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#2041
September 27th, 2010, 08:58 AM
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The love of liberty brought us here.
(Liberian state motto) Traditionally, the US had been protecting Liberia from pressures exerted by the neighbouring colonial powers, Britain and France. And by the end of 1929, German Middle African presence at the borders of Liberia had attracted a task force of the US Navy. Off Monrovia, in good day time visibility from the town, the battleships USS Montana (BB-51) and USS Massachusetts (BB-54) and the fleet carrier USS Gnat (CV-6) formed the core of a fleet of twenty-one ships cruising at leisure. They were shadowed by SMS Mbandaka, which was keeping a healthy distance. At the same time, the light cruiser USS Concord shadowed the Middle African task force deployed to the coast of the military protectorate Elfenbeinküste. The Middle African forces had made no attacks on Liberian territory during their operations against ‘criminals’ in former French Côte d’Ivoire and Guinée; and the German ambassador to Monrovia had made clear that these borders would be respected. Thus, political circles in Monrovia were quite relaxed. Okay, the attempt to gain more land – to which the ruling Americo-Liberians felt they had an entitlement, because in the ‘Scramble for Africa’ Britain and France had taken land that rightfully belonged to Liberia – had failed for the time being, but the existence of Liberia was not threatened at all. The mercenaries had suffered badly. But they were on the pay lists of the Firestone and Goodyear Companies. Therefore, the Liberian authorities had no reason to worry. Nevertheless, they were interested to learn more about the Middle Africans, who now seemed to be the new neighbours to the east and the north. Thomas Dale Johnson, a high official in the Liberian foreign ministry, had been drinking with Colonel Duncan McKinley in order to learn more about the annihilation of McKinley’s Brigade. While other mercenary formations generally had gotten away with only medium to moderate casualties, McKinley’s Brigade, operating close to the shore in former Côte d’Ivoire, had ceased to exist. McKinley himself had escaped unharmed with an airplane, leaving his force to be destroyed by the Middle Africans. Johnson had met McKinley in a lodge overlooking Monrovia Bay. The Scotsman had already been drunk when Johnson arrived, but had kept boozing more Whisky all the time. “Those black bastards… like the damn Boches… fast moving freaks, always there where you don’t expect them…” McKinley had muttered. Clinking glasses with the Colonel, Johnson learned about the fate of McKinley’s Brigade. Anticipating that he would become drunk in this process as well, he neatly wrote down notes. If not for the ‘plantation workers’ the mercenaries could have escaped by turning inland. But in his creed to save the precious human ‘merchandise’, McKinley had lost his unit. “All gone… English Companies fought well, brave like Scots and Welsh… blasted Americans let themselves be overrun… cursed Irish cowards ran away… Cheers, Thommy my friend! – Friggin’ Black Krauts!” It was a long tale of self-pity and accusations against others. With the clarity that drunkenness sometimes provides, Johnson realized and penned down how cowardly McKinley had deserted his desperately fighting outfit in an airplane provided by Dickson’s Fly Boys just for this purpose. With this record, McKinley was done in the mercenary world. Nobody would ever hire him again, nor would anybody ever want to enlist with him. When McKinley finally had fallen into drunken stupor, alternately belling Highland ballads and shouting orders to imaginary troopers, Johnson had left. Stumbling to his car, he decided to pay a visit to Fiona; he just felt in the mood... “Twelfth Street…” he prattled to his driver. “Miss Fiona?” asked the man. “Exactly…” Johnson had a sexual penchant for white women. He was married to a black Americo-Liberian spouse of good family and had three children with her, but his mistresses regularly were white. Fiona was very white; she had flaming red hair, green eyes and a body as white as marble. She had already been to bed – and now was not overly enthusiastic to accommodate that drunken bloke. But business was business… “Here, Darling, have a drink.” She offered him a liberally poured glass of whiskey. He took it, drank and stared at her with blood-shot eyes. “So, you have come for a late night stand?” Johnson nodded and grinned drunkenly. While she unpacked his dick, she poured him more whiskey and told him how ready she was for him. It worked – after ten minutes of dick stroking and susurrating ruttish words in his ears the guy had gulped down enough whiskey to fall asleep. When he awoke in the next morning, she would tell him what a glorious fuck they had had. That would make him glad and proud. While Thomas D. Johnson was snoring in the armchair, Fiona made a copy of his notes and scanned all his papers for more information. 
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#2044
September 27th, 2010, 05:08 PM
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Maybe he's working for Ottoman superspy Muharip.
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Mordor ISOT to Medieval Europe. Can the known world survive against Sauron? http://www.alternatehistory.com/disc...d.php?t=198299
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#2045
September 28th, 2010, 07:13 AM
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Übung macht den Meister.
