape tribes

Psychomeltdown - Portugal

Jacobite - Scotland

General Paul - Ming China, Chagatai Khanate, Timurid Empire

Messiniano - Naples, Milan, Sienna

Tom Veil - Iroquois (Haudenosaunee), Delhi Sultanate, Susquehannock, Mewar, Erielhonan, Neutral Nation of Attawandaron, Stadacona, Hochelega, Orissa.

Drakerlugia - France, Navarre

Kineticbots - Japan, Ryukyu

SleepaholicAgent - Tibet, Joseon (Korea)

pa dutch - Mapuche, Miskito, Ohkay Owingeh, Teton Lakota (seven tribes total), Hunkpapa, Micmac, Wabanaki Confederacy, Tu'i Tonga

DuQuense - Ethiopia, Dai Viet (Vietnam), Champa, Khmer (Cambodia), Hasfid Kingdom, Garad Dynasty, Vijayanagara Empire, Lao

Pompejus - Free County of Burgandy & Burgundian Netherlands, Duchy of Upper Lorraine, Friesland, Gelre, bishopric of Utrecht, Duchy of Cleve (& Mark), Duchy of Julich & Berg, Cologne, Liege, East-Frisia, Münster, Metz, Bentheim, County of Horne, Tecklenburg, Osnabruck, Verdun, Toul, Cambrai

Lightinfa - Sweden

Redbeard & arctic winter - Denmark/Norway, Holstein, Ditmarschen

Analytical Engine - Brandenburg, Brunswick-Lüneburg, Duchy of Pomerania, Archbishopric of Bremen, Duchy of Brunswick-Wolfenbüttel, Brunswick-Grubenhagen , County of Oldenburg , Bishopric of Verden, Hoya, County of Diepholz, Lippe, Lauenburg, Magdeburg, Hildershim, Minden, Halberstadt, Ruppin, Kammin

serebryakov - Poland, Lithuania

RCTFI - Austria (and unclaimed areas of Holy Roman Empire), Bavaria-Munich, Bavaria-Landshut, Bavaria-Dachau, Bohemia & Hungary, Baden, Gorizia, Salzburg

Keenir - Ottoman Empire, Ferghana, Duchy of Ferrara, Modena and Reggio, Mantua, Palatinate, Nahnmwarkis, Saudeleurs, Pohnpei

john - Papal States, Teutonic Prussia (Teutonic Knights), Genoa, Florence (includes Pisa, Livorno), Rep of Lucca, Duchy of Mecklenburg, Majapahit

marl d - Moscovy/Rus, Livonian Confederation, Khazan Khanate, Sibir Khanate, Astrakhan, Khanate of the Krimea


AJNolte - Rhodes, Kingdom of Kongo, Hanseatic League, Ernestine Saxony, Albertine Saxony, Mainz, Trier, Spain, Maronites, Druze

Atom - Tawantinsinyu (Inca), Makah, People of the Inside (Duwamish), People of the Outside (Duwamish)

BlackMage - Gowa, Gunditjmara, Sultanate of Malacca, Yolngu

Cthulhu - Mexica (Aztecs)

JP Morgan - Songhai Empire

Haggis - Alibamu-Koasati

Susano - Upper Hesse, Lower Hesse

The Sandman - Oman, Yemen, Kilwa, Mogadishu, Mombasa, Zanzibar, Sofala, Malindi, Maldives, Bahrain, Dubai, Zimbabwe, Al Ain, Comoros, Sakalava, Betsileo

Smaug - Itza Maya, Ko'woj, Mariche, Taironas, Northern Muisca Confederation, Southern Muisca Confederation, Magua, Marien, Xaragua, Maguana, Higuey, Benin, Kano, Katsina, Oyo, Aro, Huastecs

rameiro - Powhatan, Alodia (Nubia), Mameluke Empire (Egypt)

Charles II - Morocco, Fez

BBJ1580 - Brunei, Wampanoag, Sulu Sultanate, Maguindanao, Siam

joemac - Arrente, Otoe, Kel Aijer, Kel Ahaggar

Aussey - Ngoyo, Kakongo, Ndongo, Matamba, Guarani

VulcanTrekkie45 - Moldavia, Wallachia, Manisses

Tentative pending clarification:

Susano - Nassovian Principalities pending clarification

Keenir - Some Uighur successor state(s) pending specification

[Glen]

Question to my Native American experts.

Where do you think my Huron are located in the 1490s?

Oh, and while I'm posting, I'll go ahead and add the Samoans to my claims. They're kinda cool.:D

[Glen]

Well, after reviewing everything, I've decided that these folks are open after all....

