if remnants of the medieval are what interest you, then you're gonna love this thing called the british monarchy
Map Thread XXII
- Thread starter Balkanized U.S.A
- Start date
Uhh i did a few more colors than two in the HRE lol. In Germany alone I colored Brandenburg, the Palatinate, and the Bavarian statelets. I cranked the opacity of the state colors down quite a bit though so the topography could show through.
The pale areas do denote Papal/Church lands
Russia looms very large in Balkan politics IOTL, so I wonder how them bordering Serbia, Greece, and Macedonia would go.
This reminds me of a quote by some Russian politician that went something like "if we cannot fly to Serbia, we may soon have to border it".
Below I work off the assumption that this diverges from more or less the modern day.
For one, Serbia has one of the most Russophile populations on earth. It's often said that Serbs love Russia more than Russians do (this has no bearing on my own opinions, and is just a broad trend in Serbian society). Russia is also Serbia's main supporter in the Kosovo Dispute. Russia views Kosovo as a giant American military base in its backyard. I could see Russia ITTL getting a pro-Russian candidate to power in Serbia through a combination of shady methods (bribery, threats) and genuinely huge appeal to a large voting bloc in the county by promising to aid Serbia, even just by supplying it and "militarily guaranteeing no US interference", in "reintegrating Kosovo and Metohija" on the principle that the US won't end the world over kosovo (which notably is not in NATO, largely due to the ongoing dispute with Serbia over whether it's even a country) . Not saying it would necessarily work, but it would certainly create some kinds of interesting tensions. Though without NATO protection kosovo IS defenseless it has no air force, not a single tank, few drones, smaller population, is the 134th strongest, that is to say 11th weakest, military on earth compared to Serbia, the 58th strongest. By no means impressive, but in comparison to kosovo, certainly so ITTL a successful Serbian operation there is... possible. Terrain could be an issue, the West could still find a way to intervene, all depends. This is cyberpunk, so maybe Russia has more Wagner-style mercenary companies eager to be put to work in some war in the Balkans.
Greece has been pretty firmly in the Western camp politically, although friendly with Serbia specifically as far as non or anti Western nations go. Russia, through Bulgaria, will cause SOME kind of drama. Not sure what, but something will be up.
Macedonia is another place with potential for this insanely wanked Russia to build influence. Ethnic Macedonians, particularly those on a broad spectrum between moderately nationalist and ultranationalist, have recently been very angry at the increasing political power being given to the country's Albanian minority. They are especially mad because they see it as "rewarding terrorism", since the Albanians staged an armed separatist uprising in 2001, and as giving Albanians "disproportionate" power. The US, EU, and broader global West are seen as the main advocates for this Albanian empowerment, and have therefore lost face with the Macedonian people, though Macedonians don't tend to be as anti-Western as their northern neighbors the Serbs. IOTL they aren't shifting to Russia because they don't have the same history with Russia Serbia does and Russia is far away (they are becoming increasingly pro Serbian though to face the "common enemy" of Albanian separatism). With Russia on the border though, things change. The big issue, of course, is that Bulgaria is not very popular in Macedonia, and ITTL it sort of seems to be gigaRussia's Balkan wing. Bulgars claim Macedonians are Bulgars, and Macedonians see this as a threat to their independence and an insult. IOTL after Albanian was recognized as a co-official language, Bulgaria asked that the same be done for Bulgarian. This was largely seen in Macedonia as a "further attempt to fracture the country". So the question of whether Russia can win over the hearts and minds of the Macedonians may come down to whether they are more scared of Albanians or Bulgars.
Bordering on Turkey is also geopolitically highly interesting.
Anyway, I wonder what kinds of great games are being played in the Balkans ITTL.
“Psst. Hey, Greeks. C’mere. How’d you like to make Istanbul Constantinople again? We need a hand with that.” What’s the POD for his world, anyway? I don’t think he said and it’s pretty important to determining alliances and leanings.
I absolutely love the idea of the “unicorn” being a pig and the “pegasus” being a flying giraffe, by the way. That sounds a lot like the OTL “elephant skull is a cyclops” story and feels like a “real” mythological confusion. You know, like how dragons look suspiciously like they were based on dinosaur skeletons.
He didn't say, but the borders make it clearly look like it's after the 2000s at least. The thing is Bulgaria being PART of Russia throws a wrench in that since Bulgaria joined NATO in 2004.
Very nice. I am amused by the antimatter universe Nordic block.
I accept the weird northeastern border for Poland, but I do find it odd that in splitting up Prussia Poland gets quite a bit of traditionally German Silesia, but almost none of ethnically quite Polish (at least OTL) Posen.
