ALT: Contact with Natives

[Flocculencio]

Just thought I'd set this up for info and advice about dealings with the natives. We've made contact with a tribe at the river's mouth and I've given their Elder a knife. They're rather wary of white men though.

Here's some advice (alreayd posted in the ALT:Chat thread but reposted here for convenience) from our resident anthropologist, Dr. What, about the situation in response to a question I asked him:

Also since the natives seem less freaked out by an Indian than by a white man I was suggesting that they also return with advice for people not to try to set off to make contact on their own at this point.

Might provide an interesting plot point if some people choose to disregard the advice.

What do you think?


Good point--right now your best bet is to make nicey-nice with one or two of the local bands. Trust me--within a few months, all of their pals would have heard of the strange visitors with cool stuff. More relaxed trading can occur at that point.

But at this point--chief is going to trust just you at this point until he gets comfortable with the rest of the gang--hope your diplomacy skills are up to speed!

Also--until word gets around--every contact with a band will have to be handled exactly like a first contact. Inexperienced people dealing with freaked out natives armed with weapons can make for a very tricky situation if someone panics and starts firing their gun--and rest assured that bad news about you guys will spread as fast (if not faster) as good news.

Nope--best bet--deal with the one band, make nice with them, get their trust and let them do all the hard work of spreading news of your goodwill to their relatives and friends.

Of course--if some idiot from the breakaway group disregards your suggestion and meet another band and the meeting goes bad.....

[Flocculencio]

Christ, what about the horses? Aren't the extinct in North America by this point? Hope they don't startle them.

I was figuring that they could be tethered in the trees behind our campsite and that I'd go back down to the chief once we've sorted out a plan of action (how many people to send back with the news etc.) and engage in some rudimentary diplomacy. Hopefully if they see that the horses are under our control they won't be too freaked. I wouldn't advise bringing them nearer to the camp than the treeline though.

[Flocculencio]

Well--when Cortez was making his way through Aztec territory, a lot of the natives were convinced that the mounted Spainards were some kind of half man/half beast creature--so, yeah--that would be a 'yes' until they get used to them.

But you guys were smart enough to keep the horses near the treeline so I would assume that they were too busy looking at Floc to notice the horses....

Also since they've seen us on foot they will be reassured that we aren't half-man/half-beast monsters. They might be a bit confused with the idea of riding an animal but hopefully that'll be slightly less freaky.

[Doctor What]

Also since they've seen us on foot they will be reassured that we aren't half-man/half-beast monsters. They might be a bit confused with the idea of riding an animal but hopefully that'll be slightly less freaky.

Feed one of the horses an apple or something, then using gestures, offer one of the natives an apple and suggest he do the same. They'll still be a bit freaked out but they might think of the horses as overgrown deer or something like that.

[Flocculencio]

Feed one of the horses an apple or something, then using gestures, offer one of the natives an apple and suggest he do the same. They'll still be a bit freaked out but they might think of the horses as overgrown deer or something like that.

Yeah might try that with ze Chief if he feels comfortable enough to come investigate our camp. MBarry's speaking of sending back the other four Rangers with the news so maybe with just one scary paleface on site he might be more willing to drop by. :)

[Matt]

Feed one of the horses an apple or something, then using gestures, offer one of the natives an apple and suggest he do the same. They'll still be a bit freaked out but they might think of the horses as overgrown deer or something like that.


That's what I was thinking, coax them into petting the animal, the same way you show a child in a petting zoo that the duck won't bite them. The others are going back, and my horse is a clone of R.E. Lee's Traveller, and Flocc's seem mild mannered. I doubt the amerindians well freak the horses out, so It's worth a shot.

[Matt]

Yeah might try that with ze Chief if he feels comfortable enough to come investigate our camp. MBarry's speaking of sending back the other four Rangers with the news so maybe with just one scary paleface on site he might be more willing to drop by. :)

Yeah the others can go back, but I wouldn't want to leave you there alone. So guess who gets to stay :P

[Flocculencio]

That's what I was thinking, coax them into petting the animal, the same way you show a child in a petting zoo that the duck won't bite them. The others are going back, and my horse is a clone of R.E. Lee's Traveller, and Flocc's seem mild mannered. I doubt the amerindians well freak the horses out, so It's worth a shot.