Totonac. I want the Vanilla!!!

[Tom Veil]

Question to my Native American experts.

Where do you think my Huron are located in the 1490s?


South Ontario (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07565a.htm), although they're still in their wandering phase.

[AJNolte]

Since this post is left open with DAubusson's death in 1509, I'd like to officially claim the Latin Patriarchate of Jerusalem. Messiniano and I are working out how this and my Maronite claims will effect the KoJ, but the claims shouldn't directly conflict.

Question re: church stuff. If, for example, Cardinal Cajitan were to be appointed Latin Patriarch here, would I have to clear it with France just because he's in France, or would talking to the Pope suffice.

[Glen]

Since this post is left open with DAubusson's death in 1509, I'd like to officially claim the Latin Patriarchate of Jerusalem. Messiniano and I are working out how this and my Maronite claims will effect the KoJ, but the claims shouldn't directly conflict.

Question re: church stuff. If, for example, Cardinal Cajitan were to be appointed Latin Patriarch here, would I have to clear it with France just because he's in France, or would talking to the Pope suffice.

Would be best to run it past both of them. If they disagree, we'd need to talk about it. If one or more just doesn't answer, then make certain they've been PMed, post it for consideration (noting pending comment from participant), and if in 48 hours we don't hear from them and it seems reasonable, we'll go for it.

[The Sicilian]

Me and AJ worked this solution out over PM:
A primative sort of speration of powers with a Neapolitan king, a grand council of nobles and an ecclesiastical court system, presided over by the Patriarch's court, all under the theoretical blessing of the Ottoman Sultan. I handle International/secular events and AJ handles spiritual events along with those relating to the Maronites.

I suppose that since AJ has claimed the Patriarchate I will claim the Kingdom.

[AJNolte]

Me and AJ worked this solution out over PM:
A primative sort of speration of powers with a Neapolitan king, a grand council of nobles and an ecclesiastical court system, presided over by the Patriarch's court, all under the theoretical blessing of the Ottoman Sultan. I handle International/secular events and AJ handles spiritual events along with those relating to the Maronites.

I suppose that since AJ has claimed the Patriarchate I will claim the Kingdom.
Do you need to? I think Alphonso, since he's in charge in both places, gets it automatically.
That said, it can't hurt.

[Glen]

john unfortunately has dropped out of the project.

However, that does free up some items.

AJNolte has already accepted the Teutonic Knights.

john tells me he has offered to Messesiano (sp?) his Italian holdings, specifically:

the papal states
Lucca
Genoa
Florence

but did not hear back from him, so we'll put those into the pot.

Personally, I'd like to stake a claim on Genoa.

Also now free are:

Duchy of Mecklenburg
Majahapit Empire

I'll update the claims to date page later.

[Locke]

Did I ever tell you that I also dropped out? I thought I did, but oh well.

Yeah Spain is up for grabs I geuss or its a NPC nation.

I thought I posted somewhere that I was no longer doing it.

[Glen]

Did I ever tell you that I also dropped out? I thought I did, but oh well.

Yeah Spain is up for grabs I geuss or its a NPC nation.

I thought I posted somewhere that I was no longer doing it.

Yeah, AJNolte has that, but thanks for clarifying. BTW, please do stop in from time to time to critique the events. We need every set of eyes we can get.

[Locke]

Sure, no problem.

[The Sicilian]

john unfortunately has dropped out of the project.

However, that does free up some items.

AJNolte has already accepted the Teutonic Knights.

john tells me he has offered to Messesiano (sp?) his Italian holdings, specifically:

the papal states
Lucca
Genoa
Florence

but did not hear back from him, so we'll put those into the pot.

Personally, I'd like to stake a claim on Genoa.

Also now free are:

Duchy of Mecklenburg
Majahapit Empire

I'll update the claims to date page later.
No, I accepted them. Since I thought that he would be off the computer from that point on, I didn't respond to his PM. Me and AJ agreed to split the affairs of the Papacy. He will deal with the theological stuff, I'll deal with the secular stuff.

If you still want Genoa, PM me Glen

[AJNolte]

No, I accepted them. Since I thought that he would be off the computer from that point on, I didn't respond to his PM. Me and AJ agreed to split the affairs of the Papacy. He will deal with the theological stuff, I'll deal with the secular stuff.

If you still want Genoa, PM me Glen
John Also offered me Mecklenburg, and I accepted. Just to make it official, I'll claim it hear.

[Glen]

John Also offered me Mecklenburg, and I accepted. Just to make it official, I'll claim it hear.

Okay. That wasn't in his PM, so thanks for clarifying.

