ALT: Labor Needed Section

[Psychomeltdown]

So, upon further thinking, pondering, wondering, and reading, I've realized that there's a load of work to be done and I'm not sure if we've got the people to be doing all of it.

So this is where we're gonna spell it out:

How Many People Do We Need and are Using.

In terms of cutting wood, water hauling, animal caring, logistics, management, military, etc.

Post how many men and women you need for a job and for how long. A fixed number, not an estimation.

[Matt]

This one is pretty well known...

99 men and 7 officers for the Rangers. The enlisted men well have contracts of 2 years, at which point more well needed to be mustered in based on need. Officers serve at the Councils consent.

[Psychomeltdown]

Personnel Request

Draft Animal Handlers

1 Chief Horsemen
13 Head Horsemen
40 Horse Handlers
2 Dedicated vets

1 Chief Llamamen
3 Llama handlers

1 Chief Donkeymen
9 Donkey Handlers

1 Chief Oxenmen
7 Oxen Handlers

Support Personnel: 15

The handlers will also fill the spot of teamster when it is needed.


Herders

Herders will work on a 12 hr watch, guarding, herding, etc on a daily basis.

Watches are from the following

6 am – 6pm
6 pm – 6 am


Sheep/Goats
Day: 15 people, 2 on horseback
Night: 5

Support Personnel: 4


Cattle
Day: 10, 3 on horseback
Night: 5

Support Personnel: 3


Interior Livestock
.

1 Chief Pig Farmer
10 Pig Foremen
30 Handlers

4 Dairy Cow Handlers/milkers/herders, 1 on horseback (during herding)

4 Chicken Handlers
3 Rabbit Handlers

Support Personnel: 7


TOTAL PERSONNEL

DRAFT ANIMALS: 93
HERDERS: 42
INTERIOR LIVESTOCK: 59

ADDITIONAL RESOURCES: 8 Horses

Jobs are from now until the Council decides to release the animals back to the public. Possibly a year.

[Matt]

This one is pretty well known...

99 men and 7 officers for the Rangers. The enlisted men well have contracts of 2 years, at which point more well needed to be mustered in based on need. Officers serve at the Councils consent.


By men I should note that I would be willing to muster in qualified women as well.

[Psychomeltdown]

CAMP WATER BRIGADE

103000 pounds of water a day is needed to run the camp.

12110 gallons of water.

Personnel

1 Chief of Water Allocation
9 Horse Handlers/teamster (from the DOLMA)
27 Water Distrubitors
20 Water fillers

18 Horses needed (DOLMA)
9 wagons needed (Gerard’s)

LABORERS NEEDED: 48
Job to last until we begin the move to Ianopolis.

[Ghost 88]

CAMP WATER BRIGADE

103000 pounds of water a day is needed to run the camp.

12110 gallons of water.

Personnel

1 Chief of Water Allocation
9 Horse Handlers/teamster (from the DOLMA)
27 Water Distrubitors
20 Water fillers

18 Horses needed (DOLMA)
9 wagons needed (Gerard’s)

LABORERS NEEDED: 48
Job to last until we begin the move to Ianopolis.
We'll need water carriers then too

[Ghost 88]

Psycho nice job on these labor list but many of these are going to need paring down Example the teamsters can double as filler and distbuters saves 18 right there the boss man ain't got no paper work to do so he can take a work slot See what I mean?

[Norbert]

Woodcutters:

Initially, I would like 150 to 200 for the actual cutting. Their tasks wood be to clear land prior to the removal of stumps for fields, gathering fuel for cooking and heating, and raw timber for building.

Figure up to 650 to 800 for clearing the land of stumps.

We will also need 20-40 for the hauling of the wood to its destination.

Yes this is a lot of people, but I said initially. This gives us the ability to clear for planting 10-15 acres per day. Once we have sufficient land cleared for the crops, we can drop the numbers to 15-20% of the above, and the extra people can go to where they are needed most.

