"Canadian mediates the Mexico Crisis thread"

[Lauranthalas]

ok here we go MBarry

[Matt]

:D

Anyways like I was saying. A spilt would be agreeable if we can use one of the canals.

[Lauranthalas]

so MBarry wants rights for one of the chanels.

GP and P99 probably wanna have a word in here too

[Lauranthalas]

:D

Anyways like I was saying. A spilt would be agreeable if we can use one of the canals.
I think they are both in GC territory aren't they?

[perdedor99]

so MBarry wants rights for one of the chanels.

GP and P99 probably wanna have a word in here too

No way in hell Mexican territory will be split. Of course it the US abandon us oh well. And I guess we can post this as happening thru months in ME6 time.

[Lauranthalas]

No way in hell Mexican territory will be split. Of course it the US abandon us oh well. And I guess we can post this as happening thru months in ME6 time.
do you represent the rebels in mexico or the infunctional gov'ment with that statement?

[Matt]

Nah, we'll keep Mexico whole. We can make a MEGA-canal!! From Tijuana to Vera Cruz!! <g>

[perdedor99]

do you represent the rebels in mexico or the infunctional gov'ment with that statement?

The government of Mexico. But of course all depends of their protector the US. if they abandon them, is not a lot they can do.

[Lauranthalas]

Nah, we'll keep Mexico whole. We can make a MEGA-canal!! From Tijuana to Vera Cruz!! <g>
impossible. the pacific is 3 feet higher than the gulf of mexico and the rest of the carrabean. you couldn't hold the water pressure and it would become really messy
and the distance would cost you too much

[Matt]

impossible. the pacific is 3 feet higher than the gulf of mexico and the rest of the carrabean. you couldn't hold the water pressure and it would become really messy


Never mind the several mountain chains in the way :D

[Lauranthalas]

what would you guys say to:

US gets total protectorate of Mexico
GC gets some land in the south where the rightwing rebels are
Mexico's border regions become demilitarized
US become a maximal amount of troops they can station in Mexico
Mexico's army is basically there to fight the rebels
GC does not support the rebels in any kind

[Matt]

"US become a maximal amount of troops they can station in Mexico"

I know English isn't your native language, so I think this means maxium, correct?

[perdedor99]

what would you guys say to:

US gets total protectorate of Mexico
GC gets some land in the south where the rightwing rebels are
Mexico's border regions become demilitarized
US become a maximal amount of troops they can station in Mexico
Mexico's army is basically there to fight the rebels
GC does not support the rebels in any kind

what is the gain for Mexico? Everything you offer they already will do without giving away any territory. Maybe if Guatemala and Belize are abandon by GP and demilitarised. But no Mexican territory will be given away.

[Glen]

Locks.

It would be a bit of a bear to build, but with 21st Century technology it's certainly doable if you do it across the Isthmus of Tehuantepec.

It's about 125 miles of canal. Compare that to all the work that has been done by the US on the Intracoastal Waterways.

Oh, and there is a break in the mountains right there. The plateau is only about 750 feet.

This is certainly doable, and would be a better position for US transoceanic shipping. Not to mention not having to deal with Gran Columbia....

[Glen]

what is the gain for Mexico? Everything you offer they already will do without giving away any territory. Maybe if Guatemala and Belize are abandon by GP and demilitarised. But no Mexican territory will be given away.

Now, a Mexican Canal, that would be something that would benefit the economy!

[Matt]

Intersting.. how long of a project though I wonder.

Building something like that would certainly give a boost to the Mexican government and establish thousands of jobs.

[Glen]

Intersting.. how long of a project though I wonder.

Well, if only nukes worked, wouldn't take long at all<eg>. Barring that, probably a few years. All depends on how much money the US pours into building it.

Building something like that would certainly give a boost to the Mexican government and establish thousands of jobs.

Maybe even tens of thousands. It's a much better long term solution than trying to work out a deal with Gran Columbia. Of course, if the Gran Columbians knew the alternative to dealing with the US for canal access was to have them build a Mexican one, that might make them more interested in a better deal.

But of course, the real problem is that a deal for access to a GC canal would never give you the security of OTL Panama Canal. They could shut it off to the US at their leisure, and it would be hard fighting to take it from them.

[Lauranthalas]

"US become a maximal amount of troops they can station in Mexico"

I know English isn't your native language, so I think this means maxium, correct?
yeah basically we have to decide for a number the US have to stay under

[Lauranthalas]

what is the gain for Mexico? Everything you offer they already will do without giving away any territory. Maybe if Guatemala and Belize are abandon by GP and demilitarised. But no Mexican territory will be given away.
Mexico can be glad that it survived. There are other outcomes where mexico would be vitually or practically not existing anymore. sry to put it that hard but it's basically what it is

[General_Paul]

I will NOT abandon Guatemala and Belize to any foreign powert. And, yes, Laur is right, Mexico should be damn glad to exist right now. Now, as for canal rights, I've got 2 canals! One in Nicaragua, and one in Panama. Both highly guarded, and both are well within GC sovereign territory. Now, an other problem that we may delve into is the territory gained by GC. I've fought long and hard for Chiapas, and have controled it not once, but now almost twice, and I would like to control that, or at least have that as a buffer state, governed by the Fascist rebels. If this is not agreeable, then GC would like some land in Yucatan, and Quintana Roo Provinces, if at all possible. GC perfers these areas, because neither province has had any form of a stable government since the US marines pulled out after the biowar. If possible, GC would like to turn these into a separate nation, a fascist nation, or a democracy, either one works. And, our final set of greivances, is the canal sitation.

