We hanged Jeff Davis from a sour apple tree
- Thread starter Johnrankins
- Start date
TFSmith121
Banned
It's a good start...
It's a good start...
What's your reasoning as to how it comes about, however? The circumstances will have a huge impact on how it is perceived.
Best,
It's a good start...
What's your reasoning as to how it comes about, however? The circumstances will have a huge impact on how it is perceived.
Best,
It's a good start...
What's your reasoning as to how it comes about, however? The circumstances will have a huge impact on how it is perceived.
Best,
He gets blamed for being behind Lincoln's assassination and some evidence makes it stick. The evidence can be revealed as dubious decades later but it is believed at the time. They add the treason charge to the conspiracy to commit murder charge and he is hanged for both.
Probably a bad idea since it sort of gives the impression that the leader of the CSA had legitimacy, probably makes Reconstruction a mite trickier too (the South probably didn't love Davis, but this might unnecessarily make him a martyr) if people fear punitive retribution.
I could be wrong but I think that it would send the wrong message to the post ACW USA.
I could be wrong but I think that it would send the wrong message to the post ACW USA.
Lateknight
Banned
It would have sent the right message the message the south got was the north wasn't willing to make south change any of it's ways or really punishment them at all for their treachery. If Davis had been executed it would have show the north was willing to make real changes to the south and back that up with force.
Well, prosecuting (and executing) Jeff Davis for treason does not imply any "legitimacy" (after the fact) given to the CSA government/CSA as an entity. Starting and managing a rebellion against the established government is a good definition of a treasonous act. The issue is that if Davis is the only one so prosecuted, it leaves some serious legal issues. There a more CSA officials or even military who are equally culpable. I can't see a scenario where ONLY Davis is prosecuted, of the Union goes that road there will be many more trials.
OTL Wirz was the only Confederate prosecuted and executed, and that was for crimes related to Andersonville and treason/sedition was not brought up at all.
OTL Wirz was the only Confederate prosecuted and executed, and that was for crimes related to Andersonville and treason/sedition was not brought up at all.
Let's follow it up with any high ranking CSA government official they can get their hands on such as cabinet members, the VP, the more outspoken congressmen like Rhett etc. The military gets off due to the virtual pardon Grant gave them and Lincoln accepted.
I'm not so sure of this personally. Pummeling the South in a war is one thing, taking punitive measures against the Souths leadership doesn't do much to repair the Union as say, a more effective Reconstruction would do. It gives the Lost Causers ammunition about (unlike the relatively benevolent government of OTL) to say they are being oppressed and that the North is acting no different from the lords of Europe. Not the best way to re-knit the country IMO.
This is the problem, punishing one basically means you have to punish all, something the US wisely avoided OTL, it basically neutered the more radical die hards and gave the Souths leadership an honourable way out and a chance to help reunite the nation.
TFSmith121
Banned
If the proceedings are public and generally seen as fair,
If the proceedings are public and generally seen as fair, I don't see him becoming a martyr.
Depends a lot on the scope of any other trials, akin to those sketched by TKL in his story line.
Best,
If the proceedings are public and generally seen as fair, I don't see him becoming a martyr.
Depends a lot on the scope of any other trials, akin to those sketched by TKL in his story line.
Best,
He was also "guilty" of being just a no-account German immigrant. If he'd had a pedigree like Lee's, he would never have come to trial, but then, of course, the CS government would never have given him such a dirty job in the first place.
The monument at Stone Mountain would be differently designed, making the carving of Davis at least as big as that of Lee.
Davis' birthplace and old home would now be places of pilgrimage for Southern whites. Otherwise, probably not a lot changed.
Makes him even more of a martyr than clapping him in chains in Fortress Monroe did. It also makes him untouchable to criticis amungst his fellow former Confederates.
First they would have to prove that he committed treason. During the debates over the ratification of the Constitution numerous founding fathers stated that the states had the right to secede if they so chose, furthermore the ratification acts passed by both Virginia and New York explicitly reserved the right to withdraw the ratification if the state governments decided that the Federal Government was abusing its powers. Since the other states accepted these as valid and as all states were equal then all had the right to secede, therefore it would have been hard to prove treason. In fact some of the leading legal talents in the US refused to take the case against Davis due to them believing that it was simply impossible to prove that he had committed treason. Convicting him of being involved in Lincoln's assassination would have been easier, however the South would have definitely seen that as railroading the former President of the CSA and it would have made Reconstruction more difficult if not impossible.
If one accepts the proposition that the Southern rebels had ceased to be part of the United States then making war on the US would not be treason.
However it would justify the 'state suicide' theory and the rest of the US could rule them as it pleased
However it would justify the 'state suicide' theory and the rest of the US could rule them as it pleased
Not difficult to prove if he is court martialed. All you have to do is ship him to the right unit for trial. Have Jennison's Jayhawkers run the trial and he is as good as dead the moment he arrives. They were hard core abolitionists who had John Brown Jr as a member early in the war.
It is wrong to say only Wirz was executed. A number of guerillas of various official shades were executed - Champ Ferguson for one for murder.
Interestingly (or not) for Jeff a defendant in a murder case in Virginia at this time could not testify. No political justification. No speaking to the world beyond te court or to posterity.
What charges could be levied against Davis that could not also be levied against the entire Cabinet, Congress, and every governor and state legislator of the Confederate States? Shall they also swing?
This post makes me wonder if a "stab-on-the-back" legend could have been created on the South, leading to a second Civil War down the line.