I thought you were bringing along a Waler stallion? Going for the glamourous name-brand horse, eh? ;) :D

[Matt]

I thought you were bringing along a Waler stallion? Going for the glamourous name-brand horse, eh? ;) :D


I was, until I stumbled on the wiki article on Traveller. Damn fine horse I would say, exactly what I'm looking for.

Blame Norbert actually, because he posted the link to the Morgan- the Waler's american counterpart.

[SionEwig]

Yeah the others can go back, but I wouldn't want to leave you there alone. So guess who gets to stay :P

I would not suggest that any of us return seperately. There is still much more to scout out.

Where are we by the way?

[Flocculencio]

I would not suggest that any of us return seperately. There is still much more to scout out.

Then again the news of the first contact needs to be brought back to the rest.

Where are we by the way?

Roughly, the Southern tip of San Francisco Bay

[Norbert]

I would not suggest that any of us return seperately. There is still much more to scout out.

Where are we by the way?


I would agree, stay together, but with only two of you making contact. If you seperate, and someone has an accident on the way back, you may run into big problems. The natives may not be hostile, but if two are on their way back an ambush (either from natives, or a Puma) is more likely, wheras with six, this chance drops consideably.

[Norbert]

Then again the news of the first contact needs to be brought back to the rest.


The news can wait. Safety is the top priority.

[Flocculencio]

The news can wait. Safety is the top priority.

You do have a point there

[Matt]

I would not suggest that any of us return seperately. There is still much more to scout out.

Where are we by the way?

Near San Jose, at the San Fran Bay.

The mission has changed. I don't want to freak out the natives with too many pale faces around. However, I don't want to leave Flocc alone it's too risky. So someone stays with him.

Someone needs to let Ward or Glen or Bulg know, but I don't want anyone to travel alone, so at least 2 needs to head that way.

If the you want to take the remaining Ranger with you and continue, that's your discretion.

[Gerard-ABC]

One piece of safety advice - use the buddy system.

When out of camp, always go with at least one other person, so that when / if something happens, you got a chance of help. Out in unexplored / hostile territory, I'd say go in groups of 4, 8, 12.

That way, if 1 person is hurt, 1 can stay with them, and the other 2 go for help. No one says that one of those other 2 can't be hurt / ambushed too... but 3 "incidents" is probably more than can be expected to happen.


Regards,
Gerard

[Othniel]

I was, until I stumbled on the wiki article on Traveller. Damn fine horse I would say, exactly what I'm looking for.

Blame Norbert actually, because he posted the link to the Morgan- the Waler's american counterpart.
Just as long as one didn't accidentally clone a real talking Mr. Ed...

[SionEwig]

Near San Jose, at the San Fran Bay.

The mission has changed. I don't want to freak out the natives with too many pale faces around. However, I don't want to leave Flocc alone it's too risky. So someone stays with him.

Someone needs to let Ward or Glen or Bulg know, but I don't want anyone to travel alone, so at least 2 needs to head that way.

If the you want to take the remaining Ranger with you and continue, that's your discretion.

You're in charge so the decision is yours.

[SionEwig]

If my information is correct, then these should be a group called the Bay Miwoks. One tribe within then was the Volvons, but they should be up around Mt. Diablo.

[Darkest]

They probably don't call each other Miwoks. The tribes that were found here in the 1500s are most likely entirely different from the tribes that were there 4500 years ago. They may be similiar to the Miwoks, however.

[Flocculencio]

True...just for simplicity's sake we might as well have them called the Miwoks though.

[Matt]

Sion, I'll send you, General Paul, and the 2 NPCs back to camp. That leaves only me and Flocc on our own, but we can assume that risk. Wouldn't want to do that to my underlings. Report back to Weapon M(who's an NPC for now) then to Glen or Ward.

I'll post the in charcter dealy in a bit.

[SionEwig]

Sion, I'll send you, General Paul, and the 2 NPCs back to camp. That leaves only me and Flocc on our own, but we can assume that risk. Wouldn't want to do that to my underlings. Report back to Weapon M(who's an NPC for now) then to Glen or Ward.