[AJNolte]

As Keenir is unable to post this week, he asked me to claim the Khoisan and the Armenian Millet for him.

[Glen]

As Keenir is unable to post this week, he asked me to claim the Khoisan and the Armenian Millet for him.

Noted.:) mindless filler

[AJNolte]

I'd like to officially transfer my claim to Kongo to Aussie. I don't think I have the time or experience/knowledge base to do it justice.

[Glen]

I'd like to officially transfer my claim to Kongo to Aussie. I don't think I have the time or experience/knowledge base to do it justice.

Noted. Africa will never be the same.:rolleyes:

[Aussey]

Noted. Africa will never be the same.:rolleyes:
ha.
ha.
ha.

[Psychomeltdown]

Noted. Africa will never be the same.:rolleyes:

Well at least there won't be an uber Hansa, Spanish, Kongo alliance... :D

[Keenir]

Well at least there won't be an uber Hansa, Spanish, Kongo alliance... :D

no....but now the Kongo will be a millet within my empire!
mwahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!



















:rolleyes:;)

[Keenir]

Noted

thank you both.

.:) mindless filler

that I am.
:cool:

[Keenir]

As Keenir is unable to post this week, he asked me to claim the Khoisan and the Armenian Millet for him.

I just wonder if anyone's going to be my Herero neighbors. or the Hottentots.

[Aussey]

I just wonder if anyone's going to be my Herero neighbors. or the Hottentots.

Hottentots, I believe, are a coloured people- meaning they don't exist in this TL as that would make them a mix of Dutch/Afrikanner and African...

[Tom Veil]

Hottentots, I believe, are a coloured people- meaning they don't exist in this TL as that would make them a mix of Dutch/Afrikanner and African...
Actually, the Hottentots (who refer to themselves as Khoikhoi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoikhoi) or Khoisan) are a separate race native to Africa. They often look like mixed Dutch/black African, and (although I don't know myself) I would not be surprised to learn that they were treated like Coloureds during apartheid.

[marl_d]

hey Glen, serebryakov hasn't been around since May 19th, he's got Poland/Lith.....are you going to give him some time to show up or...is Poland/Lith NPC/up for grabs?

Just wondering, cuz they affect Russia a lot during this time period and are kinda a big power

[AJNolte]

Well at least there won't be an uber Hansa, Spanish, Kongo alliance... :D

***Begins to grin evilly and laugh maniacally...***

[AJNolte]

I think the consensus was to give people until June 14 or so right?hey Glen, serebryakov hasn't been around since May 19th, he's got Poland/Lith.....are you going to give him some time to show up or...is Poland/Lith NPC/up for grabs?

Just wondering, cuz they affect Russia a lot during this time period and are kinda a big power

[marl_d]

ok....no biggie then, i was just wondering

[Smaug]

Actually, the Hottentots (who refer to themselves as Khoikhoi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoikhoi) or Khoisan) are a separate race native to Africa. They often look like mixed Dutch/black African, and (although I don't know myself) I would not be surprised to learn that they were treated like Coloureds during apartheid.


I would fling into this that there is some evidence that the Hottentots, and Khoisans(?), may very well have had some Asian influences, probably through Madagascar. Surely they had a quite different culture than the rest of the African cultures, what with using clicks in language.

[Keenir]

I would fling into this that there is some evidence that the Hottentots, and Khoisans(?), may very well have had some Asian influences, probably through Madagascar. Surely they had a quite different culture than the rest of the African cultures, what with using clicks in language.

so do some male-only (initiation?) languages in Australia. last I checked, the Khoisan are the most likely to have the language most similar to (not identical to) the first humans to leave Africa.

[Smaug]

so do some male-only (initiation?) languages in Australia. last I checked, the Khoisan are the most likely to have the language most similar to (not identical to) the first humans to leave Africa.

All I'm implying is that there was some exchange of DNA between Asia and Southern Africa in pre-recorded history. Its a bad arguement, mind you, but if you look at a picture of Nelson Mandella, as an example. You'll find that he displays a bit of an Epicanthic fold, much like Amerindians and other Asian peoples. Madagascar native appear to have this also. I seem to recall a blood work type experiment done, that did demonstrate that Madagascarese (for lack of a better term), did hold some genetic nuances that implyed Asian origin.

Personally I think alot more happened in prehistory in the Indian Ocean region, at very early dates. The drawback to the region is that parts of it are somewhat of a bamboo based civ, which left very little archeological evidence of very early occupation.

