[ALT]In the Short Term...

[Matt]

Time for me to add another thread to the plethora already in here.

This one is for OOC statements of short term goals and objective. I.E. What your charcter is doing and where is he/she running off to.

Flocc, General_Paul, 3 NPCs, and myself are setting out on horseback for several days. The objective is to scout out possible settlement locations, and to verify the accuracy of the maps. We're leaving @ 2pm of Day 1. Since we're on horse back we should make a good dozen or so miles by dusk. We're heading north to primary settlement site indicated a few days ago on the map.

[Othniel]

I'm just blending in currently. I'm no good with a gun so I've been using an axe for defense...

[Ward]

I'm just blending in currently. I'm no good with a gun so I've been using an axe for defense...

Well Othniel your new wife will teach you how to be good with your gun .:D

WeaponM or one of the other of us will teach you how to use a weapon .

[Dave Howery]

just help get organized... hitch up the horses to the wagons, start clearing trees out of the immediate vicinity and turning them into lumber, plan out where everything's going to go, from individual houses to fields to other buildings.... get people settled on individual plots so we can start planning out gardens, etc...

[Othniel]

Well Othniel your new wife will teach you how to be good with your gun .:D

WeaponM or one of the other of us will teach you how to use a weapon .
This is why I chose a Seventeen year old Montana farm girl as my wife.

But seriously I can't aim very well. Something wrong with my focus mechanism...

[Matt]

This is why I chose a Seventeen year old Montana farm girl as my wife.

But seriously I can't aim very well. Something wrong with my focus mechanism...


This may sound really silly, but have you ever tried aiming with the other eye? You might be aiming in with or non-dominant eye. Or it could be a stigmatism.

[Psychomeltdown]

Psycho, his wife, and a group of thirty others are taking care of the sheep and the cattle. As it stands these are the animals that'll be the hardest to corral because there are so many of them and therefore need to be watched.

We've got 13 horses, which are used to keep the cattle mainly in check.

For now, things seem to be calm. The sheep are docile, the cattle are sticking together, there's a five person team on watch at all time (over the animals).


I figure Dominus can handle the Domestic Animals, such as the pigs, dairy cows, chickens, etc.

[Dave Howery]

This is why I chose a Seventeen year old Montana farm girl as my wife.
...
Get your hands off my cousin!

[Ward]

Short term : I will be helping with the animals like the pigs , chickens ,dairy cows . The family will also help with that .
Holding meetings with people , Finding out what we have in tools and wagons .

[Norbert]

I'll do what I left the farm to avoid: ie cut wood. Until a site(s) are selected, the main focus of the lumber detail will be to harvest dead trees for fire wood, with effort going to gathering also smaller logs for corrals. There really is not much point to cutting lumber if we are to move, especially if it is to be several miles. I am not sure how many wagons are available, but for the move itself, poles that were being used as temporary corrals can be used to make travois, enabling more gear to be transported in one trip. So my main concern right now is to keep people warm at night. Though it might not be a bad idea to make 7 foot poles, sharpened at one end, and used to form a low temporary pallisade on the march (I am stealing the idea from the Roman Legions).

[schrammy]

if with short therm is meant what i think it is (first few years)
i will probarly be either helping building buildings storeage for our food and shelters for our animals or cutting down treest to do this with (probarly most of us will do this first few weeks)

afther that i will probarly spend most of my time either with farming or with fishing, when there is time i will join the group to go mine minerals or produce what ever we need from it be it dynamite for cunstruction,paint for our houses,or some sort of medicine.

[Othniel]

This may sound really silly, but have you ever tried aiming with the other eye? You might be aiming in with or non-dominant eye. Or it could be a stigmatism.
I started with my dominant left eye and had to switch to my dominant hand, to be sure, neither helped.

[Flocculencio]

Aren't the ASBs fixing medical problems like that?

I was sort of assuming that they'd give me back my 20/20 vision...:(

[Hendryk]

In the initial phase, Wendy and I will make ourselves useful setting up a general inventory of the stuff everyone brought. It'll come in handy later on. As things get better organized, I guess the settlement will have something of a logistics department, keeping records of what gets used, what breaks down, available spare parts and so on. As soon as I we can spare the time though, she and I will see about getting our little paper-making business started.

[schrammy]

this is no medical problem each person just has one dominent eye,leg, hand
its just like that doesn't mean the other side is not working just as good as the other

[Hendryk]

Aren't the ASBs fixing medical problems like that?

I was sort of assuming that they'd give me back my 20/20 vision...:(
I'd appreciate their giving me decent eyesight as well. Not only for comfort's sake, but because we're unlikely to have decent opticians around for decades at best, and glasses get broken easily.

