View Full Version : AH Challenge - no partition of Poland
June 30th, 2005, 10:56 PM
With a POD no earlier than 1700 AD, how could Poland survive through the 18th century without being partitioned, and become one of the major economic and military powers of Europe in the 19th and 20th centuries
July 1st, 2005, 01:36 AM
Poland-Lithuania doesn't try to reform, and remains a puppet of Russia...
As for making it a major power, well, perhaps at some point Russia falls into Chaos (it sometimes did in OTL), giving an ambitious King who, though got to the throne with the support of Russia, is also able to reform the system, perhaps making the Kingship hereditary and ending the liberum veto... I believe Poland may be able to do well for itself.
July 1st, 2005, 02:13 AM
Poland's problem was that it had three major powers (and sometimes four or five if you include Sweden and the Ottoman Empire) on its borders. Even if you remove one of them, there's still a good change of the other 3-4 taking powers. You need Poland to stay at its maximum size circa the 1600s, have Russia remain divided and Prussia-Brandenburg weak or non-existence with no major state in the western Holy Roman Empire. But this still leaves a strong Sweden and Ottoman or Austrian Empire all of which may be stronger. If Poland can perhaps achieve the reverse of what Russia did and create a Polish-Lithuanian-Russian Commonwealth with lots of autonomy for the Russian principalities then there’s a good chance that may end up staying for the long run.
July 1st, 2005, 02:17 AM
Have Prussia be merged into Poland.
July 1st, 2005, 07:37 AM
1-Have Prussia merged with Poland instead of becoming a vassal
2-Sobieski manages to reform the political system centralising Polan a bit more
3-Instead of Chmielnicki getting into conflict with other magnates have him rise in Polihs ranks, and reform the Commnowealth of Both Nations, to Commonwealth of Nations, with Ukrainians as equal partners.
Without Prussia, more centralised rule, and Ukrainian cossacks on the side of Poland, partitions could be avoided.The usage of Ukrainian cossacks could also make Swedish deluge short lived.
And of course If I would like to be a bit nasty, have Sobieski centralize Poland and fight a local clash between nobles to achieve authority.Also he planned to occupy Prussia with the help of the French and Swedish.Have him reach a diplomatic treaty with Ottoman Empire drawing a clear border.
Of course by this Ottomans gain Vienna :D
By this we have gotton ourself rid of Austria and Prussia, leaving only Russia as enemy of Poland.
Of course Ottoman Empire could become a threat in the future.
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