[Keenir]

All I'm implying is that there was some exchange of DNA between Asia and Southern Africa in pre-recorded history.

besides Out Of Africa. ;)

Madagascar native appear to have this also. I seem to recall a blood work type experiment done, that did demonstrate that Madagascarese (for lack of a better term), did hold some genetic nuances that implyed Asian origin.

basic anthropology - Madagascar was settled in/around 800 AD by Polynesians.

Malagasy

[Keenir]

The drawback to the region is that parts of it are somewhat of a bamboo based civ,

now that would be cool!

[Smaug]

now that would be cool!

I can't remember the name of it, but there is a line thats been drawn in India. It differentiates stone working Civs, and civs that relied on bamboo. Tried to find it but can't:(

[marl_d]

i remember reading something along those lines when i was looking up info on Madagascar after the movie came out....(yes i'm a sucker, i had to learn about Fusas, my kids watch it all the time and love the movie) I actually think that they came from China and not India, though i think there was some Polynesians in there too

[Smaug]

i remember reading something along those lines when i was looking up info on Madagascar after the movie came out....(yes i'm a sucker, i had to learn about Fusas, my kids watch it all the time and love the movie) I actually think that they came from China and not India, though i think there was some Polynesians in there too

I'm inclined to think that they were Malaysian/Melanesian, but thats just a hunch....

[Glen]

I need someone to go through the sign up list here and make a list of what participants haven't posted anything yet.

Joemac is excused as he told me he would be delayed and should be back with us soon.

Just need a list for now. Next step will be to PM everyone who hasn't posted anything to see if they are still in or not. We'll go from there.

[The Sicilian]

I'll do it, if someone hasn't done it already.

[Glen]

I'll do it, if someone hasn't done it already.

Thanks Messiniano.

[Glen]

Nicksplace27 is out.

Venice is up for adoption.

[Keenir]

Nicksplace27 is out.

Venice is up for adoption.

I'll adopt it.

don't worry - I've got very anti-Ottoman ideas for Venice.

[marl_d]

ok, just out of courisoity, what are we doing about the people who haven't shown up, posted or responded to PM's?

[Glen]

ok, just out of courisoity, what are we doing about the people who haven't shown up, posted or responded to PM's?

If someone has never posted, never responded, we will have to assume that the nation is abandoned and offer them up once more.

If I don't hear or see anyone by the end of this Friday, I will put up the nations in question for adoption (though I PMed Jacobite ages ago about taking Scotland if he's out:rolleyes:).

[marl_d]

If someone has never posted, never responded, we will have to assume that the nation is abandoned and offer them up once more.

If I don't hear or see anyone by the end of this Friday, I will put up the nations in question for adoption (though I PMed Jacobite ages ago about taking Scotland if he's out:rolleyes:).

ok...cuz if serebryakov is still in i don't want to step on his toes with Lith/Poland...while i wouldn't mind taking it over, i've got a lot on my plate right now with my new job and trying to find a place to live. for russia having a major war right now would be kinda nice and Lith would be a good one to have it against...plus...i need someone to help with the Crimean problem :cool::D

[AJNolte]

And if the person playing Navarre does show up, please PM me.

[Keenir]

if France drops out, I'd like to claim that nation.

[Tom Veil]

France and Navarre have had weeks to show up. I say, AJ and Keenir get them TODAY, so that they can use the weekend to write up a TL and work out and retconning before we open up events after 1520.

[Glen]

France and Navarre have had weeks to show up. I say, AJ and Keenir get them TODAY, so that they can use the weekend to write up a TL and work out and retconning before we open up events after 1520.

Agreed.

And I get Scotland.

[Glen]

And for simplicity's sake, I'll also take the Azteca....should prove interesting.

[Glen]

Abandoned territories not already spoken for:

SleepaholicAgent - Tibet, Joseon (Korea)

Charles II - Morocco, Fez

All the previous tentative requests placed in THIS thread are granted.

Did I miss anything?

[Keenir]

Abandoned territories not already spoken for:

SleepaholicAgent - Tibet, Joseon (Korea)

Korea, please.

(just in case my idea for Uighur-China relations fails, I can fall back on Uighur-Korean or Korean-Chinese relations)

[Tom Veil]

In my India research, I came to the conclusion that Tibetan history until the Industrial Revolution will be pretty much the same as OTL: no one goes in, no one goes out, at least not with appreciable effect. Unless someone is really excited by pastoral living, I don't think there's a need for anyone to play Tibet.

[Glen]

In my India research, I came to the conclusion that Tibetan history until the Industrial Revolution will be pretty much the same as OTL: no one goes in, no one goes out, at least not with appreciable effect. Unless someone is really excited by pastoral living, I don't think there's a need for anyone to play Tibet.