The Panama and Nicaragua canals are major income outlets for Gran Colombia, and it would be unfair to Gran Colombia to be penalized in such a way over wars fought to restore some semblance of stabality to an unstable nation.

[Matt]

Mexico in US camp, with DMZ on both sides of border, with exception to light forces to combat any guerillas. Acceptible?

[General_Paul]

I will agree to a 1 mile DMZ on both sides of the border. Now, about the land partition, Yucatan, and Quintana Roo Provinces, are these acceptable?

[Matt]

I was thinking maybe as much as 5 on each side. As for the provinces, I would have to consult the Mexican authorities before hand.

[General_Paul]

Si Senior. A five mile DMZ seems a bit...excessive. I mean, we're not planning on a cold war here, are we? Oh wait, I think we are, so that works. 5 miles is acceptable. Now, as to those provinces, I believe teh province of Campeche should also be included. If that is possible of course.

[Glen]

All I want is the Sudatenland, then I shall be satisfied....

[General_Paul]

I am NO hitler... and besides, that area of land won't be governed by Gran Colombia. That will be a self ruled nation, with elected officials. And, I am asking for the Yucatan penninsula for christs sake! Its not like I'm asking for all of mexico, its the yucatan penninsula. No significant tactical advantage, I just want a buffer state.

[perdedor99]

No Mexican territory will be trade off. Forget about Yucatan, Chiapas of Quintana Roo. The DMZ will be in Guatemala and Belize. If the territories spoken are given to Colombia a Mexican Canal will be a couple meters of the border.[a little bit of a strech but catch my drift].

Why give mexican land to Colombia? They ran as soon as the Americans began to cross the border, so they demostrated to the world they weren't ready to face the US. If Powell do this he will be the Chamberlain of the 21st Century. Peace in our time; he should yell as soon as he returns to the States. I consider it should be the other way around. Is a no brainer. Colombia,Stay in your side of the border and the DMZ will be in the current borders. And no support to the guerillas.

[Imajin]

All I want is the Sudatenland, then I shall be satisfied....
The Sudentenland is mine though :p

[General_Paul]

The DMZ will be a five mile DMZ then. And I do not support the gurillas, but if they cross the border, and take residence in my nation, I have no qualums about giving them citizenship. And, to ask you this question, was YOUR nation ready to face off the gringo's? Were you ready to become a PUPPET of the powers that be? If you wish not to give up territory, fine, so be it. But a mexican canal is stupid, we've got 2 canals already, one in nicaragua, and one in panama, and a mexican canal would be an idiotic idea that would take decades to build. Just ask for rights to travel through the canal, and I will consider it.

[Othniel]

I have a US company based in Brazil that would like that contract for the canal... Western Hemisphere Fissure specilizes in building mining sites, and that includes in building irragation for a reliable food source. They have the semsic charges to deal with this over a period of 4 years. I'm sure that would be agreeable to the Mexican Goverment.

[General_Paul]

Guys! Colombia has a canal, two in fact. And, if you ask for rights, I will give them to you. Unlimited rights to the Panama Canal. It is a stupid, and pig headed idea to build a THIRD canal. Now, my grievances from before stand, I'd like the Yucatan Penninsula, and there, we will set up a democratic government, run by the peoples of the Yucatan. The one stipulation is that, the fascist rebels formerly based out of Oaxaca, get representation in the parliment. We will allow the United States and the United Nations to have total access to the elections, and once the nation is stable, Colombian forces will evacuate the nation, and let it stand on its own two feet.

[perdedor99]

The problem is not the Canals is the tract record of your nation. Surprise and unprovocked attacks against your neighbours don't make for very sincere pleas coming from your part. Makes more sense to build a canal than use one that you can close at will. No way a canal in panama is defensible and for Yucatan? From were you can control the traffic in the Gulf of Mexico from secret sub and air bases. No thanks. Not one inch of Mexican territory willl be traded.

[Glen]

The problem is not the Canals is the tract record of your nation. Surprise and unprovocked attacks against your neighbours don't make for very sincere pleas coming from your part. Makes more sense to build a canal than use one that you can close at will. No way a canal in panama is defensible and for Yucatan? From were you can control the traffic in the Gulf of Mexico from secret sub and air bases. No thanks. Not one inch of Mexican territory willl be traded.

P99 rather eloquently states the case, I think.

[General_Paul]

Unprovoked attack? Try my nation trying to Stabalize your divided "nation", which has now become a puppet of the gringo's! And how am I going to control trade in the gulf? I don't even have a navy!!!! My airforce is still flying the MiG-17 for christs sake. And I am giving unlimited rights to the USA, and mexico, for the panama canal, in which I will not close both. Those canals are vital outlets of trade for Colombia, and it is sheer stupidity to to build a third. Its a waste of valuable resources, and lives.

[Matt]

Not one inch of Mexican territory well be traded. The DMZ is acceptible, and we graciously accept the offer for US use of the Colombian Canals. However we well be investigating the viablity of a Canal in Mexico. We well volunteerly keep troops out of the 3 disputed provinces, however Mexico well reserve the right to put forces there.

[Lauranthalas]

Not one inch of Mexican territory well be traded. The DMZ is acceptible, and we graciously accept the offer for US use of the Colombian Canals. However we well be investigating the viablity of a Canal in Mexico. We well volunteerly keep troops out of the 3 disputed provinces, however Mexico well reserve the right to put forces there.
what do you propose GC would get out of that deal?

[Matt]

non-intervention in the Chilean crisis.