And I definitely hope I'm getting rid of Crohn's Disease. Otherwise my life expectancy will only be a couple of years after my medication runs out, and that would spoil the fun somewhat. But if I understood the rules correctly, we're all cured of whatever chronic conditions we have.

[Flocculencio]

But if I understood the rules correctly, we're all cured of whatever chronic conditions we have.

That was my understanding :D

[Othniel]

That was my understanding :D
This is all true, you arrive and your glasses no longer work.

[Matt]

I'm betting you have a stigmatism Oth, I have one in my non-dominant eye that causes me to lose focus if I sight in for to long.

[Othniel]

I'm betting you have a stigmatism Oth, I have one in my non-dominant eye that causes me to lose focus if I sight in for to long.
Well then, that will be fxed and you can spend as much time as you can spare teaching me to shoot again.

[Ghost 88]

othniel MBerry's out scouting and left his scout behind (me) so while our military commander is mia opps I meant not here I have the knowledge to teach you.

[Othniel]

othniel MBerry's out scouting and left his scout behind (me) so while our military commander is mia opps I meant not here I have the knowledge to teach you.Can I assume your in my part of the camp then? That would make it easier than assuming 17 NPC famillies..

[Ghost 88]

I'm the ponytailed Hippie looking dude with the cannon slung on my back ( the cannons a Barret 50 cal. sniper rifle) also wearing cammo uniform

[Dave Howery]

OK, in the short term... have we even decided yet just where we're going to be settling? AFAIK, we sorta decided that a small colony would stay around the initial ISOT site, while most trekked north to better land... is that still the plan? In that case, we need some hard numbers here.... how long to trek north, how long to clear fields there, how long to plant those fields, how long till we get crops from them... 'cuz that's how much food everyone will need to bring along. As I see it, the majority of the people will be working on the fields for quite some time. A smaller number will be working on lumber and buildings, a yet smaller number will be watching the herds, and a handful of people will be patrolling and watching over the perimeter. I imagine we can't spare a lot of people for hunting/fishing right away. Another handful will be learning medical skills, but only 3-4? So, we need these numbers down before we can make too much of a short term game plan...

[Bulgaroktonos]

OK, in the short term... have we even decided yet just where we're going to be settling? AFAIK, we sorta decided that a small colony would stay around the initial ISOT site, while most trekked north to better land... is that still the plan? In that case, we need some hard numbers here.... how long to trek north, how long to clear fields there, how long to plant those fields, how long till we get crops from them... 'cuz that's how much food everyone will need to bring along. As I see it, the majority of the people will be working on the fields for quite some time. A smaller number will be working on lumber and buildings, a yet smaller number will be watching the herds, and a handful of people will be patrolling and watching over the perimeter. I imagine we can't spare a lot of people for hunting/fishing right away. Another handful will be learning medical skills, but only 3-4? So, we need these numbers down before we can make too much of a short term game plan...

I agree. I've got some pens and paper. I suggest you and I start taking a census.

[Dave Howery]

I agree. I've got some pens and paper. I suggest you and I start taking a census.
somebody else is already doing that. What we need is hard numbers on the tasks ahead... how to trek north, how long to clear fields, how long to plant crops, how long to get a crop in... we need food for that long, at least... I have grave doubts about hunting/fishing to feed us for any amount of time...

[Psychomeltdown]

I at least need 36 people watching the herds and at the least 12 horses. Cattle are fast movers when they want to be, sheep are a bit slow and can be herded on foot. Plus with the large possibility of bears. wolves, cats etc, in the woods, I need a large number of people to help watch over the herds, 24/7.
using a 12 hr rotation...

12 people in camp.
12 people in the sack.
12 people guarding/watching.

4 on horses, 8 on foot.

All carrying guns and ammo.


I could probably do it with less in the beginning since we'll be close to base, but the grasses near ianopolis will probably be needed by the dairy cows and like animals and we'll need to graze farther afield.

[Psychomeltdown]

somebody else is already doing that. What we need is hard numbers on the tasks ahead... how to trek north, how long to clear fields, how long to plant crops, how long to get a crop in... we need food for that long, at least... I have grave doubts about hunting/fishing to feed us for any amount of time...
I suggest we beat the furries out of the woods and into a Kill zone, kill anything that moves, skin it, smoke it, and pack it. It'll probably be a group effort, and should keep us in meet for a couple of weeks, plus it'll clear out most of the big game in the area that might harm the plants.

[Norbert]

I personally have tools for 11 loggers, but I would like double that number working, partly to limit down time for rest breaks. I know athers may have brought axes and such, and with a crew of 22, we should be able to cut down enough trees at a rate of 2 acres per three days. The other part, getting rid of the stumps can be taken care of by other groups coming in afterwards, and could probably be done by 40 people in 2 days per acre.