Side Benefits of the cut: Enough fuel for several months. Enough raw timber for construction of homes, storage barns, palisades and forts, and other needs such as fences, bridges, and so on. Land available for planting.

[Othniel]

Woodcutters:

Initially, I would like 150 to 200 for the actual cutting. Their tasks wood be to clear land prior to the removal of stumps for fields, gathering fuel for cooking and heating, and raw timber for building.

Figure up to 650 to 800 for clearing the land of stumps.

We will also need 20-40 for the hauling of the wood to its destination.

Yes this is a lot of people, but I said initially. This gives us the ability to clear for planting 10-15 acres per day. Once we have sufficient land cleared for the crops, we can drop the numbers to 15-20% of the above, and the extra people can go to where they are needed most.

Side Benefits of the cut: Enough fuel for several months. Enough raw timber for construction of homes, storage barns, palisades and forts, and other needs such as fences, bridges, and so on. Land available for planting.
I'ma hauler currently, I said so in one of my posts. (day three I think)

[Gerard-ABC]

Psycho - You need 9 wagons - you got 'em. The 9th will arrive this afternoon.


Norbert - I got enough for my wagon construction crews for now. Not got enough saws / large axes for any more.

I currently HAVE:

Me as organiser / wagon builder / trainer
3 NPCs as trainers / managers / wagon builders
6 NPCs on wagon building
6 NPCs as wagon builders / work crew chiefs
20 NPCs on work crews, cutting down trees / trimming them to boards

I'm rotating crew tasks every 3 hours, giving people a break and change of work. Ok, not much difference between cutting down a tree, and then making boards from it, but it IS a change.

Also rotating people on the wagon crews - helping morale there, and they're learning all the tasks needed to construct the various parts of a wagon.

I've seen the improvement in production speed already, in just 2 days. Also seems to be preventing any accidents, but we'll get one sooner or later. So many people, so many hours of work...


Regards,
Gerard

[Grimm Reaper]

As the apparent chief fisherman I have the following needs:

Manpower to build shallops for fishing, plus dock(s) and related facilities.

Storage facilities when the autumn runs lead to gigantic results.

And a procedure(smoking, salting, other) to keep the fish.

People, we're talking massive results in protein(or fertilizer) for a modest effort, we need to get cracking.

[Bulgaroktonos]

Okay, as interim Logisitics manager, I'm putting our priorities at wood and food, and their production. Military needs can come a close second, as our superiority of number can make up for personel deficiency I think.

First priority is food. Ward and Co. get everything they need.

Second is Norbert's wood cutters. The wood is so valuable not only to fire, but to everything else that it requires a full contingent. Without adequate resources put to wood cutting/clearing, the rest of the jobs become moot. With wood having a full resource commitment, it makes setting up permanent homes, storage facilities, etc. easier and require less manpower. Anybody bring a chainsaw?

Then wagons, using the wood cut down.. I'll need an estimate on how many wagons wood and food could use, and commit to the required manpower to produce enough wagons, and after a point wagon building can be slowed/stopped, and the resources reallocated.

After that, Fishing and hunting will be important and thus Glen can get further labor requirements, likely out of the child populace, as fishing is relatively easy and we can use the stronger labor for the tougher jobs instead. Fishing is going to be very valuable.

How's that for a temporary plan on labor?

[Norbert]

As a temporary plan, it sounds good to me. And, I see you are taking my point on how many people will be needed for cutting initially. When sufficient land is cleared for crops, we can release 75-80% of those working at cutting, hauling and stump removal. We will also have a good start on raw materials for construction. After the first big push on clearing, a reduced crew can keep up with the demands for fuel and construction materials. My actual goal is not to clearcut everything in sight, but will go more to conservation, yet still meeting our needs. But, a side benefit of clearing the area around the community will aid in defence, which is to be able to have a clear field of fire and extended sighting capability.

As to chainsaws, I thought very hard about them, but decided that while they would speed up the work, trying to bring sufficient fuel to keep them running was not 'cost-effective'. Sorry about the hard work, folks, but on the upside, we will get back into top shape in a hurry.