(Practice makes perfect – German proverb) With satisfaction, Generalmajor (brigadier general) Saffet M’budibe strolled over the training area, accompanied by his aide-de-camp, 2nd Lieutenant Franz Mbeko. It had taken endless time to talk the Ottomans into accepting Middle African training assistance, but finally General Kazım Pasha had agreed – after witnessing the superiority of the black men over his Turks in a series of combat exercises. Jagdkampf (commando combat) required initiative and discipline. Discipline the Mehmetçikler had; initiative and accepting higher responsibility was not exactly their strong side. But they could – and would – learn. The principle ‘demonstration – imitation – practise’ made it easy for them to see what they were required to do, even when interpreters were not available. Building an obstacle course had been easy. Getting shooting training right was much more difficult: There were no training rounds for the Kabuk Aşmaklar! But doing exercises with the real thing was hellishly dangerous. Thus, wooden mock-ups had to be constructed for field training, while special shooting ranges with huge berms were required for life fire training. Initially, the Turks had complained that too many of the precious new weapons were ‘squandered’ in training. However, seeing the bad shooting results – especially when moving targets were employed – the Turkish Generals soon had accepted that only thorough training could make the small anti-tank rocket launchers effective. Dealing with a mass assault of armoured fighting vehicles required a very deep defence. Rigid trench lines would quickly be broken, artillery positions overrun and headquarters neutralised – if they were positioned too far forward. The enemy had to be forced to advance through a zone full of small commando units, who offered no coherent resistance, but constantly threatened his flanks and his rear – and conducted their attacks mainly under the cover of darkness and bad visibility. There was room enough in Uyghurstan that could be traded off against wearing down the enemy. Considering that a single soldiers armed with a Kabuk Aşmak was able to neutralise a Chinese Tiějiă, a deep defence zone full of commando units armed with rocket launchers should be able to blunt a Chinese offensive – without offering the enemy a chance of decisive victory. The frugal Turkish soldiers were very well capable of fighting in such small commando units, once they understood that they had to act self-reliant and autonomous. Their physical shape was generally excellent, what they had to acquire was the mindset of a commando soldier. M’budibe had been aghast when learning that Middle African forces had gone into action in Côte d’Ivoire – without him and his men. It suddenly had seemed to be no good idea to have gone to Uyghurstan. But now, in early 1930, he was reconciled by the important progress the Turks were making in adopting Jagdkommando tactics. The Turkish leaders today were quite confident to deal with the Chinese tank masses. The perplexity of some months ago had given way to optimism. M’budibe and Mbeko now reached an area, where the engineers were teaching their art. Anti-tank mines as a concept had already existed in the Great War, but had seen little practical application. After the war, France, Britain and Germany had developed special anti-tank mines. The Turks used the German model, which was a steel disk filled with eight kilograms of explosives detonated by a pressure fuse. An anti-tank mine could rupture the track of a tank and damage the running gear. Every commando soldier had to learn how to place and arm anti-tank mines. The devices would be laid in mine fields all over the defence zone. In addition, there would be hidden storage caches – so that the commandos could lay new mine fields in zones the enemy had previously cleared. Fortunately, the terrain of Uyghurstan was favourable for quickly digging in and hiding mines in short time without much labour. If the Chinese thought they could win an easy victory with their armoured armada, they would be taught a painful lesson…
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#2046
September 28th, 2010, 11:42 AM
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Hm. What's the Chinese doctrine concerning tank warfare again? Do they plan for infantry support or will the tanks advance all on their own, thus becoming relatively easy prey for the Jagdkommandos?
Good to see the Ottomans beginning to see reason. How much is their army centered on simple order-based execution as opposed to Prussian/German task/mission-based execution of orders and the resulting reduction of strain on the chain of command? Commando-style warfare flourishes under relaxed supervision, after all. If this confrontation takes place and the Ottomans are successful in giving the Chinese a bloody nose, TTL's concept of tank warfare could be discredited or at least significantly altered.
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#2047
September 28th, 2010, 01:01 PM
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The Chinese will employ mixed task forces of tanks and mechanised infantry, followed up by motorised infantry and motorised artillery, shielded by the air force from above.
The Ottomans still operate pretty much order based, despite the work of various German training missions before the Great War.
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#2048
September 28th, 2010, 09:19 PM
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It sounds sort of like the Boer wars. The Chinese will probably be able to win eventually but they'll need concentration camps (not that many people would care about the locals in the Western world), strings of forts, and rapid reaction task forces (airborne?) to win. It'll be cool to see mountainous paratroopers.