Need? No. Desire? Who knows?

[Keenir]

Need? No. Desire? Who knows?

Tibet used to kick serious butt. that could come back again...maybe.

(if nothing else, have fun with the living goddesses of the area)

[Blackbeard]

If its not too much can I join, I know I'm incredibly late but my greatest wish would be to take over Wallachia but I'll take any other country

[Glen]

If its not too much can I join, I know I'm incredibly late but my greatest wish would be to take over Wallachia but I'll take any other country

Welcome! Talk to VulcanTrekkie45 as he currently is running Wallachia. You two might do a team-up, which can be helpful when one participant can't check in all the time.

[AJNolte]

Is Analytical Engine still participating?
If so, could you PM me re: HRE and reformation issues?
Thanks.

[marl_d]

Poland/Lith is availble unless severbsky isn't doing it

[Keenir]

who's running Tuscany? I need to talk to its owner about Michelangelo Buonarroti.

(if nobody has Tuscany, can I just grab Michelangelo?)

[The Sicilian]

I run Florence and Sienna.

[Keenir]

I run Florence and Sienna.

oh. thought Tuscany had its own city-state.

everybody else did at the time. :D;)

so...could I have/borrow Michelangelo?

[The Sicilian]

It had a few city states that were eventually centralised as the Medici Grand Duchy of Tuscany

For what do you want him for exactly?

[Keenir]

It had a few city states that were eventually centralised as the Medici Grand Duchy of Tuscany

For what do you want him for exactly?

the era needs artwork, and the Sultan is more than willing to pay handsomely for quality art.

(so are the competing lords of Mantua, but they don't have pockets quite as deep)

[Glen]

the era needs artwork, and the Sultan is more than willing to pay handsomely for quality art.

(so are the competing lords of Mantua, but they don't have pockets quite as deep)

You want Michaelangelo to do some art for the Ottoman?:eek:

You do realize that he can't really depict any people in public art in the Muslim world, right?

I would think that Michaelangelo's art would be the wrong type for the Sublime Porte's interest.

[Keenir]

You want Michaelangelo to do some art for the Ottoman?:eek:

You do realize that he can't really depict any people in public art in the Muslim world, right?

well, besides the fact that lots of OTL Sultans had paintings of themselves done, there's more to art than statuary and portraits. (surely a genius like Michaelangelo would find plenty to occupy him)

I would think that Michaelangelo's art would be the wrong type for the Sublime Porte's interest.

if Da Vinci can do more than one thing for more than one employer, why can't Michaelangel? (that's my reasoning)

[Blackbeard]

If you need somebody on poland I'll take over

[Tom Veil]

It's possible, but ...
1) Michelangelo would probably have enough business sense that he would only agree to it if the Church first gave its blessing -- he can't lose his best employer.
2) It would be an artistic tragedy. Take a look at http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Michelangelo_Buonarroti and it's clear that Michelangelo's great talent is in the portrayal of the human form. He could do some neat architecture for the Sultan, but nothing that couldn't be done by a less famous master architect.

[Keenir]

It's possible, but ...
1) Michelangelo would probably have enough business sense that he would only agree to it if the Church first gave its blessing -- he can't lose his best employer.
2) It would be an artistic tragedy. Take a look at http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Michelangelo_Buonarroti and it's clear that Michelangelo's great talent is in the portrayal of the human form. He could do some neat architecture for the Sultan, but nothing that couldn't be done by a less famous master architect.

in answer to both points - it seems that, in the absence of the Italian Wars, there was no artwork done of any kind (Leonardo da Vinci was given a teaching job, and none of his rivals were mentioned by anyone)

hence, waste not, want not.
(and as I said, Mantua would happily take him in, if he's willing to work for less than the wealth the Sultan would give him)

[AJNolte]

in answer to both points - it seems that, in the absence of the Italian Wars, there was no artwork done of any kind (Leonardo da Vinci was given a teaching job, and none of his rivals were mentioned by anyone)

hence, waste not, want not.
(and as I said, Mantua would happily take him in, if he's willing to work for less than the wealth the Sultan would give him)


Or you could loan him to your cousin Constantine of Rhodes. Some sculptures and portraits by Michelangelo would make handsome coronation or even birthday gifts ***cough cough***

[Glen]

If you need somebody on poland I'll take over

I believe that marl indicated his interest in taking that over, however I'd ask him to consider letting you do so so that we could get you involved in the project. Please PM him to discuss it.

[The Sicilian]

Hey, just because I don't plot out each piece of art in the Italian renaissance doesn't mean the artists are in hibernation. Michaelangelo stays in Italy.