I'll post the in charcter dealy in a bit.

Okey Dokey. If I am looking correctly, we should have little problem making it back to the group by late evening on Day 2. Sound right?

[Matt]

Okey Dokey. If I am looking correctly, we should have little problem making it back to the group by late evening on Day 2. Sound right?


Now that we have a route establish, I would see little probelm with that.

[SionEwig]

Do the 2 of you want to hang on to 2 of the radios for your time here and trip back? It would not be a problem for me since all the 4 of us are doing is going straight back.

[Matt]

Do the 2 of you want to hang on to 2 of the radios for your time here and trip back? It would not be a problem for me since all the 4 of us are doing is going straight back.


Yes. That would be very handy.

[Doctor What]

Just a few other odds and ends that I remember from my anthropology courses:

-I already went into great detail about the natives in California in other threads but here's a quick summary: All of them were hunter-gatherers; they had four major sources of food (acorns-which they ground and either ate like a 'porridge' or cooked into a bread like thing, seafood of all kinds, local game and birds, and whatever plants they could find); their technology was basically Stone Age when it came to tools (bone, stone, wood, maybe obsidian if they were lucky); and they apparently made some pretty kick-ass looking baskets

-Primitive agricultural practices began in Mexico by 6000 to 4000 BC and by approximately 2000 BC were known on the northern fringes of Mexico. Maize, gourds, squash, peppers, cotton, and varieties of beans were domesticated. Maize was grown in the southwestern United States by 2000 to 1000 BC, but most of the other plants did not arrive until just around 0 AD. It was only after this point that large permanent villages, ceremonial buildings, pottery etc started showing up in that region of SW United States.

-In 3000 BC in much of the Western U.S. (Roughly speaking--Oregon in the north, northern mexico in the south and most of the Rocky Mountains) was a culture that was called 'Desert Culture'. They were a lot like the California natives (there was a bit of overlap in fact) in that they were there from at least 8000 BC (probably earlier)and were mostly hunter-gatherers. Because this area tends to be drier than the coast, there was a greater emphasis on plant collecting and storage (they ground their seeds too). Their spears (and especially the spear points) were *very* well made. Btw--they had dogs--and had them since at least 4000 BC. I have no idea how the dogs look like but I'm assuming they probably looked like coyotes or wolves.

So--in brief--just over the Rockies in this time period are the 'Desert Culture' people while down south in Mexico are a bunch of early farmers experimenting with growing corn, beans, and squash.

Just in case a bunch of the gang decides to start exploring--now you know what to expect.

Just because I get off on tables and charts & because I've noticed a few posts from people wondering what else is out there at this time--here's a chronological table of OTL civilizations and cultures in north, central and south america from 25000 BC to 2000 AD.

Of course--now that the ah.commers have showed up, all this might change...

[SionEwig]

Yes. That would be very handy.

Check, see y'all when you get back. How long do you want us to wait before sending out a search party?

[Matt]

Check, see y'all when you get back. How long do you want us to wait before sending out a search party?


We were planning on a 3 days, but figure we brought some extra supplies. If the natives are nice we might stay a hair over a week. Well radio if that happens though.

[Flocculencio]

Yes. That would be very handy.

Actually what's the range of these radios like?

And thanks for the anthro briefing, Bruno :)

[Flocculencio]

Waking up the second time was alot harder. Matt unzipped the tent and realized the rain was continueing. Muttering a swear word under his breath, he dug out a leather jacket and a battered fedora.

Heheh...I have a trench coat and a leather waistcoat as opposed to a leather jacket but I don't know if you noticed but I mentioned I had a fedora too. Perhaps we could make the fedora the unofficial ranger badge? :D

[Doctor What]

And thanks for the anthro briefing, Bruno :)

No problemo--btw--managed to find a site that describes the dogs in more detail.

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/nativeamericanindiandog.htm
http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanindiandog.htm

Slightly dubious of the claim that this is *exactly* how the dogs looked like for thousands of years but it will give you a rough idea.

[Flocculencio]

No problemo--btw--managed to find a site that describes the dogs in more detail.