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#2049
September 28th, 2010, 11:47 PM
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The best strategy for the Turks is that they'll try and hold off the Chinese as long as possible, and buy time. If they inflict enough casualties upon the Chinese, and if it drags on for months and months with no end in sight, then the Chinese population not to mention his cabinet will get sick of it and they'll demand that Chiang would stop the war or risk him being tossed out. All the Turks need to do is not lose, while the Chinese have to win outright.
In addition, ever since Nubar Gulbenkian failed and the ensuing Greek diplomatic embarassment, I haven't seen any post detailing any covert Chinese intelligence operations, while Mirlava Muharip and his ragtags continue to act with impunity within China. The Turks know what the Chinese plans are, while the Chinese don't seem to have any idea of the Mittleafrikan soldiers, or the new Turk rockets, and seem to assume once everything is in place that they'll be able to roll over the Turks with sheer quantity. As for new developments in armored warfare, I predict that there will be more emphasis on training eingineer batallions that could go ahead of the force and detect and disable anti-tank mines and the like. Paratrooper units would also be trained to conduct anti-tank mine operations. Tactics wise, I could see the armored warfare also using reconnaisance in force, similar to the Soviets during late 1944-45 with tanks and other armored vehicles ahead of the main body, so they can reveal anti-tank teams, positions, and the like. For the Turks, the mobile commando team concept is something that could also be improved further, namely by providing each of these specialized squad with a radio. Speaking of mountainous troops, we've heard nothing from Afghanistan ever since they made that expansion into former British India. Don't know if they'd have any interest in what's going on in Uighurstan, but its not too far away, and have the Turks attempted to recruit any of their troops to the cause? It goes without saying how effective Afghan fighters could be in a mountainous environment, whittling down an advance of superior forces, laying roadside b-...err, anti-tank mines and generally being a nuisance. I wouldn't expect too many, but it would be a nice opportunity for the Afghan King to expand Afghanistan's regional influence modestly at low cost, relieve any potential inter-tribal strife by promising glory in battle defending fellow Muslims, and have a stake in Uighurstan's re-construction. Besides, wouldn't it be cool to see Afghan Guerillas, Ottoman commando teams and MittleAfrikan mercenaries working together?
__________________
Mordor ISOT to Medieval Europe. Can the known world survive against Sauron? http://www.alternatehistory.com/disc...d.php?t=198299 Last edited by Bmao; September 28th, 2010 at 11:57 PM..
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#2051
September 29th, 2010, 05:17 AM
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Quote:
So, sorry, no Afghan guerrillas in Uyghurstan; but there is a sufficient number of irregulars from the Khanate of Kokand and the Republic of Kazakhstan to take up this role.
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#2052
September 29th, 2010, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
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#2053
September 29th, 2010, 09:13 AM
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The Dragon’s Pearl
The proven team of General Li Zongren and his chief of staff, Major-General Bai Chongxi, had been given the task of planning the operation in Uyghurstan, which – for the time being – had received the working name ‘Xī’ (west). Preparation for staging the forces was of paramount importance, camps and narrow gauge railways had to be constructed before the troops earmarked for the operation even started to arrive. Supply dumps had to be set up as well as airfields, command posts, hospitals etc. They had set up their headquarters at Jiayuguán at the planned junction of the two great rail lines. Quite stylishly, Jiayuguán Fort, guarding the westernmost pass of the Great Wall, provided excellent facilities for the HQ. Jiayuguán was an ancient station on the Chinese side of the Silk Road, infamous as the gate for those banished from the Chinese Empire, who had to leave in western direction – and never were allowed to come back. Today, however, vast camps housing railway workers dominated the environment, making the traditional inns – and the newly established whore houses – extremely profitable. The Silk Road Rail Line was already working up to Jiayuguán, making work much easier for the engineer battalions, which had arrived from Uliassutai together with the generals and their staff. Because the Gobi Altay provided too much of an obstacle, no major operation out of Uliassutai was under consideration, although some faints might still be staged. Thus, the rail line from Niislel Khüree towards the Gobi Altay had remained single track, freeing the engineer battalions for work in the staging area of Operation Xī. In western Uliassutai, foot marching infantry, deemed to be the best remedy against the insurgents in Tannu Uriankhai, was now arriving by rail. On January 22nd, 1930, a colonel of the Chinese military intelligence service arrived at Jiayuguán, carrying a huge bag. Because General Li was out reconnoitring the area, Major-General Bai received the visitor, who introduced himself as Colonel Tan Péng-Bĕi. Out of his bag, Colonel Tan rummaged a strange object. “This is what the Turks call a Kabuk Aşmak, an armour smasher.” “Mh, looks like a stove pipe to me…” Colonel Tan rummaged another object out of his bag. “This is the