And to answer that thing about da Vinci having multiple employers; Leonardo was basically the greatest polymath (Renaissance man) that humanity has produced so far. Michaelangelo was not nearly as skilled.

[Keenir]

Hey, just because I don't plot out each piece of art in the Italian renaissance doesn't mean the artists are in hibernation. Michaelangelo stays in Italy.

I'm not commenting on the lack of every piece of art...I was commenting on the lack of any piece of art.

ps: Mantua then? splendid.

[The Sicilian]

Forgive me, I didn't believe that they were important enough for the timeline.

As for Mantua, that is pushing plausibility boundaries. Renaissance artists sticked with the big (and rich) countries ; Florence, Milan, Venice and Papal States. But we've progressed far enough into the timeline for you to make your own Renaissance artists. Perhaps he was trained by one of the masters in Florence and returned to Mantua.

[Keenir]

Forgive me,

I shall grant you a forgiveness and a dispensation, my child...but I fear that Wettin would deny you and your soul such important items.

:D;):D:cool:

I didn't believe that they were important enough for the timeline.

da Vinci didn't think the Mona Lisa was finished - not even on the day he died. just mention the highlights, and fill in the rest later (if you feel the desire to)

[marl_d]

I believe that marl indicated his interest in taking that over, however I'd ask him to consider letting you do so so that we could get you involved in the project. Please PM him to discuss it.

actually, i'd rather NOT take it due to time constraints with work, he's more than welcome to both

[Glen]

If you need somebody on poland I'll take over

Okay, Blackbeard, you want just Poland, or Poland and Lithuania?

[Blackbeard]

I don't much about Lithuania, and I've already agreed to help VulcanTrekkie with a plan of his. So, I might take just Poland. Also who's in power in the Ukraine, or I guess it would be the Kievan state?

[marl_d]

the thing with Lith, is that it was in personal union with Poland, if your not going to take it, then i will

[Blackbeard]

Take it if you want

[marl_d]

tell you the truth, i'd rather not, due to lack of time and i already have a big group of countries...personally i think you should take it.

[Tomb]

Howdy. I'm just trying to join the game, been talking to Glen and I think I am getting the basis of the rules and how things work and such. Problem at the momment is just trying to find a nation to control. Possibly the Tarascans to start out?

[Glen]

Howdy. I'm just trying to join the game, been talking to Glen and I think I am getting the basis of the rules and how things work and such. Problem at the momment is just trying to find a nation to control. Possibly the Tarascans to start out?

That would be fine. While I still need to post the specific events, I'll let you know that an alliance Huastecs, Totonacs, and other disgruntled folks with English supplied weapons and a few English horsemen took down the Aztecs by around 1505ish. The Totonac are now in charge of the former Aztec empire, and a Protectorate of the English (then Anglo-British), the Huastecs are a separate protectorate.

Be interested to hear how the Tarascans interact. Note that English weapons can only be bought or traded with an oath or affirmation of loyalty to the English Crown.

[Tomb]

Alright great, I'll wait abit before I act to get a hang on how things work. Also get in touch with those who control nations int he immediate mesoamerica area.

[Glen]

Alright great, I'll wait abit before I act to get a hang on how things work. Also get in touch with those who control nations int he immediate mesoamerica area.

That would be me and Smaug. Your closest two nations run by participants would be the Totonac Protectorate (a protectorate of England that has just conquered the Aztec empire with the aid of the Huastec), and the Huastec Protectorate (Smaug's land of naked Mesoamericans who also are under the protection and trade with the English).

[marl_d]

hey Glen, can you post an updated list of who controls what?

[Smaug]

That would be me and Smaug. Your closest two nations run by participants would be the Totonac Protectorate (a protectorate of England that has just conquered the Aztec empire with the aid of the Huastec), and the Huastec Protectorate (Smaug's land of naked Mesoamericans who also are under the protection and trade with the English).

They're not naked anymore.... mostly :)

[AJNolte]

tell you the truth, i'd rather not, due to lack of time and i already have a big group of countries...personally i think you should take it.

Fine: Lithuania. Blackbeard and Marl: PM me. <g>

[AJNolte]

Unless Blackbeard already claimed it? In which case I'll withdraw my claim.

Fine: Lithuania. Blackbeard and Marl: PM me. <g>

[AJNolte]

Technically the Patriarch of Constantinople is semi-autonomous with respect to the Ottoman Empire, at least in spiritual matters. With the understanding that his influence is mainly spiritual/theological, I'd like to claim the patriarchate of Constantinople.