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/nativeamericanindiandog.htm
http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanindiandog.htm

Slightly dubious of the claim that this is *exactly* how the dogs looked like for thousands of years but it will give you a rough idea.

Thanks- although I'd guess that the natives in warmer areas would probably have a less shaggy variant.

Anyway I figured that would be a decent point of rationalisation for the natives to not freak out too much over the horses: "Since these guys have knives that are so different from ours it's logical that they might have animals that are different from ours." :D

Plus I though it would be nice to have a sympathetic somewhat friendly tribe to meet up with. So it's all in service of the storyline. Maybe later on we can have an "enemy" tribe. Perhaps when logging starts in the hills the Hill Miwok (or whatever tribe we choose to use) get pissed off that we're scaring the game and start attacking the logging camps.

[SionEwig]

Actually what's the range of these radios like?

And thanks for the anthro briefing, Bruno :)

The GMRS radios my family uses are supposed tohave a 5 mile range. Our use has shown them to be effective out to 10 miles (in flat terrain and a good day) and about 7 in most other terrain. Mountains do tend to block the signal though. I will be leaving the 2 with y'all and carrying 1 with me up toward Berkely.

Looking at the map, I think that we (me and Phred the NPC) can make it to approximately where Hwy 238 crosses the Alameda River. We will cross and camp on the northern bank. Sound good?

[Matt]

Heheh...I have a trench coat and a leather waistcoat as opposed to a leather jacket but I don't know if you noticed but I mentioned I had a fedora too. Perhaps we could make the fedora the unofficial ranger badge? :D


I'm thinking about it. It's a handy field hat after all. The wide brim keeps both the rain and the sun off. And it's flashy too.

*wishes men's hats were still in style.*

[Flocculencio]

*wishes men's hats were still in style.*

I wear one from time to time. It's quite cool standing in front of my faculty building on a cold dark winters evening having a smoke in trenchcoat and fedora. One of my tutors told me that I look like something out of a hitchcock film.

Plus I'm 6'2" and the hat and trenchcoat bulk me up even more so I'm pretty much mugger-proof. always useful when you're studying on a campus that is half wilderness. Literally a wilderness- it used to be a botanical garden than bankrupted the nobleman who established it so he sold it to Oxford which wanted to start up a subsiduary university. Half the grounds are built up the other half are overgrown woods with pathways and lakes and stuff. Not safe after dark.

[SionEwig]

Heheh...I have a trench coat and a leather waistcoat as opposed to a leather jacket but I don't know if you noticed but I mentioned I had a fedora too. Perhaps we could make the fedora the unofficial ranger badge? :D

No fedora here, but I do have a circa 1920s leather jacket that I inherited. Would be wearing a classic cowboy style duster though.

[Doctor What]

Anyway I figured that would be a decent point of rationalisation for the natives to not freak out too much over the horses: "Since these guys have knives that are so different from ours it's logical that they might have animals that are different from ours." :D

Plus I though it would be nice to have a sympathetic somewhat friendly tribe to meet up with. So it's all in service of the storyline. Maybe later on we can have an "enemy" tribe. Perhaps when logging starts in the hills the Hill Miwok (or whatever tribe we choose to use) get pissed off that we're scaring the game and start attacking the logging camps.

Good points--btw--I liked the way you worked Matt's avoidance of the oysters into nearly a cultural 'incident'--stuff like that will be actually quite common until everyone gets to know one another.

About the logging camp stuff--many of the locals used ground acorns as a food source--if they start seeing the board members chopping down oak trees, they will have a legitimate excuse to get pissed off....

[GBW]

I assume the good Doctor went along as well? I suppose he gave much of this information before you guys left... :D

[Matt]

Me and Flocc have been thinking of alot of this stuff indepently, but without the creditials to know if it would work or not :p

[Doctor What]

Me and Flocc have been thinking of alot of this stuff indepently, but without the creditials to know if it would work or not :p

Quiet, you fool! You just gave away 90% of the secrets of success in Academia! :p

[Flocculencio]

Me and Flocc have been thinking of alot of this stuff indepently, but without the creditials to know if it would work or not :p

So far I think we've done pretty well, actually :D

The in-world explanation is that Dr. What gave us a general briefing.