rocket, which is inside the stove pipe. It is capable of penetrating 130 mm of armour.” “There can be no more than two kilograms of explosive in this small thing. How should they penetrate such thick armour?” “Actually, there are only 1.5 kilograms of PETN – a high explosive invented by the Germans – in the war head. But it uses a new principle – that of the shaped charge – to penetrate thick armour. – Believe me, it works. We have tested it. – Doesn’t make a big hole, just a small one as if sticking a pencil through butter, but it’s enough to kill a Tiějiă, if it hits ammunition or fuel.” “Nasty. – Are you saying that the Turks now have a man-portable weapon that can stop Tiějiăs?” “Yes, that’s my message. – They are mass producing these little beasts. – The main weakness is the short range of the war head. Because all the rocket propellant has to have burned away before the rocket leaves the pipe – otherwise the user would get burned – it has only an effective range of 50 to 60 metres.” “Any proposals how to make them effectless?” “If you install a secondary thin armour plate some twenty or thirty centimetres away from the main armour, only that spaced armour will be penetrated while the main armour will remain intact.” “Has this already been initiated?” “Not yet. – We’ve just received some samples the other week and tested them cursorily. By the way, we lost three men in the process, when one of the beasts exploded. They’re not very safe for handling. – But my superior thought you ought to know about this first.” “General Li will want a demonstration. – The nearest Tiějiă regiment is stationed at Xi’an. Are you prepared to launch your little present on a Tiějiă?” “Any time.” “Fine. – I’ll arrange for a plane to transport us to Xi’an. Try to get some rest before General Li comes back.”
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#2055
September 29th, 2010, 11:52 AM
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That essentially requires a second hull covering much of the tiejia with a distance of 20 to 30 centimeters without limiting sight and maneuverability. I suppose that secondary hull is quite vulnerable to standard artillery? Anyway, I think the turks will know soon enough that the Chinese know about the new weapon.
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#2057
September 29th, 2010, 01:44 PM
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And yes, with new weapons you either and them out to your troops and hope the enemy doesn't learn fast enough or deny them to your troops until the last moment and hope that they learn faster than the enemy. There is no wonder weapon, and there is no real substitute for the tank even as of today. For example: AT infantry can take down tanks cheaply but they lack mobility so lets get them in trucks. But then their mobility increases the chance of random encounters and those trucks lack protections so lets get them mechanized. But then those mechanized infantry lack range against tanks so lets make them SP-artillery. But then those SP-artillery lack armor against tanks so lets bolt on a few inches of steel. But then those armoured SP-artillery lack firing rate in close combat so lets make them tanks. and it comes full circle Last edited by glowjack; September 29th, 2010 at 02:02 PM..
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#2058
September 29th, 2010, 01:46 PM
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Now given that this forum is full of experts for weaponry, is this all that is requrie to neutralize the threat of the Kabuk Aşmak? How easy would it be to adapt ammo to the improved armour? Couldn't one simply go for the rails of the tiejias, therefore immobilizing them?
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#2059
September 29th, 2010, 02:25 PM
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track hit are quite uncommon ... and difficult. Plus the solution for spaced armor today for HEAT warheads is simply 2 warheads in series, which can be defeated by more spaced/reactive armor. Unless the Ottomans bring in high velocity guns it would be very easy to defeat mines (as they are only effective when watched over or placed individually to harass) and RPGs alone (look at Iraq, only one tank disabled in all the occupation) .
And yes it is that simple to neutralize RPGs. While to overcome spaced armor you make the warhead detonate only when hitting something hard enough but then there is the OTL soviet's soft armor which is just a layer of lead over the armor, you can't get around the fact that the best anti-tank weapon is another tank (or helicopter). There's a reason tanks are still around today with all the "wonder" anti-tank weaponry Last edited by glowjack; September 29th, 2010 at 02:50 PM..
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#2060
September 29th, 2010, 03:07 PM
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That's a very good point, as huge as the Ottoman's early developement of Rocket tech is.. It just isn't enough when stacked against the Chinese superior numbers, both in terms of actual men and the Tanks they can feild in combat. That said, I'm still rooting for the Ottomans here. If the Chinese take the time to properly outfit their tanks to defend against the rockets, the Mittelafricans will have time to properly train the Turkish regulars. Time is definately on the Ottoman's side, if they can keep the war going long enough, and make it costly enough, public and political sentiment in China wil turn against Chiang's war. Added to that, even in light of this most recent developement, I still think everyone's favorite superspy Muharip has the advantage over his Chinese counterparts, I do not expect this victory to go unanswered.
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