[Keenir]

"Hate" isn't the right word...."become paranoid" would be more accurate/apt. :)

Technically the Patriarch of Constantinople is semi-autonomous with respect to the Ottoman Empire, at least in spiritual matters. With the understanding that his influence is mainly spiritual/theological, I'd like to claim the patriarchate of Constantinople.

I'm a little wary here....given that you're also the Knights of Rhodes and Rhodes itself.
(you're offering to be your own counterbalance?) :)


but, lets see if anybody else would like to be the Patriarch....if nobody volunteers, I accept your bid.
(sound fair?)

[AJNolte]

"Hate" isn't the right word...."become paranoid" would be more accurate/apt. :)



I'm a little wary here....given that you're also the Knights of Rhodes and Rhodes itself.
(you're offering to be your own counterbalance?) :)


but, lets see if anybody else would like to be the Patriarch....if nobody volunteers, I accept your bid.
(sound fair?)


If you knew my theology very well, you'd not be surprised that I'm playing TTL's Luther, a crusading order and the ecumenical patriarch, all of whom...err...don't like each other very much. Yes, I think I can uphold both sides of the Catholic/Orthodox schism, mainly because I empathize with both. <g>

Seriously, I'm mainly looking for the ability to influence Eastern Orthodox theology, not Ottoman politics, with this claim.

[Keenir]

If you knew my theology very well,

I'm still reading up on Hussite/Brethren/Moravian theology.

you'd not be surprised that I'm playing TTL's Luther, a crusading order and the ecumenical patriarch, all of whom...err...don't like each other very much.

I eagerly look forward to the bloodbath. :cool:

Seriously, I'm mainly looking for the ability to influence Eastern Orthodox theology, not Ottoman politics, with this claim.

very well then...just remember you're First Among Equals, not He Who Lays Down The Law ;)

[AJNolte]

I'm still reading up on Hussite/Brethren/Moravian theology.



I eagerly look forward to the bloodbath. :cool:



very well then...just remember you're First Among Equals, not He Who Lays Down The Law ;)

Indeed, I'm well aware of the limitations of Constantinople's power relative to the rest.
Good on you re: Moravians, they're an interesting bunch. Somewhere between OTL Calvin and Luther, so probably on the liberal end of the Wettinite spectrum ITTL.
Blood bath: hopefully not. Lots of nasty polemical theology, particularly in this time period. And maybe some conflicts in the HRE and elsewhere.

[marl_d]

hey, i'm going to claim the Nogai Horde

[Glen]

Indeed, I'm well aware of the limitations of Constantinople's power relative to the rest.
Good on you re: Moravians, they're an interesting bunch. Somewhere between OTL Calvin and Luther, so probably on the liberal end of the Wettinite spectrum ITTL.
Blood bath: hopefully not. Lots of nasty polemical theology, particularly in this time period. And maybe some conflicts in the HRE and elsewhere.

I'm afraid that there will be blood. Now then, what we can try to do is make the fighting more definitive instead of the bleeding wound that kept the HRE in turmoil for a century.

[Glen]

hey, i'm going to claim the Nogai Horde

Noted. mindless filler

[Kang Seung Jae]

Hmmm... guys, may I join?


I want to be Koryo, the nation that's on the Korean Peninsula.

[Glen]

Hmmm... guys, may I join?


I want to be Koryo, the nation that's on the Korean Peninsula.

Keenir had control over the Korean Peninsula last, but he has done nothing with it....IIRC he took it for a backup position.

I think Keenir would be likely to cede it to your control. Is that true, Keenir?

[Keenir]

Keenir had control over the Korean Peninsula last, but he has done nothing with it....IIRC he took it for a backup position.

I think Keenir would be likely to cede it to your control. Is that true, Keenir?

it is very true.

if I may ask, Kang Seung Jae, do you know much about the Uighur?

[Glen]

Claims as of 7.9.2007:

Glen - England, Ireland, Swiss Confederacy, Duchy of Savoy, Monaco, Trent, Montferrat, Mohecan Tribe, Ngai Tahu, Nga Puhi, Oahu, Kaua'i, Maui, Hawai'i (Big Island), White Sheep Turkomen, Tahiti, Basel, Brixen, Ragusa, Bear Huron, Cord Huron, Lenape tribes, Samoans, Aztec Alliance, Scotland, Genoa (split)

Psychomeltdown - Portugal

General Paul - Ming China, Chagatai Khanate, Timurid Empire

Messiniano - Naples, Milan, Sienna, Florence (includes Pisa, Livorno), Rep of Lucca, Duchy of Mecklenburg, Genoa (split)

