USA annexes Formosa / Taiwan in 1854

[Anthony Appleyard]

See this link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Perry_%28naval_officer%29#Second_visit.2C_ 1854).

[Imajin]

Hm... this would bring the US into China much earlier... would we have a Sphere of Influence there?

[Straha]

We beat the shit out of imperial japan when they try sometihng in the 1890s.

[Imajin]

We beat the shit out of imperial japan when they try sometihng in the 1890s.
The Sino-Japanese War would probably be focused mainly on Korea, even moreso than OTL... They probably wouldn't attack Formosa Territory.

[WhatIsAUserName]

I think that Taiwan would be the US's sphere of influence rather than direct territory, considering for the fact that they would propose the Open Door Policy. However, seeing the examples of Macao and Hong Kong, the US might annex a good port on the island as its own territory.

[Straha]

The Sino-Japanese War would probably be focused mainly on Korea, even moreso than OTL... They probably wouldn't attack Formosa Territory.
I see the presence of a western enclave in formosa enoguh to make the japanese go into miltiarist mode several decades before OTL.

[Imajin]

I see the presence of a western enclave in formosa enoguh to make the japanese go into miltiarist mode several decades before OTL.
Why? Hong Kong didn't get the Japanese angry- at this point Formosa is a Chinese island, not a Japanese one.

[Straha]

Hong Kong is one city and formosa is a big island. That and the US's fear of the yellow peril would mean one or both sides would do something stupid.

[Wendell]

I could see the U.D. in this scenario toppling the Ryukyu Kingdom...

[Imajin]

At the very least we'd probably go in to prevent the Japanese from abolishing the Kingdom, maybe making it an American protectorate rather than Japanese.

[Wendell]

At the very least we'd probably go in to prevent the Japanese from abolishing the Kingdom, maybe making it an American protectorate rather than Japanese.
It could go the way of Hawaii...

[Imajin]

It could go the way of Hawaii...
Does Sugarcane grow in the Ryukyus?

[Wendell]

Does Sugarcane grow in the Ryukyus?
I'm not sure, but it's a good place for a naval base.

I've had some idea about an alternate Japanese expansion that might work in this scenario...

[Imajin]

I'm not sure, but it's a good place for a naval base.

I've had some idea about an alternate Japanese expansion that might work in this scenario...
Hm, but if you already have Formosa for a naval base, why take the Ryukyus? They do have enough people to be a state- perhaps it starts out as a protectorate and later votes for statehood?

[Wendell]

Hm, but if you already have Formosa for a naval base, why take the Ryukyus? They do have enough people to be a state- perhaps it starts out as a protectorate and later votes for statehood?
Make it part of the State of Formosa. Why take them? To better defend the Formosa colony from the north.

[Imajin]

Make it part of the State of Formosa. Why take them? To better defend the Formosa colony from the north.
The Ryukyus have a million people on their own...

[Wendell]

The Ryukyus have a million people on their own...
They do, but would they in an alternate timeline?

[Imajin]

They do, but would they an an alternate timeline?
They would likely have more, without the large civilian losses in WW2 and the forcible annexation by Japan.

[EvolvedSaurian]

Does Sugarcane grow in the Ryukyus?

According to wiki sugarcane grows in warm temperate to tropical regions and the Ryukyus are subtropical so probably.

[Dr Pervez Hoodbhoy]

Why? Hong Kong didn't get the Japanese angry- at this point Formosa is a Chinese island, not a Japanese one.

Taiwan's bigger, more profitable, more strategically important, and closer to Japan. It's also an island that Japan has had a historical interest in, and vital for that expansion into South-East Asia that Japanese imperialists have always thought about.

Not that Japan can really do anything about it, but I don't think China will want to sell it, and Britain and France will cry "Hell no!"

But if you can somehow pull it off...

In 1865, the United States Consul to Brunei, Claude Lee Moses obtained a 10-year lease for the territory of North Borneo from the Sultan of Brunei. However, the post-Civil War United States wanted nothing to do with Asian colonies, so Moses sold his rights to the Hong Kong-based American Trading Company owned by Joseph W. Torrey, Thomas B. Harris and some Chinese merchants. Torrey began a settlement at the Kimanis River mouth, which he named 'Ellena'. Attempts to find financial backing for the settlement were futile, and disease, death and desertion by the immigrant labourers led to the abandonment of the settlement towards the end of 1866.

American North Borneo?

I remember reading somewhere about some island in East Asia where someone proposed at one point that a US naval base should be established. I think the island was in the Korea Strait and the period was the 1880s, but I'm not sure.

[Wendell]

Might this enhance Japanese efforts to conquer and subdue Korea?

[sunsurf]

Could there be a United States of Japan, with a version of the US Constitution? How much would it have to be modified to include the Emperor? Could the Ainu get their own nation? Maybe there would be a Japanese Empire, a Japanese Republic and an Ainu Republic.

[Leej]

I don't think the powers of the world would look too kindly on the US deciding to go directly imperialist in asia. The knock on effects will outweigh anything like a state of formosa.