How much of OTLs 1914 Ottoman Empire in Asia does the Federation of Islamic States control?
Delightful. Where does this alternate continent hang its hat?
WIP. I decided to skip Ecuador - Congo because I was having trouble with making Dinosaur Denmark distinctive enough from Super Sweden and 'Normous Norway, and coming up with convincing wanks for Cuba, Congo (Brazzaville) and Costa Rica was giving me a headache. So Colombia-Canada: may be a second China for Maximum Red China later, may leave for the next map. Wish there was a 2 meter sea level rise basemap with rivers and not so damn much stuff to erase. 😓
Planet of Hats
Donor
Aside from what's pictured: Anatolia, Syria, Lebanon, Palestine/Israel and the northern part of Iraq (e.g. Mosul area). The rest largely melted away under successive waves of nationalism. No Sauds this time, but there are far too many sharks circling the Ottomans for them not to be bitten a few times.Very nice. I am amused by the antimatter universe Nordic block.
I accept the weird northeastern border for Poland, but I do find it odd that in splitting up Prussia Poland gets quite a bit of traditionally German Silesia, but almost none of ethnically quite Polish (at least OTL) Posen.
How much of OTLs 1914 Ottoman Empire in Asia does the Federation of Islamic States control?
I admit to not knowing nearly as much about the fine details of post-Napoleonic European demographics as I do obscure facts about Muslim Spain.
Yep. There are some other influences that will be clearer after the map is completed.
This is the completed map for the map Game COAAW: Red Star over the Rhine by @Blacklister . The main premise was that World War 1 ended with a major communist revolution across Western Europe which saw the creation of the Fraternal Union and the eventual spread of communism.
Among other thins the most of the European Monarchs went to their colonies or South America and created government in exiles with the situation in Argentina ending with the Italians taking over. The US eventually fell into a Second American Civil War and has continued to be divided although the USA(Nationalists) in the Plains are trying to fix that leading to an increase in tensions.
As far as the major powers the nations of Russia, China, India, the Fraternal Union and Japan are the main powers in the world with their influence being felt across the world although only Japan, Russia, India and the Fraternal Union have major influence outside of their borders.
Overall you should check it out if you want even more Alternate History weirdness.
The normal tricolor flag probably sounds good to me, though we could say that bringing back the normal tricolor is probably a recent decision the government made and was controversial outside of the country's borders (OTOH, the people in Russia were cheering at a "properly" Russian flag and anthem once more). On that note, we could have the tricolor variant be the one Russia initially flew after the fall of Communism IOTL before they changed it to the current variant. Alternatively, we could have it very much be a Federal Republic of Yugoslavia/State Union of Serbia and Montenegro situation (before its cessasion of existence in 2006) in which while the flag is woefully unpopular, no one can agree on a replacement flag for it.
Last edited:
Honestly, I just have some sort of semi-irrational dislike for reddit. But yeah, I should probably start posting there.
Babirusa meets narwhal, essentially.
Well, standard for Atlantis. So standard that it's basically just Athanasius Kircher's map.
Since the Yugoslav Wars were far more destructive ITTL (thus generating more resentment towards America in Macedonia and Serbia) I think your assumptions are mostly correct.
The issue of Bulgaria is a thorny one for the Tolstoyists. When they moved in there was t much resistance and the Bulgarians were treated as “equal partners.” However, by the 2040s, they’ve also been cynically promoting Macedonian interests within their Bulgarian province after increasing support for Bulgar separatism.
I did envision increasing tension, as the Tolstoyists back Christian Anarchists in Albania and Bosnia whilst Turkey provides covert assistance to Chechen and Ukrainian underground groups.
POD is 1993 when Boris Yeltsin dies during the Russian constitutional crisis. Russia has a quick succession of ineffectual strongmen eventually culminating in the rise of the Tolstoyists. NATO collapses sometime during the 2010s after the Second Korean War, and the two primary movers in this world are Tolstoyist Eurasia and an isolationist - and increasingly authoritarian - USA, with a major non-aligned bloc forming in Africa by the 2060s.
Reddit is not always great but is good enough when you're interested in weird niche subjects such as spec evo, but I can understand the reluctance toward it
Honestly, same.
But for me it's 100% full rational hatred of reddit.
OHOHO so there IS quite a bit of Balkan lore. Love to see that.
Oh I should mention I've mostly moved on from Alternate History. This is a map I made for a sort of fantasty world I've been cooking up. I need to get the elevations settled (I want there to be a massive Tibet-style plateau somewhere) but it's a cool excuse for me to worldbuild without feeling particularly stuck to historical plausibility.