Tom Veil - Iroquois (Haudenosaunee), Delhi Sultanate, Susquehannock, Mewar, Erielhonan, Neutral Nation of Attawandaron, Stadacona, Hochelega, Orissa

Kineticbots - Japan, Ryukyu

pa dutch - Mapuche, Miskito, Ohkay Owingeh, Teton Lakota (seven tribes total), Hunkpapa, Micmac, Wabanaki Confederacy, Tu'i Tonga

DuQuense - Ethiopia, Dai Viet (Vietnam), Champa, Khmer (Cambodia), Hasfid Kingdom, Garad Dynasty, Vijayanagara Empire, Lao

Pompejus - Free County of Burgandy & Burgundian Netherlands, Duchy of Upper Lorraine, Friesland, Gelre, bishopric of Utrecht, Duchy of Cleve (& Mark), Duchy of Julich & Berg, Cologne, Liege, East-Frisia, Münster, Metz, Bentheim, County of Horne, Tecklenburg, Osnabruck, Verdun, Toul, Cambrai

Lightinfa - Sweden

Redbeard & arctic winter - Denmark/Norway, Holstein, Ditmarschen

Analytical Engine - Brandenburg, Brunswick-Lüneburg, Duchy of Pomerania, Archbishopric of Bremen, Duchy of Brunswick-Wolfenbüttel, Brunswick-Grubenhagen , County of Oldenburg , Bishopric of Verden, Hoya, County of Diepholz, Lippe, Lauenburg, Magdeburg, Hildershim, Minden, Halberstadt, Ruppin, Kammin

RCTFI - Austria (and unclaimed areas of Holy Roman Empire), Bavaria-Munich, Bavaria-Landshut, Bavaria-Dachau, Bohemia & Hungary, Baden, Gorizia, Salzburg

Keenir - Ottoman Empire, Ferghana, Duchy of Ferrara, Modena and Reggio, Mantua, Palatinate, Nahnmwarkis, Saudeleurs, Pohnpei, Some Uighur successor state(s), Khoisan, Armenian Millet, Venice

marl d - Moscovy/Rus, Livonian Confederation, Khazan Khanate, Sibir Khanate, Astrakhan, Khanate of the Krimea, Nogai Horde

AJNolte - Rhodes, Kingdom of Kongo, Hanseatic League, Ernestine Saxony, Albertine Saxony, Mainz, Trier, Spain, Maronites, Druze, Mecklenburg, Papal States, Teutonic Prussia (Teutonic Knights), Navarre, Lithuania, Patriarch of Constantinople

Atom - Tawantinsinyu (Inca), Makah, People of the Inside (Duwamish), People of the Outside (Duwamish)

BlackMage - Gowa, Gunditjmara, Sultanate of Malacca, Yolngu

Haggis - Alibamu-Koasati

The Sandman - Oman, Yemen, Kilwa, Mogadishu, Mombasa, Zanzibar, Sofala, Malindi, Maldives, Bahrain, Dubai, Zimbabwe, Al Ain, Comoros, Sakalava, Betsileo

Smaug - Itza Maya, Ko'woj, Mariche, Taironas, Northern Muisca Confederation, Southern Muisca Confederation, Magua, Marien, Xaragua, Maguana, Higuey, Benin, Kano, Katsina, Oyo, Aro, Huastecs

rameiro - Powhatan, Alodia (Nubia), Mameluke Empire (Egypt)

Charles II - Morocco, Fez

BBJ1580 - Brunei, Wampanoag, Sulu Sultanate, Maguindanao, Siam

joemac - Arrente, Otoe, Kel Aijer, Kel Ahaggar

Aussey - Ngoyo, Kakongo, Ndongo, Matamba, Guarani, France, Kongo, Songhai

VulcanTrekkie45 - Moldavia, Wallachia, Manisses

Kang Seung Jae - Koryo (Korean Peninsula)

Tomb - Tarascan Empire

Abandoned Areas:

Majahapit Empire

Tibet

[Blackbeard]

My invasion of Mazovia's OK? I'm also gonna need a bit of help on Poland, getting real far behind and its getting more and more complicated.

[Keenir]

If the Khitan are still around, I would like to claim them.

[Tomb]

Why was Tibet abandoned?

[Tom Veil]

If I recall correctly, because Tibet's former controller, SleepaholicAgent, got too busy.

[AJNolte]

Are Redbeard and Arctic Warrior still running the Calmarn Union, or have they dropped out?

[Keenir]

If I recall correctly, because Tibet's former controller, SleepaholicAgent, got too busy.

I'd be happy to run Tibet until SleepaholicAgent returns.
(or until a wiser one {than I} can run Tibet)