The rest of the plan is very good in my eyes.

[Psychomeltdown]

After that, Fishing and hunting will be important and thus Glen can get further labor requirements, likely out of the child populace, as fishing is relatively easy and we can use the stronger labor for the tougher jobs instead. Fishing is going to be very valuable.
The Great Hunt is tommorrow and we're gonna need all hands on board for that one.


WATER: more important than food. Without water we die, food we can last a while. We NEED water. Not everyone can go and fill their canteen at the River/streams.

Psycho nice job on these labor list but many of these are going to need paring down Example the teamsters can double as filler and distbuters saves 18 right there the boss man ain't got no paper work to do so he can take a work slot See what I mean?

If no one wants the job I'll be supervising the Water Brigade, but it's a part time thing, cuz I'm trying to get involved with creating a core of men and women who will be the animal caretakers.

Also, the teamsters and distributors will be helping out, with the loading and the unloading, No one will be just sittin' around, not while I'm supervising. :D

This is going to be a lot of work, almost as much as wood cutting, cuz we're gonna be hauling 103000 lbs of water EVERY DAY. Those poor fillers are going to have to fill 12000 + gallons A DAY. each gallon weighing 8.5 lbs each.

That's a lot of work and I'm telling you, they'll be sore as hell by the morrow.

I'm thinking I might need 10 more water fillers, 3 more distributors, and another wagon. Please? It's a lot of work.

[Gerard-ABC]

Psycho,
It's now 6pm here... we'll start on another wagon for you in the morning.


Regards,
Gerard

[Psychomeltdown]

Psycho,
It's now 6pm here... we'll start on another wagon for you in the morning.

Cool.

OOC: I haven't posted in Day 6, mainly just reading up on days events. but I figure we've taken the 9 wagons you've given and I've scrouged up enough workers... Hopefully.

I'll add the wagon for Day 7.



Back to the Game:

Personnel

1 Chief of Water Allocation
10 Horse Handlers/teamster (from the DOLMA)
30 Water Distrubitors
30 Water fillers

20 Horses needed (DOLMA)
10 wagons needed (Gerard’s)

LABORERS NEEDED: 71
Job to last until we begin the move to Ianopolis.

[Gerard-ABC]

Psycho,
I was still thinking it was Day 5. 6pm, end of the working day for my people. ( We start working early, 7am ? before it gets too hot )

( Working on wagons, we'll find other stuff to do )


Regards,
Gerard

[Psychomeltdown]

Psycho,
I was still thinking it was Day 5. 6pm, end of the working day for my people. ( We start working early, 7am ? before it gets too hot )

( Working on wagons, we'll find other stuff to do )


Regards,
Gerard
okay lets just say i asked you Day 6, early and you said yes. therefore i have the wagons I need. :D

thanks.

[Bulgaroktonos]

I've got to say that water is incredibly valuable, but Psycho, is there no way we could perhaps fit more buckets of water on a single wagon, or something so as to reduce the number of horses required to supply ourselves with water?

We need to leave at least 1 or 2 wagons for wood clearing. Unless we can fix up some drags. Norbert, how many drags to you have at your disposal?

Depending on that, we may have to sacrifice some water for wood. Wood is not quite as invaluable, but nonetheless essential to our future. Any loss of water production from a loss of wagons can be made up by the people that have water, or the people that can actually fill their canteens. I'll annouce it tomorrow morning that if possible, all members should fill up their own canteens without taking from the store the water-carriers are bringing.

[Psychomeltdown]

I've got to say that water is incredibly valuable, but Psycho, is there no way we could perhaps fit more buckets of water on a single wagon, or something so as to reduce the number of horses required to supply ourselves with water?

Well my thought is that the river's always been a bit of a walk from the camp, so many people can't really go there every-time they've thirsty, not especially when they've been working all day.

1 wagon holds 2000 lbs

2000 lbs is 235 gallons

Tell me, do we have anything big enough to hold 230 gallons? I don't think so. The most we can do is probably 150 -200 gallons, bottles, jugs, a barrel or two...