I am not certain how many saws and axes we have amongst everyone, I may have looked at the equipment list, but I never made a point of making an exact count.

I am figuring the wood cutters have been working at the edge of an open area of 'Ians Apartment', and if it is definate that some people are to be staying here permenantly, we will clear cut rather than clear standing dead wood.

[jolo]

I suggest we beat the furries out of the woods and into a Kill zone, kill anything that moves, skin it, smoke it, and pack it. It'll probably be a group effort, and should keep us in meet for a couple of weeks, plus it'll clear out most of the big game in the area that might harm the plants.

Good idea. I'll join. Maybe I don't shoot well, but I can make some noise... :)

[Psychomeltdown]

I am figuring the wood cutters have been working at the edge of an open area of 'Ians Apartment', and if it is definate that some people are to be staying here permenantly, we will clear cut rather than clear standing dead wood.
It'll give you time to hammer out the detail and logistics on cutting down trees. Train up the men and women we'll need later to clear the trees where we're gonna live.

[SionEwig]

I'm the ponytailed Hippie looking dude with the cannon slung on my back ( the cannons a Barret 50 cal. sniper rifle) also wearing cammo uniform

The 82, 90, or 95?

We didn't bring my wives Model 90, just too much weight.:(

[Matt]

othniel MBerry's out scouting and left his scout behind (me) so while our military commander is mia opps I meant not here I have the knowledge to teach you.
:o

Sorry bout that, didn't have ya around online to verify that you would be coming along. Let's presume you were working with Weapon M on the guard?

[Ghost 88]

okay I was trying to do so but can't find him. hear something about him busy with a pizza party

[Gerard-ABC]

Norbert,
I got those 2 NPCs working with me like Ward / Glen / someone ? said.

We're starting to work on making a cart / wagon. I got one 2-man saw, 2 good axes, and the usual household toolbox, half of which used to be my father's tools from decades ago. Still work ok though.

So, far, 30 mins to get one tree down, and that's before we trim it. I got a jar of nails here, to fix the wagon together. Maybe use some of the branches to make a frame on top, then a covered roof from those black plastic bags to keep the rain off. Using a slice of the trunk to do each wheel, not quite a circle, but close enough to rotate ok.

If you got any ideas for doing it better, then I'm listening. No accidents / injuries with me or the 2 NPCs yet. Only scare was an animal out there, which turned out to be a rabbit.


Regards,
Gerard

[Norbert]

Norbert,
I got those 2 NPCs working with me like Ward / Glen / someone ? said.

We're starting to work on making a cart / wagon. I got one 2-man saw, 2 good axes, and the usual household toolbox, half of which used to be my father's tools from decades ago. Still work ok though.

So, far, 30 mins to get one tree down, and that's before we trim it. I got a jar of nails here, to fix the wagon together. Maybe use some of the branches to make a frame on top, then a covered roof from those black plastic bags to keep the rain off. Using a slice of the trunk to do each wheel, not quite a circle, but close enough to rotate ok.

If you got any ideas for doing it better, then I'm listening. No accidents / injuries with me or the 2 NPCs yet. Only scare was an animal out there, which turned out to be a rabbit.


Regards,
Gerard

Get with me when I get back from the cutting, and I will get you a couple of broadaxes and adzes and wedges, and I will show you how to split boards as well as squaring them up for easier use. The wheels you probably ought to have about 4-5 inches thick for now, I am not sure how well they will hold up if thinner. Find the center of the log and use a string as a compass, and use your axes to trim them. For the center hole, use an auger (which I have) to make your hole, and use a chisel to square it (easier mating of wheel to axel for now). I would suggest that you make a spare axle, and one or two extra wheels for each wagon (ideally, a spare wheel for each wheel in use). I will look at the tree you are planning to use for your boards, some varieties will be easier to split into planks than others. Until you figure out what really works best, figure them as being one-shot deals, they may not be in very good condition at the end of the trip. But, by making them, you will be learning what works, and more importantly, what does not work. But, it will be a process of self teaching, and the best way to learn is to make a mistake, and figuring out what works better. I will give you any pointers I can while you are doing it, but DO NOT consider me an expert, I've never built a wagon this way either!

[Psychomeltdown]

psychomeltdown voices his concern over the possibility of more games and grizzlies in the woods near and around Ian's Apartment.

I don't know if that bear was a freak coincidence, since bears are supposed to be hibernating in the winter time, or due to the heavy concentration of tasty animals, it's a real possibility that more and more predators will be drawn to our location.

The animals that we've brought with us, although small in number, are going to be heavily relied on come later years. So it's important that we begin making strides toward trying to keep them safe and trying to lessen the possibility that they might be attacked.