10 wagons, 2000 gallons every two hours (takes time to load up, unload, and drive).

Minimum of 6 trips, totaling 12000 gallons.

We need those wagons, we need those horses, we need those people.



Water is more important, especially since tomorrow is the Great Hunt, we'll probably need twice as much water. :eek:

[Norbert]

I've got to say that water is incredibly valuable, but Psycho, is there no way we could perhaps fit more buckets of water on a single wagon, or something so as to reduce the number of horses required to supply ourselves with water?

We need to leave at least 1 or 2 wagons for wood clearing. Unless we can fix up some drags. Norbert, how many drags to you have at your disposal?

Depending on that, we may have to sacrifice some water for wood. Wood is not quite as invaluable, but nonetheless essential to our future. Any loss of water production from a loss of wagons can be made up by the people that have water, or the people that can actually fill their canteens. I'll annouce it tomorrow morning that if possible, all members should fill up their own canteens without taking from the store the water-carriers are bringing.

We'll end up muddying up the water to much. As to how many drags, I am not really sure, to be honest.

[Bulgaroktonos]

We'll end up muddying up the water to much. As to how many drags, I am not really sure, to be honest.

Now, muddying up the water, literally, figuratively or what?

[Norbert]

Now, muddying up the water, literally, figuratively or what?

Literally. Wait for Psycos post on it, we've been PMing a solution.

[Bulgaroktonos]

Well my thought is that the river's always been a bit of a walk from the camp, so many people can't really go there every-time they've thirsty, not especially when they've been working all day.

1 wagon holds 2000 lbs

2000 lbs is 235 gallons

Tell me, do we have anything big enough to hold 230 gallons? I don't think so. The most we can do is probably 150 -200 gallons, bottles, jugs, a barrel or two...

10 wagons, 2000 gallons every two hours (takes time to load up, unload, and drive).

Minimum of 6 trips, totaling 12000 gallons.

We need those wagons, we need those horses, we need those people.



Water is more important, especially since tomorrow is the Great Hunt, we'll probably need twice as much water. :eek:

Very true. Alright, then we'll have to get some people on drags for the wood. Besides, tomorrow, I'm not sure how much wood cutting we'll get done, so its a relatively light day on wood cutting given the requirements for the Great Hunt. I think we can get some drags done during that day, by those not involved. We've got plenty of rope, IIRC.

Anybody an expert on making drags? Is it more effective with wood slats bracing the sides and keeping them above ground or with just a basic drag mat? I'd imagine the latter isn't as good for long term use but easier to make.....

[pisces74]

Wasn't therer two wind powered waterpumps for community use that can be utilized to some extent?

[Ward]

Wasn't therer two wind powered waterpumps for community use that can be utilized to some extent?


Well there is one for the community and one that is personal proberty .

to be set up on my homestead when it set up . I will let other people use it but it will be on my land .

[Norbert]

Very true. Alright, then we'll have to get some people on drags for the wood. Besides, tomorrow, I'm not sure how much wood cutting we'll get done, so its a relatively light day on wood cutting given the requirements for the Great Hunt. I think we can get some drags done during that day, by those not involved. We've got plenty of rope, IIRC.

Anybody an expert on making drags? Is it more effective with wood slats bracing the sides and keeping them above ground or with just a basic drag mat? I'd imagine the latter isn't as good for long term use but easier to make.....

I've got 3000 feet of paracord, save the rope. I think using a pole across the bottom, making it an A-frame would work, thus keeping the material used on it off the ground

[SionEwig]

I brought 2 hand operated water pumps, one standard lever type and one centripetal type both capable of at least 16 foot vertical lift. Just make a small sturdy frame near the water, run the hose down into it, and pump away. You should be able to get at least 20 feet away from the edge of the water. Someone still has to operate the pumps, but it beats wadeing out in and filling buckets. The group is welcome to use them.

Also, I'll bet that a good number of families brought 2 1/2 to 5 gallon water jugs, even probably some Igloo type water coolers. Empty they don't weight much.