On a related topic, though it may not seem like it, the entire "community" has at least about a month of food tucked away. Due to the weight restraints imposed by the ASBs we were only able to pack so much food and tools.

Now the real possibility of starvation is present. We need to begin tightly rationing what we have and we need to begin looking for alternative sources of food.

This is where the two topics are related.

We can possibility kill two birds with one stone here. If we are able to gather a large enough group of armed members, then we can begin thinning out the potential predators and potential competitors for food and such among the surrounding woodlands.

EDIT: I have posted the Great Hunt Plan (http://alternatehistory.com/discussion/showpost.php?p=383424&postcount=23) in the What's the Plan Thread.

[Gerard-ABC]

Norbert,

Thanks for the advice.

Thanks for the extra tools. My toolbox was more suited to doing lighter work - cabinets / indoor woodwork, not outside trees. My only experience with those was cutting a few down in the garden, when the roots started to be a problem, 10 years ago.

Yes, the wheels are thick, I figured they'd be stronger. I'd planned on doing 2 spare wheels per wagon, but doing 2 more is a good idea.

I'll get on with the trimming the wheels. The 2 NPCs are trimming off the branches from the 2nd and 3rd trees that we've brought down. Not sure what kind they are, I used to figure if that there was no nice fruit on them, then it didn't matter. Now, I'll start to learn.

Auger for the wheels - if that's the spiral metal that you fit into hand-powered thing... then I've got one, it's old, but still works. Chisels, I've got.

The advice on splitting trees into boards will be good. I've not done that before.


>> Until you figure out what really works best, figure them as being one-shot deals, they may not be in very good condition at the end of the trip. <<

That's ok. if they get the people, food and supplies to where we're going, that's enough. I'm here to learn.


They may not be much use now for the wagon, but I packed a battery-powered drill, and a jigsaw, and a few boxes of blades / drills. I got some spare battery packs, and 2 chargers. I figure that once we get near a river, someone with a hydroelectric-driven engine can recharge them. We'll see.


Regards,
Gerard

< reaching into pocket for pencil / string >

[SionEwig]

Get with me when I get back from the cutting, and I will get you a couple of broadaxes and adzes and wedges, and I will show you how to split boards as well as squaring them up for easier use. The wheels you probably ought to have about 4-5 inches thick for now, I am not sure how well they will hold up if thinner. Find the center of the log and use a string as a compass, and use your axes to trim them. For the center hole, use an auger (which I have) to make your hole, and use a chisel to square it (easier mating of wheel to axel for now). I would suggest that you make a spare axle, and one or two extra wheels for each wagon (ideally, a spare wheel for each wheel in use). I will look at the tree you are planning to use for your boards, some varieties will be easier to split into planks than others. Until you figure out what really works best, figure them as being one-shot deals, they may not be in very good condition at the end of the trip. But, by making them, you will be learning what works, and more importantly, what does not work. But, it will be a process of self teaching, and the best way to learn is to make a mistake, and figuring out what works better. I will give you any pointers I can while you are doing it, but DO NOT consider me an expert, I've never built a wagon this way either!

What diameter were you thinking about with the wheels, you're going to need at least 36" dia (ground clearance). Rather than trying to use sections of trunk, you should cut planks, they will still need to be about 4' thick. Overall they will probably be scrap lumber at the end of the trip, but not like we won't be able to get use out of them that way (even if as fire wood).

[Norbert]

What diameter were you thinking about with the wheels, you're going to need at least 36" dia (ground clearance). Rather than trying to use sections of trunk, you should cut planks, they will still need to be about 4' thick. Overall they will probably be scrap lumber at the end of the trip, but not like we won't be able to get use out of them that way (even if as fire wood).


OK! I nominate you to help build Wagon Wheels!

[SionEwig]

OK! I nominate you to help build Wagon Wheels!

I'm out scouting:D . No seriously, my wife would be the one to turn to anyway, she does most of the wood working in the family. Only reason I knew about the solid wheels is cause that's what I saw on the reproductions.

[Ghost 88]

agree on solid wheels spoked ones are two tech levels up (i.e. time consumming)

[Gerard-ABC]

Norbert, Sion, Ghost,

Thanks for the ideas / advice on the wheels for the wagons. No way am I doing nice fancy spoked wheels for them now. Maybe once we're in final town, and got time to do them right. They'll double the time needed to do each wagon otherwise.

As for using space blankets to rest the meat we'll collect on, good idea. The plastic black bin bags were to use as covers over the top of the wagon, if you think we need them.


Scary hearing those shots in the morning, then the news sad news. But, it was to happen sooner or later. Hopefully the rest of us got more sense.


Regards,
Gerard